T Nation

First Time Cutting with Test

Pharma
#1

I am 26 years old, been lifting since 14, on and off as far a how serious, but always lifting. I have done 1 precious cycle of test/deca with good results, and stupidly 3 different small prohormome cycles when younger. The last cycle was test/deca roughly 5 years ago. My bloodwork looks good, everything pretty normal.

My lifting is solid and I have my diet down. I’ve bulked for quite a while now and gotten a little more fat than I would like, but strength gains were best I’ve had since I was 16, I’m natural but ready to add in enhancers again since I feel I’m close to genetic potential, and I’m mature enough to do everything right.

I am going to do your typical 12 weeks 500 mg test e with AI as needed/nolva PCT while cutting to keep all the strength and size I’ve worked so hard to get, and maybe even build a little on top.

Right now for me to lose 1.5-2lbs a week I need roughly 2700 calories a day (40/40/20) or close to it. My main question is how much should I alter that amount since I’m going to be taking the gear? I know since my metabolism will speed up and protein synthesis will greatly increase, I’ll be able to eat more food while cutting in turn keeping more muscle.

I’m a very experienced lifter, but not as much with the PED side. I’ve researched a ton, but I know it’s different than actually doing it more than a couple times. And I’m ready for the next step for my physique.

Thanks for the help!!!

5’10”
225lbs
20% BF

Bench: best 225X17 on smith machine (AC joint surgery a while back can’t do much barbell or go insanely heavy)

Deadlift: 365X10 (normal not sumo)

Squat: dealing with hernia at moment, but when I can roughly 275X8-10

#2

20% bf could make your dose complicated. I’d start with a serm or ai.

#3

Based on your stats I’d say the proper cycle would be 0mg/w coupled with whatever calorie deficit you had planned. Steroids are for building muscle. Running a cycle for the purposes of cutting—especially when you don’t BnC—is a major waste. Just cut naturally and any muscle you lose you will gain right back when you run another cycle. Cut hard for eight weeks and then start running test at 500 (or whatever you’d like in that area).

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#4

This.

When you run a cycle, you should eat and lift like a champion to get the most out of it.

#5

Since you’re probably going to do the cycle anyways:

None. Keep your diet and training the same for a few weeks and see what happens. If you lose weight to quickly then add calories; if not quickly enough reduce calories.

You claim you’re 20% bodyfat (chances are it’s higher) which means you have a long way to go before you have to worry about losing muscle. What is your goal? Are you planning on competing in a physique competition?

I agree with the others that you should wait until you’re ready to build muscle before running a cycle.

1 Like
#6

Sad but likely true.

This claim doesn’t’ match the lifts especially at a BW of 225lbs. A 150lb guy maybe… but I agree with @iron_yuppie all the way. Get yourself in order first.

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#7

We are thinking the same again lol. IMO, those lifts are getting into intermediate territory, but certainly not advanced.

I should be clear that I am not trying to take a dig at OP. Those are respectable numbers, just when we are talking beginner, intermediate, advanced, and elite ifts there are kinda standards. Some people are very strong. Many people who go to commercial gyms are not aware of these people and think they are getting up there in strength, it is a small pond effect.

3 Likes
#8

Engineer brains…

Me either. Perhaps I need to soften my stance. @mcgr756 Your lifts are not paltry just not near what you could accomplish without gear. For example in my low T days I was 175lbs and could eclipse all of these easily with subpar hormones and a manlet sized body. Point being you don’t NEED gear. You’re lucky because as you’ve said your bloodwork shows normal after already partaking in prohormones and a prior cycle. You’re young. Keep it that way for now. Get your BW down 25-35lbs and then grow grow grow with or without the cycle. At least you will be on a launching platform for it.

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#9

Haha this was me about 2 years ago. I was legitimately top 5% in the box gym with respect to strength (could’ve been top 2% maybe, and it was a decent box gym too) but now I am at a powerlifting/strongman/oly gym and on a good day I’m in the 40th percentile lol.

I thought I was REALLY strong, but I am glad to have joined a real gym where I know I have much more to work for. I also was never on social media until about 18 months ago (I didn’t know such strong lifters existed until I got on IG), and I’m back off social media again. it’s too toxic.

#10

Ha I’m still in the 40 percentile at a box gym :joy:

OP, got any pictures of your current physique?

#11

I was in the same boat. Hardly anyone moved the weight I was at the commercial gym. Switch to a hardcore gym, and they are doing my weights as their second warm up set.

#12

I’ve never worked out at a hardcore gym LOL. I don’t mind being the strongest guy in the gym! Ego stroke… check.

2 Likes
#13

I like to think about visiting a commercial gym on a vacation just for the ego stroke.

Have you seen the video where the weightlifter dresses up as an old frail dude and goes to muscle beach? Hunched over 80 Y/O looking guy is telling these jacked guys how strong he used to be. They are like yeah right pops. Then he just pulls a heavy deadlift that one of the guys was doing for like a easy set of 5. Pretty funny.

#14

I’ve seen the one where Megsquats did something like that and she dressed up as an old lady and embarrassed a bunch of young guys in a box gym. it’s entertaining stuff.

#15

If you wanna feel inadequate and like you still have a lot to work for, go to a hardcore gym. At least once per week, I see dudes anywhere from 60-100 lbs less than me deadlifting more than I do lol. Brandon Striegel has been at my gym a few times… if any of y’all know who he is.

#16

Nah… hard pass. I like to my alpha dog in my own mind!

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#17

I am the strongest biggest baddest mofo at my home gym lol

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#18

Update, I got my results back, I am now going to be having bilateral hernia surgery, so I will be waiting to cycle. I’m gonna diet hard while I’m recovering, and start the cycle once I have dropped a significant amount of fat like everyone has said. Thanks everyone, I’ll post a pic of current physique for reference.

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#19

image
image4032×3024 2.49 MB

1 Like
#20

The good news is you’re probably not 20% BF.

You look good, definitely not what I pictured

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