Is your post in regards to my most recent set of labs? If so…
I would agree with your first sentence if I was not on any prescriptions at all.
I’m currently using 250iu hCG daily and have been for 21 days. hCG is suppressive to the pituitary by means of producing plenty of estrogen (as seen above). Estrogen tells the pituitary to stop producing LH and FSH, so those low numbers are expected. At this time, the hCG is acting like LH and stimulating my testes to produce testosterone, not the pituitary.
Perhaps I misunderstood your post? Thank you for the reply!
perhaps then you are primary. Did not read all the way up. But a testicular ultrasound may be warranted. too much hcg can affect sensitivity of LH receptors as well.
Shouldn’t be primary, initial TT came back at 264. Follow up was 350. After a few days of hCG, TT went up to 552, and a few days ago came back at 438. So the testicles are reacting to hCG and producing more testosterone. That should make me secondary.
MRI was done today, results to follow next week (hopefully).
@anon10230041 Good point, it could be both… As mentioned above, I did have epididymitis which caused my left testicle to swell up to the size of a tennis ball way back ten years or so. Could have done damage. Never had the tell-tale high FSH though which a lot of guys with primary will get. Few cases of both primary and secondary that I’ve read about to tell if you/we would see that as well.
My major concern is that assuming labs are correct, my body is capable of producing 26mil sperm, but is now only doing a fraction of that with meds that are supposed to increase counts. Very confusing. Testosterone is less of an issue for me right now, I know TRT is in my future. I’m too young to deal with numbers in the 2-300’s. But, babies first, before my wife goes clinically insane.
And hey, for what it’s worth I think you’re better off not on Clomid seeing that the side effects are severe. Exogenous bioidentical testosterone is good for the body in the proper dose.
What dose of Clomid were you on? Did you ever experience visual disturbances with it? High estradiol?
@verne I do not follow you sir… Looks like an incomplete post?
Thats wonderful you are trying to have a baby! family life is great.
I was on clomid 25 eod. After 4 weeks on clomid I got a blood test that showed tt at 500. Once i saw that I started to ween myself off of clomid. While weening off I developed what i call an occasional pressure above my eye on the forehead. It would last a few seconds but happened several times in a day. I cant say for sure if it was the clomid.
But with my 500 TT, still having ED symptoms, i was getting off of it anyway. I did notice my hair growth improve greatly while on clomid, ed was better to. But i probably need to go above 500 tt to feel well in my case.
I would think if i was younger the clomid may have helped me get higher than 500 with young testes. Also while on clomid my e2 was at 20 SHBG went up to 27. I have a thread om here also, its actually one of the recent ones.
@verne Yeah I did a little more looking around today and saw that it takes a significant amount of time for sperm to maturate and become readily available after production… It seems rather impossible for 18 days of treatment to have any effect on sperm counts/motility/etc. Still worried that it’s enough time to cause a decline… But a couple more hours of trying to find a source to tell me hCG may decrease sperm and I’m empty handed… Every source I’ve read states hCG will do nothing, or increase numbers.
Even if sperm that’s produced now isn’t ready for a couple months or longer, I’m still worried with the decline in count for what would appear to be no reason. I would guess, but have no source to confirm, that depleting sperm counts is much easier done than creating them. It’s difficult for me to understand why Novembers analysis was ‘‘good’’ and Decembers is awful, without any changes in illness, lifestyle, diet, exercise, etc over the last three, maybe four months. Consistency over four months should yield consistent sperm numbers, no? Or at least close, I would think.
With that said, after taking a few breaths, I am going to continue hCG for now and have another semen analysis done at the end of January. That will be two full months of treatment. Any decline in numbers at that point will probably sway me from additional use of hCG.
Thank you for your response!
@anon10230041 E2 at 20?! Wow… I had E2 at 38 without supplementation while TT was 264. Can’t complain with that number.
Hard to say if the pain was associated with Clomid, but has it since returned?
I’m also from NY, capital region. Born and raised, and likely staying. I’d prefer a warmer climate, but the wife and I are settled in careers and our [small] family is around here.
Am downstate. And like you wife wants to stay close to her mom here and I
really want to move South! I want to wear shorts all year!
No more eye issues if that’s what it was. The clomid did almost double my
fsh which produces the sperm. I felt ok on clomid overall. It def made my
testes pushed to the Max since I noticed they got larger and very warm at
times.
