Fat/ Carb Combo Still Relevant?

I often wonder if Arnold, Franco, or Sergio would have gotten so big had they had all this extra information to worry about???

[quote]sasquatch wrote:
I often wonder if Arnold, Franco, or Sergio would have gotten so big had they had all this extra information to worry about???[/quote]

That’s starting to become the lamest argument. I honestly think had they had all the information we have now they probably would have gotten bigger faster.

[quote]eengrms76 wrote:
sasquatch wrote:
I often wonder if Arnold, Franco, or Sergio would have gotten so big had they had all this extra information to worry about???

That’s starting to become the lamest argument. I honestly think had they had all the information we have now they probably would have gotten bigger faster.[/quote]

Yet, most people even with all of this ‘knowledge’ are NO WHERE NEAR that level of development even if they follow their anabolic usage. How many people at your gym would actually qualify as “huge”? How many look like they are just brimming with tons of new info that allows them to grow faster than the guys who were just mentioned? Hell, how many on this site would impress the average serious gym rat with their muscle development? If we blame that all on genetics, then what the hell happened to the genes of the last generation?

[quote]eengrms76 wrote:
sasquatch wrote:
I often wonder if Arnold, Franco, or Sergio would have gotten so big had they had all this extra information to worry about???

That’s starting to become the lamest argument. I honestly think had they had all the information we have now they probably would have gotten bigger faster.[/quote]

What information did they not have that would have made a significant difference in their physiques? Seriously, what are the “big things” we know but they didn’t know?

[quote]Professor X wrote:
eengrms76 wrote:
sasquatch wrote:
I often wonder if Arnold, Franco, or Sergio would have gotten so big had they had all this extra information to worry about???

That’s starting to become the lamest argument. I honestly think had they had all the information we have now they probably would have gotten bigger faster.

Yet, most people even with all of this ‘knowledge’ are NO WHERE NEAR that level of development even if they follow their anabolic usage. How many people at your gym would actually qualify as “huge”? How many look like they are just brimming with tons of new info that allows them to grow faster than the guys who were just mentioned? Hell, how many on this site would impress the average serious gym rat with their muscle development? If we blame that all on genetics, then what the hell happened to the genes of the last generation?[/quote]

It’s one thing to have the knowledge, it’s a completely different thing to know how to apply it, and still another to have the dedication to follow it through. I agree- there aren’t many on this site that do (including myself).

[quote]CaliforniaLaw wrote:
eengrms76 wrote:
sasquatch wrote:
I often wonder if Arnold, Franco, or Sergio would have gotten so big had they had all this extra information to worry about???

That’s starting to become the lamest argument. I honestly think had they had all the information we have now they probably would have gotten bigger faster.

What information did they not have that would have made a significant difference in their physiques? Seriously, what are the “big things” we know but they didn’t know?[/quote]

That’s a tough question to answer CL. I don’t know what they knew. I know they didn’t put a great deal of concern with preventing injuries or recovery like we do now. That alone could have helped.

A trainer at my gym whom I’ve come to accept as a nice guy used to train with Arnold, and even competed against him in the Olympia back in the day, even agrees with me. He told me back then he personally didn’t know even 10% of what he knows now about nutrition. Now he’s not huge anymore, but hell he’s almost 60.

[quote]eengrms76 wrote:
sasquatch wrote:
I often wonder if Arnold, Franco, or Sergio would have gotten so big had they had all this extra information to worry about???

That’s starting to become the lamest argument. I honestly think had they had all the information we have now they probably would have gotten bigger faster.[/quote]

I think you missed my point.

My inference was they DIDN’T worry about the minutia and perfection. They ate. They trained. They slept. They injected. Full day. Not about what food combinations in what ratios and exactly at what times they should eat.
Is there a 30 minute window after working out or a 90? Can I eat my cottage cheese and take ZMA within 45 minutes? At exactly what time at night do I reduce or stop carb intake?..Blah,blah,blah.

So many on here haven’t mastered the basics of consistancy and intensity, yet look for perfect nutrition and supps, when in fact these are the last little bits you need to know. When trying to dial in your physique for a contest, yah, but to look good naked as is so popular here or for general health and fitness, these are really only details that matter if everything else is freakin spot on.

[quote]sasquatch wrote:
eengrms76 wrote:
sasquatch wrote:
I often wonder if Arnold, Franco, or Sergio would have gotten so big had they had all this extra information to worry about???

That’s starting to become the lamest argument. I honestly think had they had all the information we have now they probably would have gotten bigger faster.

I think you missed my point.

My inference was they DIDN’T worry about the minutia and perfection. They ate. They trained. They slept. They injected. Full day. Not about what food combinations in what ratios and exactly at what times they should eat.
Is there a 30 minute window after working out or a 90? Can I eat my cottage cheese and take ZMA within 45 minutes? At exactly what time at night do I reduce or stop carb intake?..Blah,blah,blah.

So many on here haven’t mastered the basics of consistancy and intensity, yet look for perfect nutrition and supps, when in fact these are the last little bits you need to know. When trying to dial in your physique for a contest, yah, but to look good naked as is so popular here or for general health and fitness, these are really only details that matter if everything else is freakin spot on.
[/quote]

I am sure most of the people on this site are elite competitors tying to perfect those last rough edges before they take on the rest of the world. Either that or they aren’t making much progress at all and talking about this shit makes them feel like they are making up for that. One of the two.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
sasquatch wrote:
eengrms76 wrote:
sasquatch wrote:
I often wonder if Arnold, Franco, or Sergio would have gotten so big had they had all this extra information to worry about???

That’s starting to become the lamest argument. I honestly think had they had all the information we have now they probably would have gotten bigger faster.

I think you missed my point.

My inference was they DIDN’T worry about the minutia and perfection. They ate. They trained. They slept. They injected. Full day. Not about what food combinations in what ratios and exactly at what times they should eat.
Is there a 30 minute window after working out or a 90? Can I eat my cottage cheese and take ZMA within 45 minutes? At exactly what time at night do I reduce or stop carb intake?..Blah,blah,blah.

So many on here haven’t mastered the basics of consistancy and intensity, yet look for perfect nutrition and supps, when in fact these are the last little bits you need to know. When trying to dial in your physique for a contest, yah, but to look good naked as is so popular here or for general health and fitness, these are really only details that matter if everything else is freakin spot on.

I am sure most of the people on this site are elite competitors tying to perfect those last rough edges before they take on the rest of the world. Either that or they aren’t making much progress at all and talking about this shit makes them feel like they are making up for that. One of the two.[/quote]

The other thing it’s done is actually set newbies back. How many 150lb guys won’t eat a peanut butter sandwhich because of P&C? How many worry about a high GI, so they won’t eat a piece of fruit or a potato?

[quote]sasquatch wrote:

The other thing it’s done is actually set newbies back. How many 150lb guys won’t eat a peanut butter sandwhich because of P&C? How many worry about a high GI, so they won’t eat a piece of fruit or a potato?[/quote]

Well, threads are being written right now about how telling a skinny kid they need to avoid falling into that trap is “whining”. We shouldn’t try to tell anyone to go back to the basics because we should cater to the wants and needs of every newbie who uses words like “toned” or who tries to make up for their lack of progress by reminding us how “relatively strong” they are compared to 5 year old Chinese girls in Hong Kong so we should respect them for it.

Who are we kidding. Pussies run this site…and I don’t mean the women. Most of them actually lift weights.

[quote]eengrms76 wrote:
That’s a tough question to answer CL. I don’t know what they knew. [/quote]

I’ve read every book Arnold and other greats wrote. Here’s what they knew: Eat several times a day, eat after you train, train hard. Eat big in the off season, and don’t worry so much about gaining fat. Cut off the weight near contest. Ie., bulk and cut for maximal gains.

Seriously, what else is there to know?

How? Did Arnold miss an Olympia due to an injury that could have been prevented by foam rolling?

I love my foam roller, and I get ART at least once a month. But I imagine the greats were getting at least some form of deep tissue work done frequently.

This brings us full circle: What new information do we have that, that the greats didn’t have, that would have made a statistically significant difference in their training?

You know, maybe some study will show that people who worry about every detail have higher levels of cortisol, which leads to decreased results in the gym. Maybe all of this new knowledge is actually counter-productive.

Has knowledge progressed? Sure. But it’s helpful, if at all, only at the margins.

[quote]CaliforniaLaw wrote:

People need to sweat more in the gym and less over the small stuff they read on the Internet.[/quote]

AMEN BROTHER!