T Nation

First Cycle

I was wondering about my upcoming REAL first cycle. I’ve done a shitty, unresearched, and basically terrible cycle in the past however now i’ve spent countless hours researching and I wanted some input for my fist cycle. I have 2 possiblities that I am examining:
Cycle 1
100 mg prop Eod (week 1-8)
75 mg tren eod (week 1-6)

Ancillaries:
10 mg nolva ed (week 1-8 and through PCT)
Clomid for PCT

Cycle 2

Test enth 500 mg/week (week 1-10)

Ancillaries:
10 mg Nolva ed (week 1-10 and through PCT)
.25mg arimidex or l-dex (week 1-10) to reduce bloating

The second cylce is a more basic beginner cyle (fewer injestions, single compound) However I am really interested in putting on quality mass and increased streanght while significantly decreasing BF% which points me more in the direction of the first cycle.

Thanks for any help guys, It is much appreciated!

I hope the 14 in your name has nothing to do with your age…

hahahaah no no, its my hockey number. LOL

The first cycle is not bad, just do your tren ed from weeks 1-8. The acetate halflife is only about a day or less so you need freqent injections to maintain blood levels, Also at cycles end I don’t think it will make a difference suppression wise if you d/c the tren 2 weeks prior or 2 days prior, either way the prop will be in your system longer, and exerting its effects longer. 10mg of nolva per day should suffice as well. plus post cycle protocol of nolva or clomid… Also hcg from end of week 3 to week 8 I recomend do every sat, and sunday around 250 i.u. each day. last week of hcg is end of week 8. the hcg is taken to maintain testicular size and function which falls off past the third week of your cycle once full suppression begins.

If you really want a great cycle, then add 75 mg of oral winstrol every day to that! You can also do the 500mg of enantate per week with the tren ed and the possibility of the winstrol added in.

Prisoner’s New Mission Statement re:
stacking Dbol

As for people who might say add some dbol, I am begining to think that large amounts of dbol and test together are too much of a pain in the back! Two compounds that cause +++ water retention is just too many for me to tolerate anymore. From now on I am structuring all my cycles to include only one drug that causes water retention. I would still include test but only at 100mg of enantate/ cypionate per week to keep the g/f happy.

From now on if I am using a lot of test (500mg+/wk)and am going to stack an oral it will be either winstrol, anavar, or halotestin. If I am using a lot of primo,deca, or trenbolone, then I will use dbol, or anadrol- I am just sick of being unable to train properly d/t excessive water retention!

P22
Personally I hate d-bol because of the back pain and will never do it in any of my future cycles.

Yeah… Deadly D-Bol Back Pump!! Sucks!

What are you guys talking about “back pump”? All dbol ever gave me was pimples and big arms… I still like the stuff.

Is this why my back is killing me?? Hell, I thought it was from heavy deadlifts. Personally, I’m getting tired of the bloat too. It’s not extreme, but the wardrobe thing sucks. Some people have summer and winter clothes… I have on-cycle and off-cycle clothes. Go figure.

“I was wondering about my upcoming REAL first cycle. I’ve done a shitty, unresearched, and basically terrible cycle in the past”

Wouldn’t the shitty cycle be your first and REAL. Was your juice fake or something?

I notice with d-bol that if I do anything like cleans, snatches, any type of deadlift my back just seizes up and it doesn’t recover during the workout. I have never quit the gym early except where d-bol left me crippled!
When natural yes i feel back strain but if I stretch and do light reps it responds well.

Creed this is d/t water retention. And no amount of femara or arimidex helps this. These drugs i.e. dbol, test, just cause the kidneys to retain sodium and potasium, and the the water follows. This leads to an accumulation of intercellular water (thats water in the tissue spaces between cells). This slows gas exchange (and restricts blood flow) which is what oxygenates, and removes carboxic acid from the cells along with lactic acid. So increase in water retention= decrease in gas exchange = build up of waste products (in forms of acid) in the cell= a painful burning sensation!

I have found I can get some relief from this during legs/ back work if I do a set of abs inbetween sets. this seems to relieve some pressure to the area allowing for some relief. The other thing I have done is to sit resting inbetween sets in an inclined position, my back against a flat bench and my ass on the ground with my legs bent at about a 60 degee angle. this seems to relieve some pressure also providing relief. Hope this helps P-22

Didn’t know the water rentention couldn’t be prevented, damn.

I often do ab work supersetted with my back sets for that very reason. Also i hang with my knees up from a chin bar but i’ve never tried the lying down thing.
Thanks for the advice, I’ll give it a whirl.

Well you could use diuretics, but these are dangerous, and I am sure you don’t want to end up like Flex Wheeler!

That shit is funny Prisoner now that you mention about back pump. Fucking I remember the first time I got it I was on a sust d bol cycle. I am a diesel tech and of coarse we have heavy things to lift. I was taking batteries out of a truck and each one weighs 55lbs. By the time I hit the fourth one going back in I was wondering what the hell was going on. The pump is unbelievable sometimes but so ungodly that it is almost a must have unless it interferes with training then it is time to lay off.

Lol well I wouldn’t mind looking like Flex Wheeler but maybe with less of a tan.

flex wheelers health is the shits he just about died, im pretty sure thats what they were refering to