Clomid is good for guys fertility issues. I would not start at more than 25
eod.
Anyway maybe we can chat one day. This stuff we go through is so
overwhelming at times. All the reading… Merry .
Glad to hear Clomid did well for you in the way of pituitary secretions… I was originally prescribed 25mg ED, but would have definitely done EOD or 12.5 EOD more than likely…
Thanks for all the support! Merry Christmas to you as well!
It stinks that there is such a long delay. 30 years ago my wife and I seemed to have a fertility problem. I went in for a sperm count and bang, low count low motility all bad. We proceeded assuming I had a low count. They would try artificial insemination. I went in that frist time and apparently my sperm count was twice average and motility was normal. Two months before the first test I was fighting pneumonia with 106 degree fever
I had my MRI done about a week and a half ago, just before Christmas. What an experience… They had me sweating for a while knowing I have previously had a bullet in my leg and a few years as a welder (supposedly welders can have tiny bits of metal in their skin and/or eyes which will shift inside your tissues when exposed to an MRI magnet). None the less, I had no issues.
Results were given to me over the phone by a nurse stating images showed normal structures. No adenomas or other masses.
Although this is technically good news, I’m still offered no explanation for my issues…
Once again, Prolactin numbers from my previous bloods came in late. It is as follows:
Prolactin: 23.6 NG/ML (4.0-15.2)
This is quite high, and offers a possible explanation for my complete lack of libido and difficulty obtaining and maintaining an erection, even mid coitus. With that said, I don’t have much nipple sensitivity, itching, or typical ‘‘breast’’ symptoms. I will be consulting with my Endo about Cabergoline. Next appointment is in 8 days.
**A note for anyone prescribed Pregnyl - Allegedly there is a nationwide shortage. My pharmacy, CVS, has given me hell trying to keep up with my prescription. Fortunately I have had no lapse in treatment due to having multiple sources of hCG, however, CVS failed to order a refill of Pregnyl when I requested, and two weeks later they called stating it’s back ordered indefinitely offering no resolution.
Doing a bit of searching online, this has happened a few times historically. I would recommend suggesting your Dr. prescribe a different brand.
It’s from the idiot doctors prescribing it (and the foolish people thinking it works) for the HCG diet. There was a big shortage of it last year or the year before, even the generic. I mean, of course you’re going to lose weight on 500/kcal a day…for a while.
Yeah, the MRI is no fun, even if you don’t have any metal in you!
Had a follow up with the Endocrinologist today. Doc was pleased with above listed testosterone numbers as far as fertility concerns. He’s not convinced my prolactin and estrogen numbers are accurate from the IVF clinic due to lack of physical symptoms. More labs were taken today to confirm. Until then I guess nothing will be done about it, which is aggravating because I know both numbers are sky high.
The good news is that he did prescribe hMG today (Menopur) to give the sertoli cells a needed boost. Well, I guess that’s good and bad. Insurance wouldn’t cover rFSH, which is ideal because it is 100% FSH, but insurance does cover the hMG. Like most hMG solutions, Menopur consists of equal parts LH (which I’m already taking via hCG) and FSH. 75iu of each. Prescription is for Menopur EOD (3x per week).
I don’t expect to feel any change with hMG, though I will report any if experienced. My experience with daily hCG has been good with the exception of decreased libido and ability to keep and maintain errections - probably due to E2 and prolactin - Otherwise, mental clarity and ability to maintain muscle mass has continued.
I will post new lab sets when they are released to me.
Anyone here have experience with Menopur or hMG in general?
A bodybuilder friend of mine has suggested the same. He uses one particular source which I feel safe using, as a last resort. I wont discuss sources here due to forum rules, but if you guys can figure out how to personal message, I’ll list the one that I would feel comfortable using based on friends who use them. AI’s, both Arimidex and Aromasin, are prescription only but not classified as controlled substances in NY state… Probably because you need to be careful using them. You are messing with hormones, after all.
My issue is more the prolactin rather than estrogen. Rumor has it, estrogen controls prolactin, but my E2 has only gone up a few points while prolactin has doubled.
Cabergoline, the most aggressive and effective prolactin limiter from my understanding, is also not a controlled substance and readily available through RC sources. I just don’t know enough about it and honestly, haven’t asked my Endo specifically for it at this time. I was just happy to get hMG after being denied by my Urologist, and told that there’s no way insurance would cover it.
.