T Nation

First Time Cycle

I am 22 years old, 5’7, and weigh 180 and have been training for 5 years, two plagued by injuries though. Since it is my first cycle I just want to do it light, see how my body reacts and such.

Weeks 1-8 300mg/week of Deca-Durabolin

PCT: week 3-8 15 mg of nolvadex daily

I know its weak, but i believe I probably will put on some quality muscle with a great workout and diet. Plus it is my first cycle so i dont feel the need to go straight to the test yet.

I want to keep as much of the strength and mass as possible, so thats why im using PCT, alot of people say i dont even need it at all with such low levels of deca and for a shorter cycle. Would i keep even more gains if i incorporated HCG say 1500 IU, or is that just overboard with such a weak cycle?

Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

You are going to get flamed to fuck with that.

Deca alone is often frowned at as it will shut down your natural hormone production (as all AAS do) but it doesnt have the capability to ‘provide’ the DHT to replace the DHT you stopped converting from your endogenous t’rone… so loss of libido. You will feel pretty shit also… moody, down, emo. The first Deca cycle i did i went bare back for the first 3 weeks… then when i added proviron within a week it was like a whole different cycle… it (or a listed alternative) is a must.

I have run a number of deca only cycles… if you add proviron, this will give you the DHT that testosterone converts into, to assist with all the problems mentioned above.

You MUST use either Proviron, Masteron or Testosterone with deca… If you want just one compound then Proviron is fine…

50mg ED from day 1 right through till teh endz.

300mg of deca is not weak… it is a good cycle. 8 weeks is a good amount too… you should notice gains from week 3-4… I have gained nice from 6 weeks - but 12 is the best… but you better have a HPTA of steel for 12 weeks on deca.
It will give a quality muscle, a good builder - noticeable to you and particualrly others too… hard muscle to the touch, strength increase a little - enough to notice, AND i always found the gains relatively easy to keep with deca cycles.
You WILL need an aggressive PCT.

You should use 100iu of HCG EOD throughout the cycle from week 3-10.
Weeks 8-10 are just the hcg to keep the testes going, then add 40mg nolvadex for 2 weeks and taper that down 10mg a week over the next 3 weeks.
The HCG stops around week 9 or 10.

So to summarize:

Wk1-8 Nandrolone Decanoate 300mg/wk
Wk1-8 Proviron 50mg/d

Wk3-10 HCG 100iu EOD

Wk8-10 Nolvadex 10mg/d (optional)
Wk10-12 Nolvadex 40mg/d
Wk11 Nolvadex 30mg/d
Wk12 Nolvadex 20mg/d
Wk13 Nolvadex 10mg/d

I have done quite a number of these cycles and variations of - enough so as to genuinely lose count. they are a good cycle, with good lasting results. Do NOT shortcut the PCT or the proviron however, deca dick is no myth.

I may have missed something - so maybe someone else may like to input too…

Norma is a decent and relatively cheap product. Organon is the bee’s knee’s… i cant recommend spending the extra money on this product enough. 300mg of organon deca and proviron and you will be a very happy man indeed.
Sachet’s of Deca are usually about half the strength (results wise) of organon… so double the dose… the sachets are about 2/3 the strength of norma (results wise) so do the maths… basically, if it is a shitty UGL… you’ll need more… for top of the line Human grade oil - 200 to 400mg will be fine, alone for any novice or first timer.

Any help?

JJ

that was a lot of help thank you. So u think its a must to use another one of those substances, i really cant get away with just the deca for 8 weeks. What do u think of this update. By the way its a high quality human grade deca

Week 1-8: 300 mg/wk Deca-Durabolin
Wk1-8 Proviron 50mg/d

PCT:
wk 11: 2500 IU HCG + 20 mg Nolvadex daily
wk 12: 1500 IU HCG+ 20 mg Nolvadex daily
wk 13: 1500 IU HCG+ 20 mg Nolvadex daily
wk 14: 20 mg Nolvadex daily
wk 15: 20 mg Nolvadex daily
wk 16: 20 mg Nolvadex daily

I need an aggressive PCT with 300 mg/week of deca really? You think this will suffice?

Again comments or suggestions greatly appreciated.

no.

The HCG used like that wont help you much at all.

Used in small amounts, frequently during the cycle will keep the testes working throughout preventing atrophy and reducing the level of shutdown. Prevention is better than cure.

If you use HCG in that dose it is counter productive as it raises estrogen thru aromatase which then adds to suppression of the HPTA… plus using it post cycle is nowhere near as effective as during. Prevention…etc…

i have used it post cycle and it works great - until you stop the shit!!! Then it is back to square 1. HCG is, these days, used primarily during cycles - the old protocols of 1500-2500iu every 5 days for 2 - 3 weeks during PCT are over.
Used in that way, it is 1 step forward and 2 back.

As it is your first cycle, it is likely you will recover within 4 weeks with nolvadex use… But i am obliged to recommend the most effective method i know of using Deca alone. And the only extra product you will be using is the proviron.

What you actually end up doing is your business and your business alone - all i can do is give my opinion and swear occasionally.

Deca is a very long ester… but due to its depot in adipose it has metabolites that are released long after the cycle has ended. (no, not re-esterified RJ, i used the wrong word - sorry) In SOME individuals this causes an extended HPTA shutdown IME. Plus its a progestin - which raises prolactin which i suspect is the big reason Nandro is so damn hard on the male libido - not to mention the Dihydronandrolone issue, the prolactin just makes a bad day worse - it is a real floppy dick maker.

Caber would be great as pct i have come around to thinking, but is un-necessary for you i think…

Back on track.

In short, yes. You can get away with a little less of an aggressive PCT but ONLY as it is the first cycle and you are MORE LIKELY (by no means guaranteed, everyone is different after all) to be able to recover quickly with the generic 40/40/20/20 nolvadex protocol.

However, if you have HCG, or want to use it, why are you so intent on using it after the cycle when teh ballz have been shrunk? Why not use it to PREVENT that happening… even if you just do 500iu every 5 days?

trust me, when the ‘others’ come, they will agree on this at least…

How much HCG do you have, or are you planning on buying, 5000iu? 3x1500iu?

That would suffice for 50iu ED or 100iu EOD(4x/wk) or hell, even 150iu 3x/wk is a good protocol.
Even if you did it every other week - although 3000iu would last you the duration for an 8 weeker.

100, 300, 1000mg Nandrolone are all as suppressive as each other. I know that you seem to have read that nandrolone is considered mild - but that is more in the typical androgenic sides, or in comparison to many other steroids, as it is only mildly androgenic, converting into the variation of DHN rather than DHT. it is not toxic, it barely aromatises and is a great drug for bulk or cut. It a good muscle builder - great alone and excellent when stacked with test.
Many of the internet profiles were written years ago - they are a little outdated and not quite cutting edge (still excellent some of them, but some finer points regarding practical use is missing IMHO).
More is now understood about Nandrolone’s mode of action and what that means. Prolactin is the hormone of the month this month, and while HCG/Tamox wont fix that - it will virtually guarantee a smooth transition into a working HPTA and retention of ALL of your gains IF used in the manner in which i suggested.

Stick THAT in yer crack pipe and smoke it! ;p

JJ

[quote]Brook wrote:
You MUST use either Proviron, Masteron or Testosterone with deca… If you want just one compound then Proviron is fine…[/quote]

What!!?? No “You Must Run Test Higher Than Deca” answer!!?? Excellent Answer.
Shame you covered everything so I didn’t have much to add. Very refreshing to hear actual good advice that isn’t the standard newbie parroted stuff.

:wink: Thanks!

thanx brook for the post it helped alot and am starting today