T Nation

First Injectable Cycle....

Looking for any and all opions on my proposed first cycle…

Week 1
600mg deca
Week 2
300mg deca
Week 3
300mg deca
10 caps Mag10 Legacy
Week 4,5
150mg Parabolan every 3 days
50mg ed winstrol
Week 6
150mg Parabolan every 3 days
10 caps Mag10 Legacy
Week 7,8
150mg Parabolan every 3 days
50mg winstrol ed
Week 9
Nolva 80mg ed
Yohimbe,Muira Puama, and tribuls extracts ed
Weeks 10-13
Nolva 20mg ed
same extracts
ZMA and a B-complex will be taken throughout the cycle.

I know this will be a super supresive cycle since it has both deca and tren in it, I will get a really minor amount of test from the 4AD-EC in the MAG-10. If my test shuts down to much for me to handle I can use test cyp once a week, or test prop every 3 days with my tren shots. In either case it will only be 250-300mg ew. I could also run durabolan with the para every 3 days after I stop the deca to keep the nandro at a high level through out if this would be helpfull.

Well I have made everyone read enough thoughts, comments, flames…thanks for it all.
DA

DA:

I have only done a couple of injectable cycles, so I am by no means a vet. And what follows is just my musing based on my research over the last couple of years.

If you can get Durabolin why not use that instead of Deca? Deca may provide better mass gains, I suppose. Is your Tren acetate or enathate? If it’s short acting Tren then both of your injectables would clear much faster allowing you to start your PCT quicker, but would require more injects. I have never done Deca, but have done Durabolan; it’s in and out in 5 days.

Tren is also a Nandrolone derivative, so from what I have read, Tren and Deca will increase your chance of progesterone sides and raise your prolactin levels and killing your libido. I have read on other boards, posts from high Tren use, and users starting to lactate 10 weeks post cycle! I would take some type of prolactin inhibitor, like Dostinex. The board experts recommend .5 MG E4D (at least that?s what I did). With Tren or Deca, or Durabolan. Also, you don’t state how old you are, but from what I read, Tren likes the prostate, I added Saw Palmetto and 300 MG of B6. There is split opinion on what causes BPH, DHT or estrogen, these is no consensus.

I used MAG-10 several times, but if you have Cyp or prop why not use that? I ran Tren E and CYP 2X a week and mixed them both in the same pin. I would save the MAG-10 for later down the road. I have one of the mega bottles of MAG-10, I may use it for a diet/cutter cycle, maybe…

Your HPTA will shut down, thats a fact. The other thing I noticed with Tren is reduction in ejaculate volume, but I am done having kids.

Good luck…

[quote]Darkangel wrote:
Looking for any and all opions on my proposed first cycle…

Week 1
600mg deca
Week 2
300mg deca
Week 3
300mg deca
10 caps Mag10 Legacy
Week 4,5
150mg Parabolan every 3 days
50mg ed winstrol
Week 6
150mg Parabolan every 3 days
10 caps Mag10 Legacy
Week 7,8
150mg Parabolan every 3 days
50mg winstrol ed
Week 9
Nolva 80mg ed
Yohimbe,Muira Puama, and tribuls extracts ed
Weeks 10-13
Nolva 20mg ed
same extracts
ZMA and a B-complex will be taken throughout the cycle.

I know this will be a super supresive cycle since it has both deca and tren in it, I will get a really minor amount of test from the 4AD-EC in the MAG-10. If my test shuts down to much for me to handle I can use test cyp once a week, or test prop every 3 days with my tren shots. In either case it will only be 250-300mg ew. I could also run durabolan with the para every 3 days after I stop the deca to keep the nandro at a high level through out if this would be helpfull.

Well I have made everyone read enough thoughts, comments, flames…thanks for it all.
DA

[/quote]

Over 40, thanks for the reply…I was using the Deca to start off the cycle so I would only have to do 4 injects of a cc of that and then it would be in my system for the duration of this cycle, also it was really cheap for me.
Parabolan is the tren that I will be using which also has a half life of around 5 days so it will clear out pretty quickly after my last inject.
Also you were right about the saw palmetto…I already take this daily along with the other extracts I listed I just forgot to add it to the list.
I will also be taking a B-complex, which I think B-6 helps to fight off progesterone and prolactin, but if I am wrong or if anyone else agrees with you on the Dostinex I will see if I can get some of this as well.

As for the MAG-10 us, it is for 2 reasons, I have 4 and half bottles of it left so it will save some money 2nd and more importantly because it will give my kidneys and liver a break instead of trying to run a 17-aa for 6 weeks straight.

Oh and don’t worry I’m 22 so my load is pretty nice if I want to put it on some chic. However if this does go away too much I will run the cyp or prop for the last few weeks.
DA

Quote “If you can get Durabolin why not use that instead of Deca? Deca may provide better mass gains, I suppose. Is your Tren acetate or enathate?” End Quote

Hey Over40, what is Durabolin? Not deca durabolin? I have never heard of tren enanthate? Is this new?

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

Darkangel,
What are your goals for this particular cycle and your stats.
It’s a unique combination of drugs and I’m just wondering what the reason is that you chose them.

