T Nation

Finasol Ingrates

There’s a forum I’ve read on another website,
and there’s something that’s so weird I have
to post about it.

These guys are ALWAYS trashing Biotest and
T-mag… some of them even put anti-Biotest
hate slogans into their sigs. Some of them
even insult Bill Roberts, though often when they need to back anything up about steroids they have to cite him as their source of information.

Yet, they’re crazy about Finasol… but
do they ever once acknowledge who INVENTED
it? Namely, Bill Roberts? And where it
was published, on T-mag and the forum? Never.

It’s their loss missing out on quality Biotest
supps and the info in the mag and the Forum,
but the ingrate aspect of this rubs my rhubarb the wrong way. But what do you want from a bunch of losers.

Why on earth do they act this way?

Well, if you actually want to know…

Now, I don’t know which forums you’re talking
about for sure. I don’t myself have the time
for anything other than the T-mag forum, and
even that can be hard to keep up with sometimes. However, from what other people tell me, I think I know what you mean.

Here’s the deal. There are some groups – fortunately the T-mag forum is not one of them! – where there is very clique-ish and dog-pack-like behavior. It can even
tend to dominate these groups.

And there’s an individual in the supplement industry, accepted as a “head dog” in these cliques, who several years back had discussed with Tim Patterson the idea of Biotest selling his prohormone capsules. He was very enthused, and was very happy with Biotest when it seemed that project was a go. However, there was one problem… the prohormone capsules really did not work well, nowhere near like he represented. So Biotest chose not to carry them.

Instant and very vengeful enemy.

So this individual has constantly attacked
Biotest on every forum he participates in since then.

Also, there was an occurrence where one of our chemists involved in manufacturing called his company seeking technical advice since their 4-AD was clogging up the filters used in Androsol manufacture to a horrendous degree. Our chemist made the mistake of thinking he was just dealing with a reputable chemical supplier or something, rather than with someone who would use confidentially acquired info to rip off a product idea.

So in the context of the conversation on manufacturing, using what should have been privileged information he was receiving as our bulk supplier, this individual learned the formulation and method of Androsol (however, was mistaken as to thinking we would use IPM) and then ripped it off, even down
to the exact dosing. Until then, even as of only a few days before, he’d been planning on releasing a gel product.

Worst of all, when I wrote that this occurred,
having an e-mail from him to prove that he
indeed did receive this information from our
chemist, he publicly asserted that I was a liar
and he “received NO information” from our chemist.

I’m generally a patient person but my patience
does not extend to such individuals. That occurrence pretty much ended my interest in having any relationship with that individual.

So, this individual denounces Biotest and myself on these forums on a more-or-less constant basis. There are many people who
when in the wrong, for example, they have
stolen from you and then you call them on it,
turn on you with hatred. It’s a way of justifying themselves I suppose.

And, given pack-like behavior in these forums,
there are those who
want earn or maintain group approval by showing everyone that they follow the
“party line” on Biotest, established by
this individual. No one else has any actual
reason to be anti-Biotest, that I know of.
It all feeds off of one person ultimately.
Well, it also gets fed by a couple of other
competitors in the supplement industry but
they’re not the main factors by any means
in fueling this.

I hadn’t known about the sig lines including
these anti-Biotest sentiments: that’s pretty ridiculous but I guess fits in perfectly with the overall mentality.

And as you said, the loss is theirs.

As for their liking Finasol, most likely
they do not know that I am the inventor. It
doesn’t fit in with what they want to believe.

Nor, I suppose, does the efficacy of Androsol,
let alone MAG-10.

Just think about how
those compare to the “androstene” and “androdiol” capsules that were touted by that individual before Biotest made prohormones
work.

How often do you think they give Biotest
credit for that? So it’s not just Finasol
that they neglect credit for.

Anyway, more than enough said on that, but
that’s the reason for what you’re asking about. I wouldn’t lose
any sleep over it, nor certainly would I bother
“defending” myself among those individuals.
They’ve chosen what they want to believe.
If their beliefs work well for them, fine, or if they
miss out, that’s just too bad.

Oh, you mean “Pat the Rat.”

That does explain it!!!

Yep, sounds like old “PA” to me.

LOL. I was going to chime in and request some initials, but Bob32 and TEK were kind enough to provide them. Another interesting side note: These “Pack Rats” slammed Brock, Bill, and anything and everything associated with T-Mag when the MAG-10 ad campaigns started. According to them, there was no way that it would live up to the label claims. Ever since it’s release, however, they have been curiously quiet. I wonder why?

I’ve seen two distinct groups of T-Mag/Biotest haters. First there is the group of haters who are led by Biotest competitors, like PA. They know that the latest generation of supplements work, but are loyal followers of another company.
Members of the second group of haters, lets call him “hard-core guy”, steadfastly refuses to believe that a legal supplement can be effective. He spouts venom towards T-Mag/Biotest, but ironically he reads T-Mag regularly, as evidenced by his ability to quote every claim made by Tim, et. al. about new Biotest supplements. He jumps on every comparison of a supplement to a steroid or a pharmaceutical helper drug. He especially savors any claim of gains to be expected from using a new supplement. He was licking his chops at 20 pounds in 8 weeks w/ Mag-10.
For the most part, he hasn’t recovered from the emotional injuries inflicted on him by Bill Phillips. He read Muscle Media 2000 religiously, cover to cover, over and over, and believed every word. His trust was shattered by the claim that HMB feels just like Deca and subsequent shift to Body for Life. He might have been a steroid user back then, but for obvious reasons he was excited by the idea of a legal alternative. His magazine subscription ran for months after the focus change and was disgusted.


Hard-core guy is now a regular steroid user. As a result of his steroid use, he has made great gains. Now he scoffs at the idea that anything but steroids can be effective. He sees a similar writing style in T-Mag (duh, the editor-in-chief is the same), but is now inherently distrustful of all supplement companies. But that is fine, he isn’t part of Biotest’s target market. T-Mag/Biotest has realized that there is a nice sized market of guys looking for “steroid-like” gains, but for whatever reason, are unwilling to break the law. This group is entertained and educated by T-Mag, but also understand that Biotest pays the bills. They understand that there is something called “marketing.” Successful marketing creates interest in a product in an entertaining manner. The educated reader understands marketing for what it is, and he hasn’t become a chronic cynic.

KirkDig- Excellent observations! I’ll add one more. There is also a small group out there that, probably because of the whole Bill Phillips thing, distrust anyone making a living in this industry- writers, supplements makers, magazine owners, equipment makers etc. It sort of reminds me of the old punk rock movement. If a band got a record deal or even charged admission to their shows, they were no longer punk. They were sell outs. Some believe that about BB’ing too. If a person makes money, he is automatically evil. Not always the case of course. I think you can run a business without being a rat. I think T-mag and Biotest are part of a small group in this field that do that very well. PA, “Synthrax” and that “Tech” supplement company, well…let’s just say they enjoy their cheese. :slight_smile: