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Fats and Carbs - I'm Confused!

Alright, I’ve been hangin around these forums for a few months now and I’m getting mighty confused. First I’ll start with with my goal… a permanent 6 pack. I have muscle (benching close to 300 while deadlift and squat not being shabby either), and I’ve gotten it before but it was on very strict calories and I lost quite a bit of strength and muscle. I know for a fact that low-carb diets work wonders for me… but everything I read says that they are not good for the long run.

So, what I’m wondering is… should I do a permanently low carb diet and have my primary source of fuel being fat? For example a ketogenic diet? Or, lets says I decided to start gaining muscle again, should I still include all the eggs and whatnot along with the carbs if I decide to have my primary source of fuel being clean carbs?

See this is all very confusing to me and I know that mixing fats and carbs is no good. So it would seem that I need to decide between one and the other as a fuel source in order to reach my goals.

Also I have quite a bit of knowledge about the low-carb diets… but not much about low-fat diets. This is all really eating at my brain and it seems that I just need some more info and possible experience that other people have went through with either the low-carb or low-fat diets.

If it is going to stress you out, maybe you should look at nutrient timing, such that your carbs are mostly in the morning or post-workout, while the rest of the day you eat a lot of protein and fats (with some fruits and vegetables).

I agree with vroom its more about timing and type if goping for a life long diet strike a healthy balance.

Hell I mix healthy fats and carbs along with protein at every meal. I dont have a six pack as of now due to the fact Im shoveling huge amounts of food down my face to gain strength size and weight but even when cut I wouldnt drop healthy carbs like fruit etc for the long term

as long as you are still eating plenty of fruits and vegetables, then you dont need to worry about the issues you hear about with “low carb diets”.

Ketosis is stressful on the body, that is true, but if you are eating plenty of veggies and fruits throughout the day you dont have to worry about it.

Eating plenty of fat(polyunsaturated really), is a surefire way at getting lean fast.

Some good things for getting lean “high” fat diets do:

  1. upregulate the peroxisome enzymes to carry out B-oxidation(fat burning).
  2. polyunsaturated sources of fats signal the liver to halt fatty acid synthesis. They also consume the chemicals necessary to make fats(NADPH), basically using more energy.

some bad things high carbs do:

  1. Raise concentrations of NADPH(needed to make fat) and signal production of fat by ribulose-5-p.
    2.Malonyl-CoA, raises in response to a high carbohydrate meal, mainly by the action of insulin. Which completely halts B-oxidation.
  2. Malonyl-CoA is also the chief component needed to make fat, you use this to build chains of fat.

just eat plenty of whole food, including vegetables.

[quote]consumer wrote:
as long as you are still eating plenty of fruits and vegetables, then you dont need to worry about the issues you hear about with “low carb diets”.

Ketosis is stressful on the body, that is true, but if you are eating plenty of veggies and fruits throughout the day you dont have to worry about it.

Eating plenty of fat(polyunsaturated really), is a surefire way at getting lean fast.

Some good things for getting lean “high” fat diets do:

  1. upregulate the peroxisome enzymes to carry out B-oxidation(fat burning).
  2. polyunsaturated sources of fats signal the liver to halt fatty acid synthesis. They also consume the chemicals necessary to make fats(NADPH), basically using more energy.

some bad things high carbs do:

  1. Raise concentrations of NADPH(needed to make fat) and signal production of fat by ribulose-5-p.
    2.Malonyl-CoA, raises in response to a high carbohydrate meal, mainly by the action of insulin. Which completely halts B-oxidation.
  2. Malonyl-CoA is also the chief component needed to make fat, you use this to build chains of fat.

just eat plenty of whole food, including vegetables.[/quote]

That’s ridiculous, bordering on fear mongering. NADPH is a result of glycolysis - of course it will raise in response to carbohydrate, it’s how the electron transfer happens. Duh.

And although my biochem isn’t advanced enough to know how malonyl-CoA or B-oxidation work, it seems intuitive that the presence of carbohydrate would halt lypolysis - your body uses two food sources, glycogen or fat.

OH NOES FAT CONSUMPTION HALTS GLYCOLYSIS!

[quote]LoneLobo wrote:
consumer wrote:
as long as you are still eating plenty of fruits and vegetables, then you dont need to worry about the issues you hear about with “low carb diets”.

Ketosis is stressful on the body, that is true, but if you are eating plenty of veggies and fruits throughout the day you dont have to worry about it.

Eating plenty of fat(polyunsaturated really), is a surefire way at getting lean fast.

Some good things for getting lean “high” fat diets do:

  1. upregulate the peroxisome enzymes to carry out B-oxidation(fat burning).
  2. polyunsaturated sources of fats signal the liver to halt fatty acid synthesis. They also consume the chemicals necessary to make fats(NADPH), basically using more energy.

some bad things high carbs do:

  1. Raise concentrations of NADPH(needed to make fat) and signal production of fat by ribulose-5-p.
    2.Malonyl-CoA, raises in response to a high carbohydrate meal, mainly by the action of insulin. Which completely halts B-oxidation.
  2. Malonyl-CoA is also the chief component needed to make fat, you use this to build chains of fat.

just eat plenty of whole food, including vegetables.

That’s ridiculous, bordering on fear mongering. NADPH is a result of glycolysis - of course it will raise in response to carbohydrate, it’s how the electron transfer happens. Duh.

And although my biochem isn’t advanced enough to know how malonyl-CoA or B-oxidation work, it seems intuitive that the presence of carbohydrate would halt lypolysis - your body uses two food sources, glycogen or fat.

OH NOES FAT CONSUMPTION HALTS GLYCOLYSIS![/quote]

technically speaking, in mammalian cells all glycolytic enzymes that utilize the NAD cofactor specifically use NAD and not NADP.

NADP comes from pentose monophospate pathway and from malic enzyme.

whats ridiculous?

LoneLobo, I think consumer may be right. I did do a high carb diet for a while, and I noticed that I had dandruff big time. Then I switched to low-carb for a while, and the dandruff went away. The change happened in about a month. I did some research on it and found that dandruff can be caused by lack of vitamin B6. So if consumer is correct, then I may have been having a vitamin B difficiency…

On a different note, I’ve been talking with some other people and reading more studies… all this has conviced me that the high-fat/low-carb lifestyle is the way to go in order to ensure long term health. I’ll be doing a cyclic diet though so its not going to be ketogenic (I still read bad things about those!) So thank you all for your help.

-Bizmark