T Nation

Fast Lifting and MU Recruitment?

Oh, and theres one thing I forgot to mention.

IMO, the longer limbs an individual has, the more they should rely on mixing the two types of training (lighter weights fast, and rack work). On the other hand a shorter limbed individual could get better results with more full ROM exercise, and just use heavier weights for the same TUT sets.

The shorter limbed individual requires less force to complete each rep, has less intense sticking points, and a shorter ROM, so they are performing less work and have less Intra-muscular tension with a given weight. Thus they can likely train for the same set duration with a greater percentage of their 1rm.


I am not trying to sound naive, but isn’t CW’s idea of lifting explosively the same idea employed by Westside guys (e.g. speed bench) ?

If so, then of course it has merit.

[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:

I am not trying to sound naive, but isn’t CW’s idea of lifting explosively the same idea employed by Westside guys (e.g. speed bench) ?

If so, then of course it has merit.[/quote]

the problem is that unless you are advanced, working on speed is not really that effective. For most trainees, working on how much load is lifted will work just fine, it’s when they plateau and can’t put more weight on the bar, that one should really work on speed by doing DE work. I mean sure the westside method has it built in so you’re doing it from the start, but if speed isn’t your problem…then there’s not as much of a point of addressing it, it all goes back to training economy, making the most out of the time and energy you have in the gym.

[quote]dankid wrote:
Thanks CW, i’ll definately check out your book when its available.

I appreciate all the comments everyone, but I still disagree with the fact that lighter weights will not build muscle.

The key ingredient for muscular growth that is dependant on load, is intramuscular tension(IMT). IMT is a direct result of force. Also, greater forces are the result of greater MU recruitement. Now I know when using a weight around 20-30rm your not going to be able to produce max force on the first few reps, I already stated this. If you did produce max force with this weight, you’d likely have to release the weight into the air. But after a few reps, max force can be produced without this problem.

This means that some of the fast twitch fibers that were recruited from the beginning of the set have fatigued, and other fibers take over. As the set goes on, your max force decreases as more and more MU’s fatigue.

I do agree that with this set, your max force or maximum IMT is never as high as it would be with a heavier weight. So there is a drawback to this method. But as CW mentioned this method does work speed strength. And as I mentioned this method is not being used alone.

Some other direct advantages of this method are that the force required at the transition between ecentric and concentric movement is much higher than with heavier weights and a slow eccentric. This is likely why its a good method for speed strength.

This is another reason why this method is not to be used alone. Much of the force produced using these lighter weights with faster movements is the result of elasticity. This results in the musculature involved in the transition from eccentric to concentric being responsible for most of work in the set. For example in a set of bench press, the chest and shoulders are going to almost all of the work, while the triceps will do nearly nothing, because the inertia involved. (This could be looked at as an advantage or a disadvantage) I think this is a great method for longer limbed lifters, because now they are not limited by sticking points or poor leverages. But like I said they will have to do something else to work those neglected muscles, or sticking points.

Which brings me to the next portion of training. Heavy partials, and full range eccentric training. In the bench press that I mentioned above, the lower portion of the movement is getting a lot of work, but the top of the movement is recieving nothing. The solution? Rack work. The top 1/2-1/3 of the movement in a power rack will make sure that your increasing the strength of any neglected muscles. Then you can also do “traditional” strength training using the full ROM, which will still be limited by your sticking points, but will be much less of a problem. Your sticking points will be stronger, and your accelerative capabilities of your strong points will be greater, so sticking points wont be as much of a problem. Lastly, i’d include some negative only training, or assisted eccentrics to work with supramaximal weights.

Here’s a sample of one of my workouts that focuses more on TUT than reps:

  1. Pullup- BW+25 5-8 reps (I dont count TUT on sets shorter than 15 seconds)
    REST 60 seconds
    Repeat 2 times
  2. Lat pulldown ?RM 20 seconds
    REST 40 seconds
    Repeat 2 times
  3. Reverse flies ?RM 40 seconds
    REST 40 seconds
    Repeat 2 times

Everything is performed in sequence. So after your third set of pullups, you rest 60 seconds, and go right into lat pulldowns. Also, I put ?RM for exercises 2 and 3, because I dont know what my 1RM is and it really doesnt matter. You choose a weight and basically do as many reps as you can in the time period. It doesnt matter if the weight is a little too light, because you’ll just lift faster to produce more force. The weight is too light though if you are accelerating the weight to the point where inertia is removing tension from your muscles. The only other thing that I think is really important, is that you’ll notice, as you fatigue, your eccentric/concentric ratio increases. So basically your getting less reps in the same time, but the total TUT is the same. Your still producing max force on almost all the concentric movements, but your spending more time controlling the weight in the eccentric which is easier than lifting the weight.

I know it doesn’t go along with everything thats been suggested for hypertrophy, but ive already noticed its working pretty well for me. So if you want to try something different, give it a try.

And again, thanks for your comments and criticisms.[/quote]

In my opinion i think it just all goes back to being if using DE is NEEDED in one’s HYPERTROPHY program. It makes sense for powerlifters who have plateaued to throw it in, or to have it in from the start so sticking points are less of a problem, but training for the sake of lookin good nekkid, I would think other progression methods are just fine. e.g. rep progression, shock methods (rest pause, supersets, etc.)

New book coach?Argoments?

[quote]Lorisco wrote:
IrishMarc wrote:
Lifting quickly does not result in hypertrophy!

Anyone who says so is talking out of his/her/collective ass hole.

Hypertrophy is a result of muscle damage/volume. The need to produce greater forces or workloads are what cause the muscle to grow not the velocity of contraction.

If this held a monocrom of truth then sprinters would not need to lift weights to get bigger/faster because the velocity of crontraction would be so great that they would be fucking hyoooge! already.

This is evidently not the case.

Working at your 25RM for ANY exercise is not going to do shit. period.

True. It’s about intent to lift fast not the actual speed of the bar. You can try and lift your 3rm fast but it isn’t going to go fast. But as long as you try and lift it fast that is all that matters.

I’d like to see someone try and lift a true 1/2/3RM under “slow and controlled conditions.” if you put 90% and up on someone’s back for a squat you better believe they are going to be trying to stand up as hard and as fast as possibe!