T Nation

First Time Muay Thai

Hello guys,

I need some pep talk here. After more than 10 years of power training (5x week) some friends asked me to join them for some Muay Thai. To clear things out, I’m 6f and 237 pounds and I want to do Muay Thai for the cardio and technique, but powertraining will always be my primary sport. I’m almost 33 years old and I know I’m very lumpish.

So today I got the first lesson, but all the other people were advanced fighters (many years of training).

The problem was that after a few (read 3) low kicks, my legs were hurting so much I had to ask them to back down a little on the legs. Now after training I’m sitting here in agony :slight_smile:

My question is: does it hurt so much because of the muscle mass in my legs or am I just a cry baby (in before trolls)? Is there a way I can “train” this outside of the muay thai lessons?

Thanks and kudos to all you fighting guys. I thought pain in the gym was pain… It isn’t.

Let me make sure I understand what you are saying: You went to your FIRST class and you sparred full contact? No lessons? No fundamentals in Stance? Guard? Blocking? Striking?, is that correct? Just walked right into the gym and start fighting?

If that is correct: Then your “friends” and the instructor responsible are nothing but assholes. No instructor worth a shit, would ever allow a novice to be treated in such a stupid manner. You were used as a punching bag. Disgraceful and extremely unprofessional. Find a better place to learn and train.

I agree with Idaho. Throwing people into hard sparring from the get go is not only going to discourage most of them from continuing (admittedly a few will stick it out and will get tough and improve to a point, but there are better ways of doing things), but it also conveys a general lack of concern for the well being of beginners/new comers. Find a school where they are going to teach you what to do in sparring and give you at least a little while to hone those skills before actually testing them on a fully resisting opponent. And even then you should only go to full contact/hard sparring if you can remain composed and technical while doing so.

Agreed, assuming this went down how it sounds. That is not a “lesson” at all. No untrained person is likely to stand up to hard leg kicks. Go looking around on youtube and you can find plenty of examples of this. Subjecting a brand new person to that has no training value and almost sounds more like a case of “let’s show the big guy how hard we are an how tough he isn’t”.

I seem to remember in a thread where one of the more serious Thai fighters on here was commenting that bigger legs seemed to make people more susceptible to leg kicks. In your case, this is beside the point. You shouldn’t be taking a beating like that so soon in the first place.

Be honest. I’ve boxed (not MT) for years. And when you fight someone that is much better than you, just ask them to take it a bit slow. They will understand. We have all been there.

I was also thrown into sparring in my FIRST lesson. The thing is this: you get conditioned to pain. It takes some time to getting used to a strike against your face/body, both physicly as mentally. After a few broken noses, a liver punch, and a ko - a jab to the face does nothing anymore lol.

Good luck!

[quote]idaho wrote:
Let me make sure I understand what you are saying: You went to your FIRST class and you sparred full contact? No lessons? No fundamentals in Stance? Guard? Blocking? Striking?, is that correct? Just walked right into the gym and start fighting?

If that is correct: Then your “friends” and the instructor responsible are nothing but assholes. No instructor worth a shit, would ever allow a novice to be treated in such a stupid manner. You were used as a punching bag. Disgraceful and extremely unprofessional. Find a better place to learn and train. [/quote]

Well, we were practicing combos against eachother (hitting on gloves) and the legs were covered with protectors, so it wasn’t actually sparring. Although the low kicks were on target.

My idea of learning a fighting discipline is first a few weeks of learning how to throw punches and how to do (low) kicks against a bag or so. Learning the rotation, the foot work etc.

What you see now is learning 5-6 hit combos and those are like 3 too many for a beginner.

Or perhaps I’m a sissy :wink:

[quote]Dahollow wrote:

[quote]idaho wrote:
Let me make sure I understand what you are saying: You went to your FIRST class and you sparred full contact? No lessons? No fundamentals in Stance? Guard? Blocking? Striking?, is that correct? Just walked right into the gym and start fighting?

If that is correct: Then your “friends” and the instructor responsible are nothing but assholes. No instructor worth a shit, would ever allow a novice to be treated in such a stupid manner. You were used as a punching bag. Disgraceful and extremely unprofessional. Find a better place to learn and train. [/quote]

Well, we were practicing combos against eachother (hitting on gloves) and the legs were covered with protectors, so it wasn’t actually sparring. Although the low kicks were on target.

My idea of learning a fighting discipline is first a few weeks of learning how to throw punches and how to do (low) kicks against a bag or so. Learning the rotation, the foot work etc.

What you see now is learning 5-6 hit combos and those are like 3 too many for a beginner.

Or perhaps I’m a sissy ;)[/quote]

Well, that is a little different than what I personally pictured reading your first post. Leg kicks suck. For some people they suck worse than they do for others. Over time they should grow to suck much less through intelligent conditioning and your learning how to better absorb the impact. They will, however, continue to suck in my experience.

I still don’t believe you should be mucking around with combos in your first lesson. You should be shown the training circuit, be shown the proper punching and kicking technique. If you already understand that stuff or if you get the hang of it quickly, then you can go into pad work, really going at the bag and maybe some light sparring with the trainer when the trainer doesn’t try to take your head (or legs) off.

You need to get the rhythm of the gym and the trainer should guide you into that. If you’re getting hacked in half by much more advanced fighters then you’re not learning anything. And that’s a great way to get injured too.

EDIT: Pain from training does eventually subside over time. Especially from kicking and blocking with your shin. Always wrap your hands properly, because bust up knuckles not only suck the next day but could aggravate you as you grow older. And as a courtesy to your sparring partners and your hands, Use 16oz gloves.

I don’t want to discourage you my friend… but learning muay thai techniques for you will be just waisting time… with your body weight and experience lifting heavy weights forget about MT… However, you can still be a decent fighter on the street if you really want to, you just have to find your own style that suits your huge muscular body… basically all you need just to be mean, practice defend your chin with elbows, and a quick explosive move forward in order to grab your opponent, then headbutt and by using your big mass and strength take him down on the ground and so on…

actually, some aikido lessons might also help you, I know some huge bouncers have been taught basic aikido stuff quite successfully. While sambo, BJJ, boxing, muay thai isn’t for you… but you can still win against them in the street fight with no rules, especially if they are at least 45 pounds lighter than you. You just have to have a fighters spirit in yourself and be mean when it needed… Powerlifting and bodybuilding aren’t that useless for a street fight as some people would think, you just have to be a fighter in yourself and have desire to crush your opponent. But in any circumstances don’t go to exchange punches or kicks - that will be unpleasant experience for you. Just ask your friend to punch you a little and kick you, so you can practice that elbow defense and slightly get used to kicks.

Hope my advice will will help you.

[quote]Antonio. B wrote:
I don’t want to discourage you my friend… but learning muay thai techniques for you will be just waisting time… with your body weight and experience lifting heavy weights forget about MT… However, you can still be a decent fighter on the street if you really want to, you just have to find your own style that suits your huge muscular body… basically all you need just to be mean, practice defend your chin with elbows, and a quick explosive move forward in order to grab your opponent, then headbutt and by using your big mass and strength take him down on the ground and so on…

actually, some aikido lessons might also help you, I know some huge bouncers have been taught basic aikido stuff quite successfully. While sambo, BJJ, boxing, muay thai isn’t for you… but you can still win against them in the street fight with no rules, especially if they are at least 45 pounds lighter than you. You just have to have a fighters spirit in yourself and be mean when it needed… Powerlifting and bodybuilding aren’t that useless for a street fight as some people would think, you just have to be a fighter in yourself and have desire to crush your opponent. But in any circumstances don’t go to exchange punches or kicks - that will be unpleasant experience for you. Just ask your friend to punch you a little and kick you, so you can practice that elbow defense and slightly get used to kicks.

Hope my advice will will help you. [/quote]

He’s not trying to become a street fighter, he started MT out of interest and for conditioning purposes. But good to see you read the initial post.

[quote]nighthawkz wrote:

[quote]Antonio. B wrote:
I don’t want to discourage you my friend… but learning muay thai techniques for you will be just waisting time… with your body weight and experience lifting heavy weights forget about MT… However, you can still be a decent fighter on the street if you really want to, you just have to find your own style that suits your huge muscular body… basically all you need just to be mean, practice defend your chin with elbows, and a quick explosive move forward in order to grab your opponent, then headbutt and by using your big mass and strength take him down on the ground and so on…

actually, some aikido lessons might also help you, I know some huge bouncers have been taught basic aikido stuff quite successfully. While sambo, BJJ, boxing, muay thai isn’t for you… but you can still win against them in the street fight with no rules, especially if they are at least 45 pounds lighter than you. You just have to have a fighters spirit in yourself and be mean when it needed… Powerlifting and bodybuilding aren’t that useless for a street fight as some people would think, you just have to be a fighter in yourself and have desire to crush your opponent. But in any circumstances don’t go to exchange punches or kicks - that will be unpleasant experience for you. Just ask your friend to punch you a little and kick you, so you can practice that elbow defense and slightly get used to kicks.

Hope my advice will will help you. [/quote]

He’s not trying to become a street fighter, he started MT out of interest and for conditioning purposes. But good to see you read the initial post.
[/quote]

I wrote him my advice about MT at the very beginning of my replay. If he doesn’t wan’t to hear anything about his possible style and training that suits his body the best for the possible street confrontation, that is fine, he doesn’t have to. But I am almost sure he will appreciate my thoughts. As far as I know, most men want to be ready for that situation when you have to fight on the street… While there are many more ways for safer and more pleasant conditioning exercises than muay thai.

[quote]nighthawkz wrote:

[quote]Antonio. B wrote:
I don’t want to discourage you my friend… but learning muay thai techniques for you will be just waisting time… with your body weight and experience lifting heavy weights forget about MT… However, you can still be a decent fighter on the street if you really want to, you just have to find your own style that suits your huge muscular body… basically all you need just to be mean, practice defend your chin with elbows, and a quick explosive move forward in order to grab your opponent, then headbutt and by using your big mass and strength take him down on the ground and so on…

actually, some aikido lessons might also help you, I know some huge bouncers have been taught basic aikido stuff quite successfully. While sambo, BJJ, boxing, muay thai isn’t for you… but you can still win against them in the street fight with no rules, especially if they are at least 45 pounds lighter than you. You just have to have a fighters spirit in yourself and be mean when it needed… Powerlifting and bodybuilding aren’t that useless for a street fight as some people would think, you just have to be a fighter in yourself and have desire to crush your opponent. But in any circumstances don’t go to exchange punches or kicks - that will be unpleasant experience for you. Just ask your friend to punch you a little and kick you, so you can practice that elbow defense and slightly get used to kicks.

Hope my advice will will help you. [/quote]

He’s not trying to become a street fighter, he started MT out of interest and for conditioning purposes. But good to see you read the initial post.
[/quote]

Indeed. Not everybody takes up combat sports because they want to be the baddest mo fo around in the highly unlikely event of a street fight.

Here is a link to a thread that opens with a video that is one of the more inspirational, uplifting things I’ve seen posted on this board. I would encourage Dahollow and anyone else in need of a “pep talk” to give it a watch,

Cliche as it sounds, at the end of the day the real battles are fought and won inside ourselves.

[quote]idaho wrote:
Let me make sure I understand what you are saying: You went to your FIRST class and you sparred full contact? No lessons? No fundamentals in Stance? Guard? Blocking? Striking?, is that correct? Just walked right into the gym and start fighting?

If that is correct: Then your “friends” and the instructor responsible are nothing but assholes. No instructor worth a shit, would ever allow a novice to be treated in such a stupid manner. You were used as a punching bag. Disgraceful and extremely unprofessional. Find a better place to learn and train. [/quote]

Could not agree more. Even with your past experience and being physically strong your “friends/teammates” should have spent time on the basics (jab, cross, teep/push/round kicks etc), then combos/drills. I think having a good instructor is integral part of how we learn to love our sport - for whatever reasons you’re doing it for.

[quote]Antonio. B wrote:
I don’t want to discourage you my friend… but learning muay thai techniques for you will be just waisting time… with your body weight and experience lifting heavy weights forget about MT… However, you can still be a decent fighter on the street if you really want to, you just have to find your own style that suits your huge muscular body… basically all you need just to be mean, practice defend your chin with elbows, and a quick explosive move forward in order to grab your opponent, then headbutt and by using your big mass and strength take him down on the ground and so on…

actually, some aikido lessons might also help you, I know some huge bouncers have been taught basic aikido stuff quite successfully. While sambo, BJJ, boxing, muay thai isn’t for you… but you can still win against them in the street fight with no rules, especially if they are at least 45 pounds lighter than you. You just have to have a fighters spirit in yourself and be mean when it needed… Powerlifting and bodybuilding aren’t that useless for a street fight as some people would think, you just have to be a fighter in yourself and have desire to crush your opponent. But in any circumstances don’t go to exchange punches or kicks - that will be unpleasant experience for you. Just ask your friend to punch you a little and kick you, so you can practice that elbow defense and slightly get used to kicks.

Hope my advice will will help you. [/quote]

Thanks, but I’m not into streetfights. I’m a laid back guy. Sure I have my size, but I’ve never actually used it against someone. Next to that, I can’t afford a criminal record :wink:

In MMA ground work, I can indeed use my bodyweight and strength more. But I’m not a quitter and I’ll try to find me a better partner to practice with.

Thanks for the info guys :slight_smile:

[quote]batman730 wrote:

Indeed. Not everybody takes up combat sports because they want to be the baddest mo fo around in the highly unlikely event of a street fight.

Here is a link to a thread that opens with a video that is one of the more inspirational, uplifting things I’ve seen posted on this board. I would encourage Dahollow and anyone else in need of a “pep talk” to give it a watch,

Cliche as it sounds, at the end of the day the real battles are fought and won inside ourselves. [/quote]

Thanks man! Very moving to see this guy.

[quote]Dahollow wrote:

[quote]Antonio. B wrote:
I don’t want to discourage you my friend… but learning muay thai techniques for you will be just waisting time… with your body weight and experience lifting heavy weights forget about MT… However, you can still be a decent fighter on the street if you really want to, you just have to find your own style that suits your huge muscular body… basically all you need just to be mean, practice defend your chin with elbows, and a quick explosive move forward in order to grab your opponent, then headbutt and by using your big mass and strength take him down on the ground and so on…

actually, some aikido lessons might also help you, I know some huge bouncers have been taught basic aikido stuff quite successfully. While sambo, BJJ, boxing, muay thai isn’t for you… but you can still win against them in the street fight with no rules, especially if they are at least 45 pounds lighter than you. You just have to have a fighters spirit in yourself and be mean when it needed… Powerlifting and bodybuilding aren’t that useless for a street fight as some people would think, you just have to be a fighter in yourself and have desire to crush your opponent. But in any circumstances don’t go to exchange punches or kicks - that will be unpleasant experience for you. Just ask your friend to punch you a little and kick you, so you can practice that elbow defense and slightly get used to kicks.

Hope my advice will will help you. [/quote]

Thanks, but I’m not into streetfights. I’m a laid back guy. Sure I have my size, but I’ve never actually used it against someone. Next to that, I can’t afford a criminal record :wink:

In MMA ground work, I can indeed use my bodyweight and strength more. But I’m not a quitter and I’ll try to find me a better partner to practice with.

Thanks for the info guys :slight_smile:
[/quote]

That’s fine:) I am not into street fights, and I can’t afford to have a conviction either. Probably you are the lucky one living very safe and peaceful life… It just happens, wether I am somewhere in Europe or in America I come across a lot of young aggressive drug addicts who can afford to attack me, and who can afford to have a criminal record indeed, and most of them would be even proud of this… and I try not to go out late in the evening on weekends… maybe because I am just not very big guy 5’11/180…??? I don’t know… probably they would not even try to attack you, I don’t know… Sorry for my advice…

[quote]Pigeonkak wrote:
I still don’t believe you should be mucking around with combos in your first lesson. You should be shown the training circuit, be shown the proper punching and kicking technique. If you already understand that stuff or if you get the hang of it quickly, then you can go into pad work, really going at the bag and maybe some light sparring with the trainer when the trainer doesn’t try to take your head (or legs) off.

You need to get the rhythm of the gym and the trainer should guide you into that. If you’re getting hacked in half by much more advanced fighters then you’re not learning anything. And that’s a great way to get injured too.

EDIT: Pain from training does eventually subside over time. Especially from kicking and blocking with your shin. Always wrap your hands properly, because bust up knuckles not only suck the next day but could aggravate you as you grow older. And as a courtesy to your sparring partners and your hands, Use 16oz gloves. [/quote]

x2

I only speak from a boxing background, but no trainer I know would have a beginner doing anything more from blocking and throwing single shots in partner drills for a long time - probably at least a month or so of regular training, before combos are introduced. Even these are done under controlled circumstances, and you wouldn’t be doing anything until you had been shown how to throw and defend correctly.

There is no shame in not fancying another go at something like that. I would never have made it 14 years in the fight game if I had been beaten on like that by guys who should know better. Personally, I don’t need that kind of aggro in my life. If you feel the same, you wouldn’t be any kind of pussy for finding a different sport for conditioning. If you like the physical, BJJ is pretty cool, from the little experience I have of it, and you can go pretty hard without that much danger.

[quote]batman730 wrote:

[quote]nighthawkz wrote:

[quote]Antonio. B wrote:
I don’t want to discourage you my friend… but learning muay thai techniques for you will be just waisting time… with your body weight and experience lifting heavy weights forget about MT… However, you can still be a decent fighter on the street if you really want to, you just have to find your own style that suits your huge muscular body… basically all you need just to be mean, practice defend your chin with elbows, and a quick explosive move forward in order to grab your opponent, then headbutt and by using your big mass and strength take him down on the ground and so on…

actually, some aikido lessons might also help you, I know some huge bouncers have been taught basic aikido stuff quite successfully. While sambo, BJJ, boxing, muay thai isn’t for you… but you can still win against them in the street fight with no rules, especially if they are at least 45 pounds lighter than you. You just have to have a fighters spirit in yourself and be mean when it needed… Powerlifting and bodybuilding aren’t that useless for a street fight as some people would think, you just have to be a fighter in yourself and have desire to crush your opponent. But in any circumstances don’t go to exchange punches or kicks - that will be unpleasant experience for you. Just ask your friend to punch you a little and kick you, so you can practice that elbow defense and slightly get used to kicks.

Hope my advice will will help you. [/quote]

He’s not trying to become a street fighter, he started MT out of interest and for conditioning purposes. But good to see you read the initial post.
[/quote]

Indeed. Not everybody takes up combat sports because they want to be the baddest mo fo around in the highly unlikely event of a street fight.

Here is a link to a thread that opens with a video that is one of the more inspirational, uplifting things I’ve seen posted on this board. I would encourage Dahollow and anyone else in need of a “pep talk” to give it a watch,

Cliche as it sounds, at the end of the day the real battles are fought and won inside ourselves. [/quote]

Oh yea:) all pussies and homosexuals also fight their battles inside themselves:)… while the fighters inside fight with himself is a completely different thing…

[quote]Antonio. B wrote:
I don’t want to discourage you my friend… but learning muay thai techniques for you will be just waisting time… with your body weight and experience lifting heavy weights forget about MT… However, you can still be a decent fighter on the street if you really want to, you just have to find your own style that suits your huge muscular body… basically all you need just to be mean, practice defend your chin with elbows, and a quick explosive move forward in order to grab your opponent, then headbutt and by using your big mass and strength take him down on the ground and so on…

actually, some aikido lessons might also help you, I know some huge bouncers have been taught basic aikido stuff quite successfully. While sambo, BJJ, boxing, muay thai isn’t for you… but you can still win against them in the street fight with no rules, especially if they are at least 45 pounds lighter than you. You just have to have a fighters spirit in yourself and be mean when it needed… Powerlifting and bodybuilding aren’t that useless for a street fight as some people would think, you just have to be a fighter in yourself and have desire to crush your opponent. But in any circumstances don’t go to exchange punches or kicks - that will be unpleasant experience for you. Just ask your friend to punch you a little and kick you, so you can practice that elbow defense and slightly get used to kicks.

