T Nation

First Contest Prep

I will be competing in my first contest in April 2011, I will be “on” for a considerable amount of time and I was wondering how (if at all) you can prepare yourself for an easier recovery after something so long. Obviously after the cycle I will need to implement a rigorous pct but aside from that is there anything else I can do?

11 months from now okay…

It varies alot from person to person there is definetly no hard and fast rule to this age, genetics, cycle history and the condition your body/endocrene system is in before you do a long cycle.

Why do you want to go on so long?

what are your stats at the moment (height, weight, age, bodyfat, cycle history) and what did you plan to compete at?

If going up to your first competition, I would rather than be on for 1 year straight and potentially fuck my body up for good…do cycles at higher doses for say 16 weeks with 10mg morning dbol bridge between cycles (with rigorus nolva during whole bridge-critical).

I would do the dbol/nolva bridge for long enuff to let hormone levels recover at least somewhat acceptably before going on again (i never go on a complete bridge I have come off totally for time I feel was necessary-as long off as I could without loosing much strength).

I believe I gain ALOT more with repeating high dose cycles than I would if I would not come off a lower dose continuous cycle.

I would not like to be on more than 16 weeks and try to recover me personally. Even 16 weeks is a lot.

I mean I actually recover pretty good but I still…would not like to fuck with my body THAT much…too much ‘potential’ problems and I dont like the risk/benefit ratio…too risky for me.

Cardiovascular risk also greatly increases on a continuous cycle I believe from the literature ive read for numerous reasons…and I dont want to have a heart attack at 30 and be massive 6 feet under…

Remember the harder it is to recover…the more mass you will loose post cycle. If you go on continuous and try to pct and it takes you 6 months…how much muscle can you keep realistically? Not much im guessing.

Why bust your ass to gain all this muscle to only loose it again…its like pissing gear in the toilet I dont see the point.

I just dont see the point UNLESS you never come off and are talking IFBBPRO heavyweight massive but if you were looking to compete at this level next year…I will assume you would already have to be pretty massive and taking tons of gear.

Dont get me wrong I may be totally incorret and If i am please tell me I apologise in advance, but doesnt seem to be in your case.

Does a morning low dose dbol bridge really work? I know the theory behind it, but I don’t know much about bridging cycles, except for some posts I read by Bill Roberts. I think he suggested Masteron, but I’ll do a search for that again, it was interesting stuff.

Dbol 10mg one dose morning for me works excellent for strength retention for me so does 25 mg anadrol, masteron I havnt tried yet in this way, stanazol is useless for me unless 75mg+ per day is used.

My preference is dbol just cause its in and out so quick and effective in a low dose.

All this with reduced volume of training and focusing on retaining strength not gaining.

Between coming off last cycle and starting my new cycle I lost only 5-7% strength average across all exercises.

I was pretty happy with that

I just want to make it clear Im not telling you to do what I did (run high doses or run some sort of bridge), Im just giving you different opinion on what I think would work as good if not better than a continuous cycle and I believe be safer long term and easier to recover from.

I dont have any experience with peptides for fear of long term sides, high cost, problem with refrigeration, but this could improve you contest prep immensely have you used peptides before?

Appreciate the comments, the problem is that these will be relatively high does throughout, i thought about a bridge I just don’t want to lose all the size I put on during the “offseason” right before I start the contest prep which is 16 weeks out from April. Has anyone else used any other successful bridges?? I think maybe if I ran from July to end of october (16 weeks) then bridge from that time until mid december and start the contest prep which is again (16 weeks), does that sound more plausible?

or maybe just hit nolva during november before I start again in december, Oh sorry and my stats are 6’0, 215, 7%bf…highest weight was 245 and that is where I just cut down from (naturally). As far as GH and Peptides, they are extremely expensive and I have zero connections on getting them so I kind of ruled those out.

What sort of doses and AAS?

What did you want to achieve by April (weight/bf%)?

Cycle history?

Age?