MK

stats are:
age: 22
Height: 5’7
weight: 190
BF: 10%

My goals are everything…bigger, stronger, and leaner. For mass I want to put some size on my upper body( especially my lats, chest and tri’s). Get stronger in all of my favorite compound lifts; deads, squats, bench, and cleans. Also I would like to cut up some and get down to where I can actually see my abs for once in my life.

The drug combo… well, I have the deca for recovery and a little bit of size with minimal sides, the tren for the strength, muscle hardening effects, and for cutting up; winny to amplify the effects of both of the other drugs.
I know as far as cutting and only gaining lean mass this will come from my diet. I eat pretty clean and get a lot of protein but, now I will step everything up. I will get 350-400 grams per day of protein but, not worry about carbs till the last 4 weeks of the actual cycle where I will keep them to 200 grams ed or less.
In short as long as I get 200 lbs or better while dropping bf% to 8 or lower I will be happy…Do you guy think my goals are do able?
thanks for all reply’s
DA

Here you go…

Tren E is just that Tren w/ an Enathate ester, although I felt it pretty quick. It’s around, you have to look…

nandrolone phenylpropionate
Durabolin is very similar to the popular Deca-Durabolin. Durabolin must be injected frequently and in regular intervals. The substance nandrolone-phenylpropionate quickly gets into the blood, where it remains active for two to three days. Athletes who hope for optimal results inject Durabolin every third day, or even every two days. The dosage is around 50-100 mg per injection, or a total of 150-300 mg/week. Those who have access to the 50 mg version should take advantage of it since it is less expensive than the 25 mg version, which is normally more easily available. in addition, the 1-2 ml injections are more pleasant than the 2-4 ml. Durabolin has a distinct anabolic effect which assists the protein synthesis and allows the protein to be stored in the muscle cell in large amounts. This is combined with a moderate androgenic component which stimulates the athlete’s regeneration and helps maintain the muscle mass during a diet. It shows that Durabolin stores much less water in the body than Deca-Durabolin. For this reason, Durabolin is more suitable for a preparation for a competition while Deca should be given preference for the buildup of strength and muscle mass. Durabolin, however, can be used for this purpose as well. The gains are fewer and slower than with Deca but of a higher quality and remain, for the most part, after discontinuing the com-pound. A stack suitable for this purpose would be, e.g. 56 mg Durabolin every 2 days, 50 mg Testosterone Propionate every days, and 20 mg Winstrol tablets every day.

The side effects of Durabolin are few. Water retention, high blood pressure, an el-evated estrogen level, and virilization symptoms occur less often with Durabolin than with Deca-Durabolin. Female athletes therefore take Durabolin in weekly intervals since, due to its short duration of effect, no undesirable concentration of androgen takes place. They achieve good results with 50 mg Durabolin/week, 50 mg Testosterone Propionate every 8 -10 days, and 8-10 mg Winstrol/day, or 10 mg Oxandrolone/day. Three to four day intervals between the relative injections are to be observed. Durabolin is one of the safest non-toxic steroids offering satisfactory results. Durabolin has no negative effect on the liver function so it can even be taken in cases of liver disease. Side effects occur only in rare cases and in persons who are extremely sensitive. Virilization symptoms in women such as huskiness, deep voice, hirsutism, acne, and increased libido are possible but occur only rarely if reasonable dosages are taken at reasonable intervals. Men usually experience no symptoms with Durabolin. Since the release of gonadotropins in the hypophysis is inhibited, there is a chance that the body’s own testosterone production in a male athlete will be lower when the compound is taken over a prolonged time and in excessive doses.

[quote]beerbarbq wrote:
Quote “If you can get Durabolin why not use that instead of Deca? Deca may provide better mass gains, I suppose. Is your Tren acetate or enathate?” End Quote

Hey Over40, what is Durabolin? Not deca durabolin? I have never heard of tren enanthate? Is this new?

[/quote]

On what Darkangel wrote:

My advice is to drop the deca. Running it for 3 weeks will accomplish nothing.
I’ve been cycling for 2 yrs and have yet to try fina…I’ll be trying it in a couple months for a show and I’ll let everyone know the results. With that being said, you may want to hold off for a bit since fina is such a potent compound.
Instead, I’d suggest a test and equipoise cycle. This combination of drugs will allow you to accomplish all of your goals while having minimum sides. A good dose would be 500mg test and 500mg eq for 10 weeks and of course fl the drugs the first week. Add the winstrol the final 4 weeks and run 10-20mg nolvadex ed throughout.
Sorry to totally revamp your cycle, but based upon what you’ve told me, I wouldn’t have you do it any other way.

MK

Well crap on me and my completely impatient self…
Thanks for the reply and new cycle MikeK but, like I said I am really impatient when it comes to anything and have already started my deca. I should have the winny some time this week and the para in the next. Although I could still turn this into a longer cycle of 500mg test cyp weekly and 300mg deca and then add in the deca for the last 4 weeks.