Hope my advice will will help you. [/quote]

What a HUMONGOUS crock of shit. Muay Thai techniques a waste for a big guy? where did you come up with this bullshit. Yeah Muay Thai has a few high kicks and stresses flexibility and speed but saying a big guy can’t learn this stuff is just plain dumb. There are people doing much harder martial arts and tricks at the op’s size.

Scott Adkins: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5FP7Y4Jy98 (Not as big as op but at his size does very hard kicks with little effort)

Michael Jai White: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQJ0_ecNXCA (Has been bigger than the op and does a great deal of Tae Kwon Do kicks effortlessly)

Lateef Crowder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDBnkf-hSjk (Not the same as the previous two guys he is more a stunt guy/tumbler)

I won’t even mention the countless heavy weight fighters in MMA that have all been trained in Muay Thai.

Please think and do research next time you spew out such garbage advice. Your way of thinking is why so many retards think bodybuilders are “unfunctional” whatever that even means.

[quote]Typhoon wrote:

[quote]Antonio. B wrote:
I don’t want to discourage you my friend… but learning muay thai techniques for you will be just waisting time… with your body weight and experience lifting heavy weights forget about MT… However, you can still be a decent fighter on the street if you really want to, you just have to find your own style that suits your huge muscular body… basically all you need just to be mean, practice defend your chin with elbows, and a quick explosive move forward in order to grab your opponent, then headbutt and by using your big mass and strength take him down on the ground and so on…

actually, some aikido lessons might also help you, I know some huge bouncers have been taught basic aikido stuff quite successfully. While sambo, BJJ, boxing, muay thai isn’t for you… but you can still win against them in the street fight with no rules, especially if they are at least 45 pounds lighter than you. You just have to have a fighters spirit in yourself and be mean when it needed… Powerlifting and bodybuilding aren’t that useless for a street fight as some people would think, you just have to be a fighter in yourself and have desire to crush your opponent. But in any circumstances don’t go to exchange punches or kicks - that will be unpleasant experience for you. Just ask your friend to punch you a little and kick you, so you can practice that elbow defense and slightly get used to kicks.

Hope my advice will will help you. [/quote]

What a HUMONGOUS crock of shit. Muay Thai techniques a waste for a big guy? where did you come up with this bullshit. Yeah Muay Thai has a few high kicks and stresses flexibility and speed but saying a big guy can’t learn this stuff is just plain dumb. There are people doing much harder martial arts and tricks at the op’s size.

Scott Adkins: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5FP7Y4Jy98 (Not as big as op but at his size does very hard kicks with little effort)

Michael Jai White: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQJ0_ecNXCA (Has been bigger than the op and does a great deal of Tae Kwon Do kicks effortlessly)

Lateef Crowder: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDBnkf-hSjk (Not the same as the previous two guys he is more a stunt guy/tumbler)

I won’t even mention the countless heavy weight fighters in MMA that have all been trained in Muay Thai.

Please think and do research next time you spew out such garbage advice. Your way of thinking is why so many retards think bodybuilders are “unfunctional” whatever that even means.
[/quote]

I apologize for my wrong advice… seems neither this guy, nor other people liked it:)… I will leave him to find out himself… and when he wins an official muay thai fight, I will apologize one more time… anyone can kick bags or push air and call it muay thai… and nowadays this combat sport in west culture has also been turned into commercial aerobic exercise to make it more suitable for pussies and homosexuals… it’s not necessarily bad… jus saying… But I still believe that bodybuilders are unfunctional:)) Heavyweight fighter with bigger muscles isn’t necessarily a bodybuilder though.