I think the key to staying big and retaining muscle is to cut on cycle and maintain through pct.

Your diet training must be immaculate.

You probably lost alot of strength/size as you cut off AAS.

If me at 5’11.5 265lb 18%bf dont loose too much size/strength/weight off cycle with dbol, you shouldnt at your weight.

I use dbol now for this only, I wouldnt use anything else as more suppressive bridge scares me.

Save maybe masteron but I havent tried this yet so cant comment how well it works.

Prob will use about 1g of test a week and 600mg of deca and then those drugs will obviously change for the pre-contest phase…cycle history is two cycles, a while ago, extremely low doses. By april I will probably compete in the Novice Heavyweight and maybe open light heavy so I’d probably come in around 196 but that is so far away that I am not really sure. The question is, if I am on the test/deca for 16 weeks and then hit nolva for 4 weeks, then jump to my pre-contest is that enough time to really do anything? or should i just stay on for that month

[quote]johnmurray2 wrote:
Prob will use about 1g of test a week and 600mg of deca and then those drugs will obviously change for the pre-contest phase…cycle history is two cycles, a while ago, extremely low doses. By april I will probably compete in the Novice Heavyweight and maybe open light heavy so I’d probably come in around 196 but that is so far away that I am not really sure. The question is, if I am on the test/deca for 16 weeks and then hit nolva for 4 weeks, then jump to my pre-contest is that enough time to really do anything? or should i just stay on for that month[/quote]

196?

Arent you 215 7% now??

Why do u want to cycle to achieve that and more importantly…stay on?? Are you serious?

Jumping from very small cycles to a year long 1g test/deca is NOT a good idea…not.

Deca is harder to recover from, 4 weeks off on nolva is NOT enough and no you shouldnt just stay on…

You didnt answer all the questions I asked you either…Paragragh your answers they are very hard to understand.

Age is 23, I have no idea what my weight will be, this is going to be my first contest, I have never gotten “competition lean”, what did you compete at? Did you know exactly what weight you were going to be? Maybe I’ll be 205, maybe I’ll be 210, I really have no clue because I have never competed. All I know is I have some friends who are 260 in offseason and compete around 198, so I just tried to give you an estimate.

[quote]johnmurray2 wrote:
Age is 23, I have no idea what my weight will be, this is going to be my first contest, I have never gotten “competition lean”, what did you compete at? Did you know exactly what weight you were going to be? Maybe I’ll be 205, maybe I’ll be 210, I really have no clue because I have never competed. All I know is I have some friends who are 260 in offseason and compete around 198, so I just tried to give you an estimate. [/quote]

They fluctuate 60lbs??

Why?

Well an aquaintance that I know who recently took out 2nd place at the top ranked big national event @ 198 5"7 approx 4% and he stays lean…yearound.

Another one took out national under 90 kg class 2 year ago is 86 kg off cycle 6% 5"6’

They both stay lean year round.

Were talking top ranked National compeditors at highest level under 90kg (under 198lb class)

I wont give specifics of course.

I have decided not to compete (even though they both have tried to convince me to) but my personal goal come december is 260lb 10% and i will definetly reach that (i should finish this current cut cycle @ around 12-15% 260-ish).

This is only my seccond injectable cycle in 12 months and I was not cycling for 5 years fat and overweight when I started 1 year ago.

You are already close to your desired bf and heavier…just 16 weeks of cycling 1g test is huge…

You have to understand what your saying is crazy…you want to drop 3% bodyfat and loose 20 pounds with cycling 1g test for over 32 weeks!

Maybe if you eat no food!

If you cant end up 230 5% your doing things wrong thats for sure

Well if I end up at 230 and 5% I will be a very very happy man, like I said I have never used doses that high nor have I gotten competition lean so I guess only time will tell right

good luck in your comp. I was a competitive bodybuilder from 1993-1999. I won my class in many shows and one overall. I also placed in the top five in two national level shows in 1998 and 99. My experience was that I did not really need higher doses then usual to get ready. The key is diet, rest and cardio, depending on your metabolism. So put your effort into those three things. The drugs are needed to keep the playing feild level but they are not he be all and end all of contest prep at all.

