T Nation

Feeling Lethargic On Cycle

Ive been B&C’ing for around 6 months now.
Currently i am on:

150mg Test Prop EOD
80mg Winny ED
100mcg T3
0.5mg adex ED
500iu hCG 2x/wk

My problem however is LETHARGY. I feel absolutely drained during the day, very low energy and I have to live off stims.
My BP is normal, so ive kind of ruled that out. What else could it be?

SB

also, isn’t your hCG a little high?

I can’t help with your problem (although if I were a betting man I’d put money on the T3), but as a small aside, how’re you liking B&C in general? I’m considering taking the plunge next year.

Maybe too much adex?

too much Adex does it for me, it makes me really not want to deal with anything

i personally cant take enough adex… i quit using it…

rds, B&C is ok not bad. The test euphoria feeling you get used to which is a bummer.

Too much adex, hmm I was thinking too little adex? No gyno syptoms.

SB

I am by no means an expert and your lethargy could be coming from so may things but one thing I have noticed from guys that I have trained or trained with is when they are cutting and being really anal with caloric intake when their fats get to low this happens. You do need a certain amount of fat for healthy brain function, protect nerve tissue, proper sleep and muscle recovery. Also many vitamins are fat soluble and your body cant use them without certain fats being present. Maybe try bumping up your fat intake for a few days and see how you feel.
Thats my 2 cents, but in our economy is only worth like 1/17 of a peso.

Hope you can figure it out and get to feeling better!

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:
rds, B&C is ok not bad. The test euphoria feeling you get used to which is a bummer.

Too much adex, hmm I was thinking too little adex? No gyno syptoms.

SB[/quote]

Do you think maybe it’s just you being exhausted from the amount of strain you’re putting your body under? I’m thinking that say you lift at 100% for a few months then you start your cycle and go to maybe 110% as compared to your previous intensity, that shit can take a huge toll on your well being. If you’re getting enough sleep and eating well this is unlikely, but it’s worth thinking about.

If it was me I’d back off on the adex and see how I feel

[quote]lbraga wrote:

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:
rds, B&C is ok not bad. The test euphoria feeling you get used to which is a bummer.

Too much adex, hmm I was thinking too little adex? No gyno syptoms.

SB[/quote]

Do you think maybe it’s just you being exhausted from the amount of strain you’re putting your body under? I’m thinking that say you lift at 100% for a few months then you start your cycle and go to maybe 110% as compared to your previous intensity, that shit can take a huge toll on your well being. If you’re getting enough sleep and eating well this is unlikely, but it’s worth thinking about.[/quote]

Good post as this is a big possibility as well.

I still reckon it’s the T3. If you google “T3 lethargy” there’s loads of people claim to suffer from it

rds,

I have never heard that before but your right. There seems to be a connection to lethargy and t3. Although when most of the guys commented on feeling like shit on t3 they were either on Tren or carb cutting as well. I think it could be the main culprit though. Almost looks like once most go above 25mcg a day the sides increase drastically. Learn something new every day, good find.

LOL definitely the T3. 100 mcg/day? That is 4x the normal ‘replacement dose’. You are probably draining the shit out of your cortisol to keep up. Taper it down to 50 mcg over the next week and see how that works out for ya.

Some good points here. The fat intakr is something I overlooked.
The t3 is not something i overlooked i was just loving leaning out i was actually going to soldier it and up the dose.
VT, what would be point of running something close to the replacement dose for a cutting purpose?

SB

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:
i was actually going to soldier it and up the dose. [/quote]

you are one crazy dude. Makes for some interesting threads

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:

VT, what would be point of running something close to the replacement dose for a cutting purpose?

SB[/quote]

I can’t see a point in doing that. Which is why I recommended you take 50 mcg, which is 2x the replacement dose :slight_smile:

If you get to 75 and start feeling better, try that out for a while. Otherwise, taper down to 50. From what I’ve read you should be able to tolerate that easily.

Alternatively, Bill Roberts actually advocates a very unusual T3 regimen of only 12.5 mcg/day. I’m not sure I agree, as it seems that (like with exogenous test) an exogenous source of T3 would just result in feedback lowering your natural production. But Bill is really fucking smart and experienced, so I don’t want to say he’s wrong. Worth a try at any rate.

yeah I remember reading what Bill said about that a while ago. If I remember correctly, it’s because the thyroid doesn’t shut down in the same way as the HPTA. I’ll try and remember where I read it and post it here

[quote]rds63799 wrote:
yeah I remember reading what Bill said about that a while ago. If I remember correctly, it’s because the thyroid doesn’t shut down in the same way as the HPTA. I’ll try and remember where I read it and post it here[/quote]

Yeah, but it doesn’t really make sense physiologically. Both Test and Thyroid production signals originate at the Hypothalmus, sending signals to the pituitary to produce the hormones. It doesn’t make sense in my head why this process would apply to one and not the other.

[quote]VTBalla34 wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:
yeah I remember reading what Bill said about that a while ago. If I remember correctly, it’s because the thyroid doesn’t shut down in the same way as the HPTA. I’ll try and remember where I read it and post it here[/quote]

Yeah, but it doesn’t really make sense physiologically. Both Test and Thyroid production signals originate at the Hypothalmus, sending signals to the pituitary to produce the hormones. It doesn’t make sense in my head why this process would apply to one and not the other.[/quote]

me either, if I was to run T3 I’d run it at 50mg. My thinking is that if you are going to shut down, might as well have something to show for it. Kinda like how we all facepalm when someone starts a thread here saying “I’m going to use 200mg of test a week”.

Bill Roberts knows more about this than me though.