T Nation

Fat Loss and Estrogen

These are actually two questions.

  1. Brock talked about how his estrogen levels went down after having hip/buttock fat liposuctioned. Does it work the other way? That is, by taking something like vitex to reduce estrogen, will hip and buttock fat shed more easily for men? (I have a hard time with this area)
  2. For those of you with upper limits for %bodyfat, what do you use? %8? 10? Just curious. Also, what then is your lower bound?

This is something I’d like to hear some opinions on as well…

nephorm: This is always a great question. These are the ROUGH numbers I use based on reading a LOT of diet and nutrition info and based on my own personal experience. I have found that there is some disagreement among experts, but not profoundly so:

ESSENTIAL FAT:


Male 3% Female 3%


OBESE:


Male >25% Female >30%


AVERAGE:


Male 15-20% Female 20-25%


GOOD SHAPE:


Male 10-15% Female 15-20%


EXCELLENT SHAPE:


Male 8-10% Female 10-15%


RIPPED/CONTEST/PHOTO SHAPE:


Male 5-6% Female 8-10%


(Be VERY suspicious of those gym trolls bagging about these 2 and 3 % BFpercentages. These are ususally the guys who also have the 22 inch Guns)!

Mufasa, any insight on the first question?

thanks!

Brock had his hip/buttock fat liposuctioned? Nothing wrong with that (obviously) but I’d like to hear that story.

This is based on some scientific input and also my observations from body composition measurements that I’ve performed. Fat storage that predominates on the hips, buttocks, thighs is a more female fat distribution pattern. Is it because of estrogen. Sherwood’s “Human Physiology 3rd Ed.” indicates this. Brock alsoo says that after lipo, his E levels went down. That would indicate that some E is produced in adipose tissue. From what I could find, estrogen is produced in the andrenal cortex, ovaries and placenta. I just don’t have a source to confirm if estrogen is produced in adipose tissue, but it seems reasonable. Anyway, my point is that if you lower estrogen, you may be able limit further fat development around the hips and buttocks. It may also help you get rid of the fat there, by shifting the hormonal balance in the body to a more male like ratio. So if you block E and continue to overeat, you might be more prone to abdominal fat deposits, but if you block E, train hard and diet hard, it should help get rid of hip and buttock fat. Just speculating. Obviously, adding M to your cutting cylce will either help or do nothing. It will not hinder results. Biotest has the money back guarantee, so give it a shot.

My understanding from the latest research talked about here is that hip/butt fat tends to aromatize T to estrogen, but estrogen tends to encourage abdominal fat storage. (Sorta makes sense if you think about it.) If you lower estrogen, I would think you would tend to lose abdominal fat first. Is this right? I’d like to know also.

Fat cells contain aromatase and nonovarian estrogen production from adrenal androgens in fat cells, muscle and bone, among other tissues, is the major contributor to estrogen production in post-menopausal women. Obese individuals have higher estrogen via this mechanism and this contributes to the risk of breast and prostate cancer, which has a higher incidence in overweight individuals.

I don’t want this to sound like I’m being a
dick, just trying to be accurate: fat cells
don’t “contain” aromatase, but they do
produce aromatase. In fact, adipose cells
are one of the major sources of aromatase
in human males. The more adipose you have,
the more aromatase you have. This is why so
many fat guys grow tits - literally (gyno).
Perhaps this is also why gyno is not very
common in the very lean. It likely ends up in
a viscious cycle where more fat = more
aromatase = more estrogen = more fat etc…

I'm not aware of any controlled studies specifically on elevated estrogen levels causing fat gain, but it might be a reasonable assumption. (There could be studies on the estrogen causes fat increase, just that I am not aware of them.) Especially since there is a lot of anecdotal evidence that arimadex can help with "problem fat" areas. I, among many others have noticed this.

hi guys, I’m 23 and have the same problem as Nephorm(fat on hips and buttock), but do I gain weight very easily because my E level has always been high or only because of my very slow metabolism, maybe that it’s both??? I don’t know but I’ve always been overweight and each time I was loosing weight, my hips and buttock were still the same, very fat, but I was loosing weight from everywhere else, I heard about M, MD6, arimadex, yohimbe, yohimbe fuel… Do you Know somethin’ about these supplements??? should I have my E level checked???
Thanx for answering all these questions Bros.