As for after the show, I used to take a month to a month and a half off after competing. If you get ready right you will be shot by the time you compete and will need the rest. Do the pct regiment but don’t worry about training for a while, relax and enjoy the fact that you did something many are not mentally strong enough to accomplish.

Also, do not worry about the scale it means absolutly nothing. In addition forget bodyfat percentage too because that is also irrelavent. What matters is what you look like not what BF percent you are. You need to be ripped and most do not realize, when competing for the first time, that to get contest ready ripped, you will probably come in lighter then you ever thought. The scale will just fuck with your head. Find someone you trust, not someone who is just going to tel that “you look great dude” every time he looks at you. Someone who will tell you that you are not ready and you need to step it up if that is the situation. Its the only way you will get in very good condition for a first show. Find someone in your gym who is an experienced bodybuilder and see if he would take a look at you once a week.

[quote]joeblow wrote:
good luck in your comp. I was a competitive bodybuilder from 1993-1999. I won my class in many shows and one overall. I also placed in the top five in two national level shows in 1998 and 99. My experience was that I did not really need higher doses then usual to get ready. The key is diet, rest and cardio, depending on your metabolism. So put your effort into those three things. The drugs are needed to keep the playing feild level but they are not he be all and end all of contest prep at all.

As for after the show, I used to take a month to a month and a half off after competing. If you get ready right you will be shot by the time you compete and will need the rest. Do the pct regiment but don’t worry about training for a while, relax and enjoy the fact that you did something many are not mentally strong enough to accomplish.

Also, do not worry about the scale it means absolutly nothing. In addition forget bodyfat percentage too because that is also irrelavent. What matters is what you look like not what BF percent you are. You need to be ripped and most do not realize, when competing for the first time, that to get contest ready ripped, you will probably come in lighter then you ever thought. The scale will just fuck with your head. Find someone you trust, not someone who is just going to tel that “you look great dude” every time he looks at you. Someone who will tell you that you are not ready and you need to step it up if that is the situation. Its the only way you will get in very good condition for a first show. Find someone in your gym who is an experienced bodybuilder and see if he would take a look at you once a week.[/quote]

Thank you for your response, I admire your ability to compete for that many years. I don’t think I want to do this that many times (though I’m sure everyone says that lol). I would like to do it to the best of my ability and then move on to a new challenge. I agree with you on doses, I am not a fan of high doses but I am relatively tall and will have to compete in the heavyweight likely and judging from last years class I def have some serious size to add. My diet is absolutely spot on, I don’t do any cheat meals and I weigh everything to the ounce. I am not worried about determination, diet, or cardio…I have those things on lock. What I worry about is that I know I’m not “built” for bodybuilding. I’m tall, long arms, not super long muscle bellies, etc.

I’m not worried about the scale, like I was trying to tell the other guy, since I’ve never competed I have no idea what I will weigh. Like you said, getting that lean means losing more weight than u can plan or imagine. I am my hardest critic and I will surround myself with people who have done this (my whole family competes) to help me bring up weak points and tell me what the deal is! Again thanks for your response.

What weight did you compete at? And if you don’t mind me asking how long were you “on” for and how was recovery? Thanks

I am only 5’5’’ so I competed at middleweight. I would usually be on about 20 weeks before competing. As for recovery, back then no one was taking noveldex after cycles, the big thing was just hcg so that is what I would use. I would lose some muscle but it would come right back when I started training again and eating right. good luck again.

I would find someone to mentor you; it will remove a lot of the guesswork.

I’m sure you can find a local BBer willing to guide you. Even if they are oldschool and still rely on hours of steady-state cardio and brocolli and chicken etc to achieve a decent result, you’ll be stage-ready. Even if it is an unessecarily painful route :wink:

BBB

[quote]bushidobadboy2 wrote:
I would find someone to mentor you; it will remove a lot of the guesswork.

