T Nation

Flyes: Worthless?

Just a quick question. Does anybody out there get anything from flyes? Personally, they just don’t do jack for me, other than put a lot of stress on my shoulders. Oh, how I loathe them… I guess I’m bringing this up because they’re in King’s upper body program, and I hate them so. Anyone else?

Geez, Ike, I gotta show you the way I perform flyes. I’ve been doing them this way since, well, when the Masters Mr. America winner back in '86 showed me. Wow, makes the flyes worthy, in my book.

I’m not big on them either, I’d much rather do Decline Benchers w/ my Powerblocks. Burp, uh, f’n Hansen’s Diet soda rules. I really despise the concentration curls. I can’t even concentrate when I do them. I sit there and think “what the fuck kind of spastic yokel exercise is this?” Then I get all depressed and it ruins my zone flow. I beleive next week I’ll replace them with those curls in the latest “Heavy Metal”, those look promisingly cool. Maybe I’ll replace the flyes with banging my head into the wall until I pass out.

MBE: “Invading NY with his T-cell since 0088.”

-Eric

Patricia! That’s not nice. Please tell us how you perform flyes!

One word of advice about flyes. Find your safe ROM on this exercise, which might not be what the full ROM that you can perform. To me this is just a bit before my upper arms are parallel to the floor, anymore than that and I’ll have serious rotator cuff pain for the next few days.

Restless: I’m a visual person as well as kinetic. Didn’t want to muck up what I do via a clumsy, overly wordy discription. I’ll see if I can come up with something to post…

And I wouldn't call flyes "worthless" - it really is dependent on what your goal is. I haven't performed flyes in awhile, I'm more concerned with picking up my flat bench and incline presses at the moment.

if performing flyes puts excess stress on the shoulder girdle, maybe you need to strengthen your shoulders…or pre-exhaust your chest first. i’d try supersetting most if not all of your chest exercises. maybe as follows…bench presses consisting of several sets pyramiding up then superset incline presses with chair pushups strip-downs for 3-4 sets then finish up supersetting d.b. bench presses with flat bench fly’s. this will pump a lot of blood into the muscle. let me know what you think.

Ya, but only if I go really heavy which is hell on my shoulders. It’s an excercise I avoid. Actually I just recently saw an orthopoedic surgeon here in Canada who is supossed to be one of the top experts on shoulders. He tells me despite being stocky and heavily muscled, I have genetically loose shoulders, which is leading to my tendonitis. Basically the only chest excercises I can do right now are db presses and the hammer strength incline press.

Might as well throw some more fuel on the fire! :slight_smile: Another of the big reason I don’t like them is because they’re so nonfunctional. I guess I’ve always neglected chest though, unlike the ‘average’ trainer, cause in the end the pecs don’t show up in real world activities nearly as much as say, the shoulder. Triceps, however, are strong (BW+135lbs x6, dips), cause those boys are functional as hell. Probably the only reason I bench halfway decently.

Snakething… shoulder integrity is not a problem here, I’ve behind-the-neck military’d 110% BW. There’s no way my pecs are overpowering my shoulders. :wink:

sorry, i didn’t mean to be critical…what i meant by pre-exhausting your chest was by doing flye’s last and by supersetting them as well as the previous exercises, that would force you to use a lighter weight when performimg flyes, thus maybe not putting as much strain on your delts

Restless, that’s some damn good advice. Everyone should read it about four times running.


MBE, I have to say that you have achieved a new apogee of hormone-laden silliness. That was classic, man!


Finally, I’m going to out on a limb here and bet that what Patricia is talking about is an exercise that we called “Butter-flyes” back in the day. Basically, there are three phases to the movement. First, you start in regular fly position but instead of lowering the DBs out in a more-or-less perpendicular plane to your torso, you lower them at about 45 degrees away from your body above the plane of your shoulders (and maybe even your head, depending on how flexible you are); then (2) “scoop” the dumbells back toward your feet so that you end up in the same bottom position as you would with a regular fly; then (3) return the DBs to the start position in the usual manner. Hits the upper pecs a LOT more than regular flyes, even if you’re using a horizontal bench. (Did I get it right, Patricia?)

What poundage?s are you using? I would think if your shoulder hurts you are prolly going much too heavy. I use Flyes as a Shaping tool at the end of my chest workouts. Light weight, High volume, super strict. Just my 2cents,

C

Don’t worry about it, dude. Constructive advice/citicism is -always- appreciated. I think you’re onto a good idea about prefatigue and supersetting. Something I’ll have to play around with.

I find them very useful for stretching before a workout.

My favorite chest lift.

I remember reading a study in which cross-section hypertrophy using compound movements or compound movements w/ supplementary isolation exercises was compared. Apparently, there was no difference between the groups.

Almost! - I begin and end in the typical flye position. But, I’m thinking of trying out the “above the plane of your shoulders”. Interesting. AND I also emphasize the pinky finger as I bring the dumbbells together at the top of the movement - you know, for added “umph” to the exercise.

BUT thanks, char for describing this exercise! Mucho bettero than I ever could do!

I don’t think they’re worthless. Like almost anything else, they have their place.

I just wanted to chime and and share something I do as a finisher. On my last set of dumbbell presses, I like to use a slightly lighter weight, and allow the negative part of the motion to be a fly. I get an amazing pump, and I feel it's a great way to partially work flyes in. Hope this helps.

Since generally speaking you can handle more weight eccentrically; that is a very nice tactic- may use it with Christina next training session.

That’s terrible. Just…just plain, terrible.

:slight_smile: