T Nation

Fat Fast Help

Hi guys, this is the scenario and my questions, please help.

BioDetails:
5’10, 170lbs, ~18%bfat.

So I’m on the Fat Fast:

  1. 6 meals a day:
    meal 1,4 - 50gm prot. shake, no carbs.
    meal 2,5 - 2 spoons flax oil in metamucil with water.
    meal 3 - tuna and cheese
    meal 4 - 2 small grilled chicken pieces.
    Calorie intake <1300.

I’m also taking 4 hot rox a day and drinking close to 3L or 100oz(0.8gal)
taking 2 multivitamins as well.

Situation:
I’ve been on the FFast for 11 days now and I’ve lost 9lbs.
1.Is my version of it alright? I’ve been reading the forums and it warns that “one should know how to get off it.” This worries me slightly.
2. How do I get sufficient minerals? Like my two daily multivits have like 4% Potassium. I’m starting to cramp while cardio.
3. 4 weeks should be enough for this right?
4. Is there anything I can improve or change or something, any advice?

Thank you,

Prakrit

ttt, guys,

someone has to know about ffast,

it might be killing me!

if i lost that much weight in that short of a time period id start shooting grams of various testosterone esters into my ass!

i say get off of it and go for the t-dawg 2.0 or the dont diet. imo you need to add some muscle mass anyway. starving yourself will set you back even further.

Gotta agree with P-Dog, although without a photo it’s tough to say. Still, in general, for the long term you need more mass to up your daily caloric needs. Otherwise, you end up chasing your tail by continually trying to lower calories in order to burn fat.

But if you insist on sticking to it, I’d try to combine the P + F foods in each meal…for example, take half the protein with half the flax oil, then do the same again in your next meal. It’ll help blunt your hunger, and also keep your body from taking the pure protein feeds and using the aminos as fuel. I’d have to re-read your post again, but are you also on any andros? It’d be a bitch to diet that strictly and not waste muscle mass without Mag-10 or the like.

from my experience of fat fast, not worth it , too much of a price to pay in terms lethargy and lack of energy, workout intensity and muscle loss, t-dawg the way to go IMO

I should have added that, under the right circumstances, I am a big fan of Fat Fast. I had really good results from it back in the fall (39 days on it…I stopped for Thanksgiving…and lost about 20 pounds with no strength loss). I used T-dawg to ease back into carbs, and only gained back about 4 pounds after the transition.

Still, FF isn’t a life style. It’s like the nuclear bomb of diets, to be employed only in the direst of emergencies. You’re still gonna need a long-term approach to staying lean and gaining muscle.

BTW, I took potassium supps while on FF…couldn’t get through a leg workout without them.

I got to agree. You should re-evaluate your process. Yes you are going to lose weight but much of it will be in the form of LBM. You are going to come out of this with a suppressed meto and less LBM that will also lower it.

18% isnt that high. Go for something more moderate that will allow you to slowly lose BF and atleast maintain LBM if not make gains.

Hope that helps.

Check out Tdawg2

Phill

Hi everyone,

thanks for the replies.

I’ve only started lifting and getting into the fitness culture recently. I read enough sources that I should either concentrate on bulking up or cutting down but both together doesnt work.

My current plan is to be close to 10% bfat at about 150 by march. Then I intend to do a good bulking cycle for about 8 weeks and then cut again in a more moderate fashion.

My eventual goal is to be as strong as possible at around the 160 neighbourhood, while maintaining ~10% bodyfat.

I kind of like sticking to the fat fast now, its become a challenge. I’m not taking androsol or anything but with weights, I’m still improving the numbers consistently. The fat fast does work, I believe so why are so many people not fond of it?

Thanks and I know I probably sound quite uneducated about all this, but I am so thats okay.

Prakrit Jena

ttt

I agree with p-dog if you lose that much weight that fast you can bet you losing muscle. As everbody said the t-dawg or don’t diet the way to go. The fast fat works better if you are really fat.
Myself I would not even do it unless I had a shit load of gear.

[quote]My current plan is to be close to 10% bfat at about 150 by march. Then I intend to do a good bulking cycle for about 8 weeks and then cut again in a more moderate fashion.{//quote}

This yoy approach is very overrated. You are simply going to be in a state of either losing fat and lbm on your choice of extreme hypocaloric cuts, then follow that with a massive eating phase where your body is going to store a large amount of fat in order to keep itself alive during the next fast you put it through.

Your goal may be to gain size and strength but your bodies #1 goal is to survive. I would suggest looking into a more moderate approach. You cant build a perfect physique overnight.

Whenyou come off the fat fast you are going to need to slowly reintroduce simple things first, like FOOD. If you go straight to bulking you will gain nothing but fat. Your body is going to store fat until it reaches a natural level befor you gain muscle.

Get your metabolism straight. Maybe even a month or so. Then do a couple weeks of massive training /eating followed by MONTHS of slower bulking to gain solid mass you can keep.

Bulk because you want to, cut only when you have/need too.

Just my 2cc.
Phill

Prakit, I’m about to do something controversial…I’m posting a link to an article from the Atkins website for you, right here on T-mag!

Actually, this is a great article about the Fat Fast (Atkins style), but the important part you should understand is this:

It’s only meant to “kick start” weight loss, and it includes SOLID food meals only.

Those are the two problems I have with your approach. Your shakes should be in addition to solid food meals (extra protein), not in place of them…especially while on the fat fast! Also, I’d bump up the number of meals to 7 or 8 (every 2 hours or so) and also increase calories to about 1300-1600 per day, depending on how long you are on the diet. This way, your getting a faster metabolism, and more protein and fat to burn. The switch to T-Dawg 2.0 or a Berardi style diet, like the “no-diet diet.”

Finally, make sure you use the diet as a short-term tool only, not as the way to get “lean.” I’d say end it when you get within 15 pounds of your fat-loss goal, or after 4 weeks…whichever comes first. If you’re on the Fat Fast longer than that, you’ll lose too much LBM, and probably go crazy, too.

I did. ;-}

Good luck!

Hi guys,

thanks for all the information, there’s a lot more to this
than I had thought.

  1. When Strasser did his fat fast and didnt lose any lbm, was that primarily due to the Androsol sprays then?

  2. 18%bfat is pretty bad really and I like the idea Phill suggested about doing a month or so to get my metabolism etc back in order, then massive training for a month or so and then slower bulking. I like it greatly.

3.LittleJay, my liquid meal concept was patterned on Strasser’s proteinshake/tuna/oil method. I’m 160 now and dropping fast, I’ll end the fat fast in a total of 21 days at around 150 or so. Then maybe get into standard eating mode slowly with T-Dawg I think.

  1. I havent lifted much before etc etc and so the concept of losing muscle etc isnt worrying me too much, maybe it should. Also, hot rox has to be helping a ton I believe, since I drink a very large amount of water now.

  2. Would I lose LBM if I’m still lifting heavily and taking protein before and after?

Thanks again,
“its day 13 and pizza sounds rather good”

Prakrit Jena

To keep it short yes the Ardro was a major contributor to not losing LBM. You have to face it while the Hot Rox is going to help some You are going to slow your metabolism and you are going to lose LBM.

Even on moderate hypocaloric diets the most you can usually hope for is to maintain your LBM. It is rare to actually make gains while cutting. That has been one of the major factors to Tdawg2 becoming so popular. Quite a few ppl have accheived either maintaining or making moderate gains.

By the way, when you do get to bulking I would keep the Massive phases to 2 week intervals. Load up for two weeks, hit some to a days and such then stop befor you reach a point of overtraining. Go back to a more moderate bulk for a month or so then hit it hard again for a week or two, Etc… This will not only give your body a break from the massive training but also allow you to solidify the quick gains you made.

Hope that helps.
Phill

Prakit, the easiest explanation as to why LBM is lost while dieting is because you’re not fueling the body’s needs to maintain it. That’s long been accepted as an “inevitable” fact of dieting, but now diets like T Dawg and JB’s No-Diet Diet are thumbing their noses at those long-held notions. Also, any “anabolic” agent like MAG-10 would help you keep your LBM while dieting with the Fat Fast.

As far as why you wouldn’t want to risk losing too much LBM, rememeber that extra muscle burns kcals for you, not to mention it just plain looks/feels better to have some extra mass for most of us…and muscle is harder to gain back than fat.

I’ve gone full circle with the diet thing: I was chiefly concerned with losing fat at first, now I care more about gaining mass. As such, I’ve had to accept a little more fat than I’d like, at least until I tweak my diet. It’s worth it!

Food = Strength!