So I already did one week of 600mg deca and did another shot of 300mg today… I want to know why deca would do no good for 3 weeks since the stuff will be in my system for at least another 30 or so days if I stop today. The other drugs would mix with the very active deca in my system till almost the last week of the cycle. If I am completely off on this theory please tell me and I will start the test Cyp cycle I outlined, I would rather see out my original cycle but, tell me what you think.
Thanks again.
DA

Maybe it will work for you. Post your results when you finish…

[quote]Darkangel wrote:
Well crap on me and my completely impatient self…
Thanks for the reply and new cycle MikeK but, like I said I am really impatient when it comes to anything and have already started my deca. I should have the winny some time this week and the para in the next. Although I could still turn this into a longer cycle of 500mg test cyp weekly and 300mg deca and then add in the deca for the last 4 weeks.

So I already did one week of 600mg deca and did another shot of 300mg today… I want to know why deca would do no good for 3 weeks since the stuff will be in my system for at least another 30 or so days if I stop today. The other drugs would mix with the very active deca in my system till almost the last week of the cycle. If I am completely off on this theory please tell me and I will start the test Cyp cycle I outlined, I would rather see out my original cycle but, tell me what you think.
Thanks again.
DA[/quote]

Beer and Bush, Tren Enanthate is not that new. I say it’s been around for a good year or so. It is still Trenbolone, only with the enanthate ester attached to it. So yes, you’re right, it has a slower release time, of say, about 10-12 days.

I’ve never used it personally, but when it came out, it was the rave. Back then, it was expensive as hell… I don’t know about today. I hope this helps. Good luck.

[quote]Darkangel wrote:
Well crap on me and my completely impatient self…
Thanks for the reply and new cycle MikeK but, like I said I am really impatient when it comes to anything and have already started my deca. I should have the winny some time this week and the para in the next. Although I could still turn this into a longer cycle of 500mg test cyp weekly and 300mg deca and then add in the deca for the last 4 weeks.

So I already did one week of 600mg deca and did another shot of 300mg today… I want to know why deca would do no good for 3 weeks since the stuff will be in my system for at least another 30 or so days if I stop today. The other drugs would mix with the very active deca in my system till almost the last week of the cycle. If I am completely off on this theory please tell me and I will start the test Cyp cycle I outlined, I would rather see out my original cycle but, tell me what you think.
Thanks again.
DA[/quote]

You are 100% correct that you’ll have some deca floating around in your system for the entire 8 weeks. The key word is SOME. With the doses you have outlined, the amount remaining in your system will probably be marginal at best. Deca is not very potent bro, in fact it’s pretty mild imo. I just don’t think you’re going to get much out of this cycle, but maybe you’ll prove me wrong (I hope you do as I’d hate to see you shut down endogenous test production for only a couple lbs.).

MK

Ok I was an impatient fool and this will not happen again. After taking some sound advice from MK I started up test Cyp yesterday at 500mg and will inject it every 5 days at 300mgs. I Have also upped my deca to 450mg every 7 days and have 5 injections left at that dose and will keep the test going until 10 days after the deca stops. Then I will have 20 more days after my last inject of test till I start PCT.
I will start running liquidex next week and have plenty of Nolva on hand.
I may still throw in winny at 50mg ed for the last 20 days to keep my androgen levels up while my test and deca dwindle away.
Thanks for all the help.
DA

Just a little up date on the progress of my cycle…
I checked my weight to day…198lbs.
That is up about 13-15lbs since I started. A little bit of fat, I think because I brought up my calories too quick at the beginning of the cycle. I did run the liquidex and I only use Nolva when ever I get pariniod ever 4 or 5 days about my nips feeling funny.
I will do 2 more weeks and then start my winny at 50mg ed for the remaining 30 or so days and then begin my PCT.
DA

Hey guys just wanted to post an update.
I started my pct on last wednesday and don’t have a lot of good to report.
My cycle was going great but, then 3 weeks ago I was asked if I could work some doubles at one of my jobs. Which is great cause I could use the money but, not so great when trying to gain muscle mass.
See I work at UPS loading 18 wheelers all night long. This is a brutal jobs to begain with. Now with the extra shifts I was working over 50hrs a week between both jobs. 35+ of which are done sweeting in a trailer all day/night.

But, enough crying about work. I found out the stupid electric scale I was using at the gym is off by 5lbs so, I really started this cycle at around 185lbs and now have just around 10lbs to show for my cycle. I do however have more size and more hardness to show for it. My lats are awsome and my biceps and chest are harder then ever. The gains were the most impressive and the most lasting effect from the cycle.I have not injected deca for a little over a month and the last of the test a week after that and my strength is still awsome. 2 weeks ago I was doing sets ranging from 8-12 reps all the way up to 75lbs for dumbell shoulder presses. Just yesterday I finally got past my sticking point of 380 on deadlifts( which I have been at forever) and got up 405lbs 2X.
I will recover, cut up a little for summer and possibly do short 3weeker of test prop and tren acetate in July. But my next major cycle cycle will not be till late in the fall. Thanks to MK for the helping hand and everyone else for chiming in. Give a little feed back please and go ahead and flame away at me for making such weak gains, it was a good learning experiance and I am happy with it.
DA