T Nation

First Cycle Rushed Into by Injury, But How's It Look?

My first post and already asking for a cycle critique I know you see it far too often but I feel as though I have done plenty of reading before posting so here goes.

I am 29. 6"1 195 lbs around 10-12%bf. Have been training steady for 3 years. Was originally planning on waiting till I was around the 210lb mark before attempting AAS but have rushed my decision based on a bad shoulder that refuses to get better.

Injured it originally about 18 months ago. Just got an MRI last week that shows no obvious damage apparently so now waiting for an Arthroscopy but who knows how long that could be, or if it will tell me anymore. So for know just been recommended to stay with physio.

So that leads me to this proposed cycle to help recovery

Week 1-10 Eq 250mg a week or 500 ?
Week 1-16 Test-E 250mg a week
Week 16-20 Test Taper
16 125 2x a week
17 100 2x / w
18 75 2x / w
19 50 2x / w
20 50 2x / w or can you go lower than this to 25 even?

Also considering Proviron for what weeks 4 to 16 ? Ed or EOD ?
Also a trib product for the same time frame ? In place of HCG ?

As for specific types of gear am I allowed to ask about a certain kind I would have access to dont see that discussed much around here ?

Any comments and or direction is much appreciated.

Bad shoulder about and about to make it worse.

Theres clearly plenty more research that you can and should do.

Well I have seen enough of your replies to know your a well respected person here so I appreciate your reply but am curious if you elaborate a little more as to why you think it would be a bad idea.

I was under the impression EQ was extremely good at helping collagen synthesis. But cant really be run alone so was looking at a minimal amount of test , and a test taper PCT to go with.

Can you say anymore as to why you dont think it would be wise in helping a recovery ?

Thanks for your time

Because you are more than likely going to cause more harm than good with the use of the drugs.

You are more apt to cause long term and/or permanent damage if you use those drugs, and lull youself into a false confidence.

Find a specific rehab program with AAS.

Are you using fish oil, chondroitin, MSM, or glucosamine?

Yes have been taking omega3-6-9’s , glucosamine with chondroitin and ON’s multi .

Have done probably 12-15 physio sessions in the past year which helps temporarily but nothing long term

What kind of injury was it?

I think you are better off waiting untill you are healed all the wya before trying AAS.

one reason is because you will be lifting heavier and more often when using drugs and when you do that, any weak spots, shoulder, knees, wrist ect they will obviously fail on you first and you wont get a good enough work ou to maximise your use. Also like me you may not even notice the damage done to the weak joint until its too late.

I was on a cycle and my wrist gave out.didnt know it because didnt feel it until it was time for me to have pins and a bone graft placed.

BTW what kind of AAS are you interested in go ahead and ask please dont tell sources or labs,but a certian type is fine to inquire about.

Well that is the problem really is that no doctor so far can tell me what is wrong with it , family doc says rotator sprain inflammation has been saying ice and anti-inflammatories for over a year !

Physio thinks my shoulder is not sitting high enough and putting pressure on nerves and blood vessels.

And like I said originally got an MRI last week and sports medicine doc says its inconclusive and I need an arthroscopy which will be months

[quote]Silva_A wrote:
Well that is the problem really is that no doctor so far can tell me what is wrong with it , family doc says rotator sprain inflammation has been saying ice and anti-inflammatories for over a year !
Physio thinks my shoulder is not sitting high enough and putting pressure on nerves and blood vessels.

And like I said originally got an MRI last week and sports medicine doc says its inconclusive and I need an arthroscopy which will be months[/quote]

be patient…find out whats wrong first you really dont want to mess up anything badly.
I know its tempting but the risk outweighs potential gain.

if you do decied not to wait then keep an eye on that shoulder then.but honestly I do not see any point to AAS without reletivaly heavy lifting.
maybe alot of compounds that wont aggrivate the shoulder as much?
I dunno just be careful

Thanks for all the replies so far

Yes I can appreciate most saying to wait to see whats wrong I am just completly out of patience this injury has been driving me nuts for over 18 months and never seems to differ at all.

I can still do back and arms no pain , just no heavy chest or shoulders.

The only real reason I have come this close to making the jump is the potential EQ has for collagen building have read things as high as 380 % more collagen synsthesis.

However also read is should not be run alone so that is really the one real reason I came up with the cycle I did , to run a base min of test with the EQ like everyone says should be.
So that brought me to test for the 16 weeks. 6 weeks longer than the EQ to make sure the EQ is all out then start to taper the test out as well.

If I could run EQ alone safely I would but thought that my proposed cycle would be more safe in the long run.

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What pre-hab and re-hab shoulder exercises are you doing? Any external rotation exercises prior to working out? How do lateral raises feel? Rear delt exercises?

What chest and shoulder exercises do you do that cause pain? Have you tried other chest and shoulder exercises to see if it’s position that’s the real problem? Ex. bench vs. flies; Arnold db presses vs. bb military press; db bench with palms facing in vs bb bench. You get the idea.

There are a lot of things you need to know about how your body feels with different exercises.

AAS would be a bad idea. Like others’ said before me, it’ll give you a false sense of security and will most likely lead to greater injury.

[quote]bushidobadboy wrote:
You also need to reasses your understanding of the test taper.

I’m assuming you want to do Prisoners recovery protocol? If so, then I have to question why you have left out the most important part - the ‘stasis’ or waiting period.

If you are just using your own taper approach, then fair enough, but be aware that it doesn’t work as effectively as the stasis taper.

Bushy[/quote]

Again thanks for all the replies

Yes I guess I do need some clarification will have to re-read it again I was under the understanding that , the stasis is a period by where you stop taking everything BUT test ? IS that incorrect ? So I thought my weeks 10-16 above would effectively be my stasis do I not have this correct ?

[quote]kroby wrote:
What pre-hab and re-hab shoulder exercises are you doing? Any external rotation exercises prior to working out? How do lateral raises feel? Rear delt exercises?

I have been doing external rotations with cables with no pain , can do light front raises , can’t really do anything above the shoulder area , no overhead raises , also cant do dips or any heavy shoulder work.

Have an elastic band I use to stretch out the shoulder , applying heat before excersise and lots of deep tissue work with a small hard rubber ball, best I can do on my own.

Thanks again for all your replies much appreciated

Also want to add that all your suggestions are being taken seriously I am not going to just go ahead anyway if the consensus is overwhelmingly against it being of any use to my recovery.

I just cant stop thinking that EQ could somehow help repair the seemingly invisible damage according the any doctor I have seen just very frustrating.

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Bushy

Thanks again for your replies much appreciated

Ok so the only thing I had wrong was that the test would need to be run at 100mg/w for weeks 10-16 , then I guess the taper would then start at 100mg per week , in two doses and taper down from there ?

And you mention the stasis should be even longer but I have it at 6 weeks now ? I thought I had read 4-6 depending on the length of the ester involved so I went with the high side 6 weeks ?

And since I wasnt corrected on it I was right to think EQ should never be run alone ?

[quote]Silva_A wrote:
Bushy

Thanks again for your replies much appreciated

Ok so the only thing I had wrong was that the test would need to be run at 100mg/w for weeks 10-16 , then I guess the taper would then start at 100mg per week , in two doses and taper down from there ?

And you mention the stasis should be even longer but I have it at 6 weeks now ? I thought I had read 4-6 depending on the length of the ester involved so I went with the high side 6 weeks ?

And since I wasnt corrected on it I was right to think EQ should never be run alone ?

[/quote]

The only problem with Eq alone, is it may cause a drop in libido. proviron would help though, and do the job fine. test would be great at 1-250 a week, if you stick just 400mg test on top of 4-600mg eq, you would have some nice clean gains IMO…

As for the stasis, you are getting it mixed up… instead of just running a longer taper, stop the Eq a couple of weeks before the test, THEN you run the 100mg taper from that point… so say the eq is run till week 10-12, the test till 12-14, then 6 weeks of 100mg a week.

The taper is… please read the stickys at the top of the forum! Jesus!

well… i may as well finish, but read them as well.

The taper is started the week after the last 100mg of stasis. It is USUALLY done at 80mg, 60mg, 40mg, 20mg with one week for each dose, there are other ways but that is fine…

read the stickys… if you have, read them more.

JJ

Thanks for your reply JJ

Will have to re -read the taper but thanks for the summary I guess I just wasn’t running the stasis for long enough ?

Interesting though that you mention EQ could be run alone with Proviron which I have easy access to so will have to read more into that for doses and frequnecy but I seem to remeber its just and ED thing one day.

But yes will re-read the stickies again.

Thanks again everyone for all your replies relaly appreciated