T Nation

Former Cancer Patient with Question for Vets

Hi Guys,

Brand new here, needed some advice and seems like alot of knowledgeable dudes here… I beat cancer ( Hodgkins ) 10 years ago but the six months of chemo was Tough! I have had a real hard time gaining muscle since then regardless of diet and killing it in the gym. I have also struggled with anxiety attacks and some depression too since being cured. I had just 2 questions.

  1. Would 10-12 weeks of Test Cypinate 200mg a week with HCG shots lower my natural Test levels forever after my cycle or would they bounce back quick?

  2. I read that TRT patients say it helped there depression and anxiety but was wondering if the Test could possibly make it worse?

I’m not wanting but 10LBS of lean mass so that’s why I would only want 200mg a week. Needless to say I’m scared of bad side effects or getting sick or damaging my body having been through hell and back. I know there’s no SAFE cycle but this one seems low risk and get me what I need, but I know nothing compared to some of you so plz help me out if I’m way off on this.

See alot of guys asking for blood work so
Total test 580
Free Test 96.3 pg/ml
PSA 0.51

Thanks for any input

200mg/week is far too low.

Do 8-12weeks of 500mg/week Test (any ester) +/- Adex +/- hCG, with a 4 week PCT of 40mg/day nolvadex the first 2 weeks then 20mg/day the next 2 weeks. You wont gain ‘too much muscle’, and your natural test production will recover 100%, dont worry

[quote]GGlife wrote:
200mg/week is far too low.

Do 8-12weeks of 500mg/week Test (any ester) +/- Adex +/- hCG, with a 4 week PCT of 40mg/day nolvadex the first 2 weeks then 20mg/day the next 2 weeks. You wont gain ‘too much muscle’, and your natural test production will recover 100%, dont worry[/quote]

How can you make that last statement without knowing anything about the person other than his current T levels and that he had cancer. Please. It’s hard to say something more irresponsible than that. But you wont be paying anyone’s medical bills but your own, so who cares right?

OP I’ll give you my opinion in the morning.

Assuming the OP hasn’t hid any medical conditions which may impact upon his HPA axis recovery (and seeing as how he disclosed his cancer I consider this a bit unlikely), I believe my statement holds true

If I am wrong I would love to be enlightened, so that I don’t give out bad advice in the future

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GG I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you checked the OP’s hub to see that he isn’t a teenager. But on that same note how can you guarantee that a 36yr old man will definitely recover 100% from a 9-14 weeks (your suggestion) of HPTA suppression? I don’t know, it just seems like a pretty bold statement to me.

Tbaggs: I think 200mg/wk of T is a complete waste. You will definitely shut down your natural T production and will not be adding much to it. The decision is ultimately up to you but my line of thought is that you will be supressed from 200mg/wk the same amount as you will be from a larger dose, like 400-500mg/wk. The side effects of 400mg/wk compared to 200mg/wk are also negligible. You’d probably need to use a slightly higher amount of Arimidex.

To give yourself the best chance of recovery you will want to run a short cycle. The longer someone remains suppressed the harder it becomes to recover. 6 weeks of test prop at 400mg/wk + AI + PCT (hCG optional) will definitely be enough to achieve your goals if you eat enough.

With all that said I can not comment on the depression and anxiety problems. Your test levels are not that low, not low enough for most doctors to put you on TRT so it’s hard to apply that scenario to your case. Some people get depressed when coming off of a cycle. Some people get anxiety on very high doses of androgens. This is a very individual thing and I don’t know if theres a way to predict what will happen in that regard.

There is also the option of looking into the “2 week cycles” there are a few threads about them. You should search for them and check it out.

Thanks for the kind and helpful remarks… To answer some of the things asked for you guys to further help I will post from what I remember was asked.

Diet: I eat pretty much the same everyday, sorta picky, so I will post my usual diet.
Breakfast 4 scrambled eggs ( 2 yolks ) 3 pieces turkey bacon Banana 8 oz OJ

morning snack protein shake

Lunch chicken breast or turkey sanwich one veggie pretzels

mid day snack protien shake and yogurt

dinner chicken breast or steak rice broccali and a salad

So I eat 5 times a day spread out every 3 hours… Does this look good?

Also, I’m 5’11 187 and 15% BF. 36 yrs old

Again, I’m not wanting to be 215-220 and a monster. Just 195-197 and ripped. That extra 10 pounds has proved impossible after that chemo though… I was 185 before becoming ill 12 years ago and could gain lean mass no problem. My doctor has agreed to give me a test cyp prescription but only for 200 mg and a hcg.

He said that a few months of even that dose would give 10 lbs no problem. It’s not his area of expertise though so that’s why I asked you guys. Main concern was that I know it will shut down my natural test and wanted to be sure it will bounce back afterwords. Not worth 10 lbs of lean mass to me if I’m gonna pay the price afterwords of screwed up hormone levels and a rollercoaster with my nerves and anxiety issues.

I’m thankful for all your opinions and help with this…

Tony

For the benefit of our more fastidious senior members I will make a correction to my advice:

tbaggs2, do 6-12weeks of 500mg/week Test (any ester) +/- Adex +/- hCG, with a 4 to 12 week PCT of nolvadex/clomid. You wont gain ‘too much muscle’, and your natural test production has a 99% chance of recovering to 100% of pre-cycle levels over the 6 months following your cycle.

Personally I don’t see that your lymphoma in remission/cured is going to be a cause for delayed HPA-axis recovery, but then this is not exactly an area of common knowledge in the medical community, so I am just making an educated guess here.

I think what the OP wanted to know was whether the benefits of a cycle would outweigh the risks, to which I would have to say that yes, I think a cycle would be fairly safe and have a very positive impact on your life.

Thank you GGlife… Yes risk vs. rewards in a nutshell as you said. Its not the Lymphona that caused the problems it was the chemo… That stuff is pure poison to your body and has a terrible effect on it.

As my unsympathetic Doc told me though when I bitched bout how bad it sucks he said " Tony you got 2 choices, do the chemo, or die. I took choice one of course but it was really hard on my body…

Anymore more follow up advise from the other guys in this thread?

Bushidobadboy diet posted as requested…

I did the cycle BONEZ is refering to for 4wks. All I can say is that it was a very smooth ride with little to no sides. For myself, I was up a solid 10lbs personnally.

the only note I may want to add is that if you are at 187 15%, want to get to 195 “ripped”, it will take much more than 10LBM, and a drop of fat… just a side note to keep in mind.

Has additional test in your system as when you are on cycle ever been linked as a growth product of cancer cells? or is that a stupid absoulutly irrelavant question and there is absoulty no link between the two statements?

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This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

[quote]All2ez wrote:
Has additional test in your system as when you are on cycle ever been linked as a growth product of cancer cells? or is that a stupid absoulutly irrelavant question and there is absoulty no link between the two statements?[/quote]

Just prostate cancer

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Hey brother,

I am also a cancer survivor (rhabdomiosarcoma) who has dealt with TRT. There are a few factors to consider which depend on what particular cocktail of chemo you were given as well as your age during treatment. Shoot me a PM if you want to talk, I think that I have some experience/ insight which might help you out!

[quote]bushidobadboy wrote:

[quote]GGlife wrote:

[quote]All2ez wrote:
Has additional test in your system as when you are on cycle ever been linked as a growth product of cancer cells? or is that a stupid absoulutly irrelavant question and there is absoulty no link between the two statements?[/quote]

Just prostate cancer[/quote]
I think you’ll find that current thinking leans towards estrogen and DHT, not test as the growth-promoting agents for both benign and malignant prostate hyperplasia.

BBB[/quote]

But not so much in this country, or at least our GPs… My uncle has prostate cancer and now a nice pair of bitch tits…

[quote]plateau wrote:
But not so much in this country, or at least our GPs… My uncle has prostate cancer and now a nice pair of bitch tits…[/quote]

What happened, if you don’t mind me asking?