I talked to a a friend of mine about this awhile back and I got this response.
"High amounts of carbs can lead to rebound hypoglycemia. This is a normal and healthy response to carbo-loading. A similar process (different MOA: mechanism of action) occurs with some fatty meals as well (e.g. turkey/tryptophan). Both lead to drowsiness and decreased blood perfusion to the muscles occurs due to competition with the gut (blood is diverted to the GI tract; how do you think nutrients are extracted from food?). In most cases, this effect is not life-threatening but weight lifters would definitely observe the negative effects on their maximal lifting potential while under the influence of a hypoglycemic episode (can also occur during starvation as well).
Overall I recommend consuming a small meal (vs. a large meal) at least one hour prior to engaging in weight lifting, aerobic training, or any kind of intense physical activity. Also do not work out while under “starvation” (> 20 hours without food) conditions either, if you are looking for maximal anabolic benefit."
[quote]With all due respect, Goldberg, the Westside guys are fat steroid users. (Not a slam, they admit to this openly.) What works for them may not work for those who don’t want to be fat and don’t use roids and actually care about their health and longevity.
I do understand the point you’re making when you post stuff like this (yes, we overcomplicate things sometimes), but we’re not all powerlifters who don’t care about excess fat gain and we don’t all have the genetics to eat like that without being disgusting piles of poop. :-)[/quote]
My thoughts exactly. I also second the fact that powerlifters shouldn’t be giving out nutritional advice or be telling people to “just eat” and train hard. Unless they are telling other powerlifters. If body composition is of no importance, then sure, eat whatever the hell you want. Of course, you may be jeopardizing your health as well. However, if bodyfat levels are important, then simplifying nutrition is not the answer.
This reminds me of stupid personal trainers that simplify nutrition (and training). The whole calories in vs. calories out argument. Sorry guys, but the body isn’t that simple.
I respect West Side. The system works no doubt. But these guys and a lot of other powerlifters for the most part 1) use steroids, 2) eat whatever the hell they want, 3) are fat, and 4) are most likely unhealthy. If 3 and 4 are not true, then it’s probably genetic.
Who gives a fuck? Do you really think the subtle difference between carbs or fat before a workout makes that much of a difference? The point is you’re eating before you work out…
Eat, work out. Go to bed.
If you’re worried about getting fat, do sprints on the track 3 times a week. Thats all you need.
two cents worth, i used to eat p+f before workouts (train at 8am) and could train fine, swapped over to P+C ( as suggested by JB for people who can’t wait three hours before training) and found that training was much better.
in short, neither made or breaked training but P+C works better for me and I’m losing fat at a very nice rate whilst eating carbs before and drinking carbs during and after training!
“Is true that…too much fat 2-3 hour before a workout can inhibit glycolysis to some extent and therefore decrease power output?”
Here is the guys original question. He was asking about power output. He didnt ask about body composition. THats why i said that it didnt seem to matter with them. Then everybody jumps on the powerlifters are fatasses bandwagon. If you want to talk about body compostition then having a p+f meal before you workout would probably be more beneficial. Is it gonna matter? NO.
And i do feel somewhat qualified to hand out nutrion advice, especially in regards to fat loss because i have gone from a fat ass to being lean. The only reason im not lean now is because then i would have to buy all new powerlifting equipment because nothing i have now would fit. That would be a good 300 dollars at the bare minimum. I believe some of you are severely mistaken here.
Eat something, and just try it out on yourself.
Why is everyone so afraid to deviate from what someone else says and do something new nowadays? T-Mag is not the source of all definitive truth and just because one person prefers one thing doesn’t mean it will make a bit of difference to another. If we are going to suck on semantics here, power output isn’t much of an issue to a bodybuilder since they aren’t doing a lot of ‘power’ work in general. Mostly lifting relatively heavy objects at a much higher intensity than optimal power output would occur at. Worry about if you are lifting right, worry about if you are eating clean foods, worry about if you are honestly using a program that provides well-rounded training. But for god’s sake, don’t stress out about if its P+C or P+F before workouts, just try it, write down how it felt in your journal, heck… try it for a month. Then compare. You have your entire life to learn what works for you.
That’s why I was careful in pointing out that it wasn’t you in particular that I was talking about. I respect your transformation, but you’re fairly unique among big guys in my experience. My larger point was that it’s generally better to ask the guy who’s made the biggest changes rather than just looking for the biggest guy and asking him. No offense intended in any way.
How do you know if a big guy wasnt once a small guy? I think this thinking that we shouldnt listen to the big guys is perpetuated by small guys to make them feel better about not being able to get big. You might want to listen to the big guy sometimes. He obviously did something right to get big whether it would work for you or not is a different story. It might, but you will never know if you shut them out just because they are bigger than you and obviously they were born that way.
You’re misreading what I was saying. I wasn’t saying not to listen to big guys; just that bigness isn’t necessarily proof of knowledge or that smallness isn’t necessarily proof of ignorance. Listen to big guys if what they’re saying is in line with what you know to be true; listen to small guys if what they’re saying is in line with what you know to be true. Ignore any big guy or small guy who’s clearly talking out of his ass. But listen to people because of their knowledge, not because of their size.
This is absoultely true. It never hurts to listen to someone big. Although, most big guys I’ve met don’t know much about nutrition (and even training) and can’t translate into words what they have done to get big.
Believe me, I’m another former small guy turned relatively big for my height (5’6", 190 with single-digit BF%). I’ll definitely stand by the idea that I’d rather ask a small, smart guy for information than a big, dumb guy. Of course, it’s best to ask a big, smart guy if you can find him, but go to any gym in the country, and you’ll see scores of big, dumb guys spouting laughable information.
Here is my original point. I was trying to use humor in my first post to get it across but i guess it got passed over because of how i said it. It is not going to matter which ever one you do. There. Keeping It Simple Stupid, Jay.
Well, Chris, I guess I am just lucky to be surrounded by a bunch of big, smart guys at my current gym…maybe it’s helped me forget all the big idiots at my old gym.
Everybody is different. Some people don’t even eat friggin carbs at all, so obviously a nice big meal of shit they don’t know how to digest isn’t going to help them out.
There is no right answer to questions like this; stop bloody arguing.
And I, for one, like Goldberg’s attitude… makes me look forward to bulking come october.