I’m sure you can find a local BBer willing to guide you. Even if they are oldschool and still rely on hours of steady-state cardio and brocolli and chicken etc to achieve a decent result, you’ll be stage-ready. Even if it is an unessecarily painful route :wink:

BBB[/quote]

Thanks guys lol! Hey BBB can I ask you a quick question? I am planning on a mass cycle and pre-contest cycle to prepare. I have decided against staying on this entire time as I absolutely want to have kids, so this is worrying me a bit. In your opinion what would be my best route? Should I hit a 16-18 week mass cycle then do a pct of HMG/HCG/NOLVA for about 4-6 weeks before I start my 16 week contest cycle? Or should I use hmg and hcg throughout the mass cycle and still do a pct in between. I am really lost here and I don’t want to mess up my whole future for something I only plan to do once you know? I would really appreciate any of your expertise or guidance. Thank you.

Basically, what BBB is too modest to say is that you need to fly him out ASAP. If I had the money and I was competing, I know I’d be taking a trip to Wales (for the naked butlering, obviously).

[quote]johnmurray2 wrote:

[quote]bushidobadboy2 wrote:
I would find someone to mentor you; it will remove a lot of the guesswork.

I’m sure you can find a local BBer willing to guide you. Even if they are oldschool and still rely on hours of steady-state cardio and brocolli and chicken etc to achieve a decent result, you’ll be stage-ready. Even if it is an unessecarily painful route :wink:

BBB[/quote]

Thanks guys lol! Hey BBB can I ask you a quick question? I am planning on a mass cycle and pre-contest cycle to prepare. I have decided against staying on this entire time as I absolutely want to have kids, so this is worrying me a bit. In your opinion what would be my best route? Should I hit a 16-18 week mass cycle then do a pct of HMG/HCG/NOLVA for about 4-6 weeks before I start my 16 week contest cycle? Or should I use hmg and hcg throughout the mass cycle and still do a pct in between. I am really lost here and I don’t want to mess up my whole future for something I only plan to do once you know? I would really appreciate any of your expertise or guidance. Thank you.[/quote]

Much like any other side-effect from AAS use, infertility is overexaggerated IMO.

MANY guys have got their SOs pregnant during HEAVY cycles. Either the kids are fathered by a surrogate, lol, or their AAS use even whilst on didn’t have the effect the books say it does.

Go figure.

I also have read case studies of 8+ year continuous users who were able to conceive after a simple Clomid/HMG/HCG protocol.

But there are other reasons for not staying on high doses year round, namely diminishing returns.

I have my athletes drop to a high physiological dose (150-250mg/wk) for approx 6 weeks between theire phase I and phase II periods. This allows their body to learn to retain muscle on reduced androgen loads, so that when they start their new phase II stack, they experience a new surge/effect.

Hope this answers your question.

BBB

[quote]Rational Gaze wrote:
Basically, what BBB is too modest to say is that you need to fly him out ASAP. If I had the money and I was competing, I know I’d be taking a trip to Wales (for the naked butlering, obviously).[/quote]

Dunno where you are located in the UK, but I now have a treatment room and regulr slot at a BBers gym in Sheffield. Will be setting up a proper clinic with rehab gym in Nottingham within 9 months hopefully. Would be AWESOME to meet/treat you and have a couple of shandys over a whole nandos chicken or a fat steak somewhere!

I have a guy in Sheffield who I shall be prepping for a show next year. He is 22stone (310lbs) and 6’6". Played pro rugby for 11 years and just needs a coach to tell him what to do, to combat the usual conflicting information overload you get from asking different people for advice :wink:

He asked me why he had plateued in weight. I asked him what he eats. There was almost no fat in his diet, so no wonder he wasn’t gaining. An easy fix - if you know what to look for and how to correct it :slight_smile:

BBB