T Nation

Failed PCT Attempt, Low Levels, ED, All of It


#1

Hello,

I ran a heavy 16 week cycle for a contest i was preparing for, it included Tren A, Test Prop, EQ, Anavar and winstrol.
I did not run HCG during the cycle(foolish i know).
I did HCG 2500mcg every 3.5 days for a month and i took Nolvadex 40mg for 30 days with 100 clomid.

Anyhow, this was around 5-6months ago, i finished pct by the end of June.

I noticed my libido was very low and i had problems getting an erection soI did a checkup on 25th of October, and i got really bad test results:

FSH - 0.1 mIU/mL … range: 1.4-15.4
LH - 0.7 mIU/mL … range: 1.5-9.3
Total Testosterone - 1.23ng/mL … range: 1.64-7.53
Free Testosterone - 0.8pg/mL … range: 1.0-28.30
E2 - 15.1pg/mL … range: 10.0-52.0

So i did some reading and some research and i decided to do the Power PCT.

I did:
Power Start oct 25
Day 1-16 HCG 2500 EOD
Day 1-30 Clomid 100mg ED
Day 1-30 Nolvadex 20mg ED

After the 30 days i waited for 3-4 days and i did another blood test and here are the results(today, Nov 29th):

FSH - 1.2mIU/mL … range: 1.4-15.4
LH - 3.2mIU/mL … range: 1.5-9.3
Total Testosterone - 2.27ng/mL … range: 1.64-7.53
Free Testosterone - 5.6pg/mL … range: 1.0-28.30
E2 - 33.5pg/mL … range: 10.0-52.0

Most of my values have improved, but im still not satisfied since i had higher numbers normally. And my libido is still dead along with a hard time getting it up. I noticed my E2 Levels have also elevated.


Anyway, i went to a doctor and he put me on TRT… i followed his protocal, he gave me 250mg test E every 2 weeks.
I took a total of 2 injections within 1month then i decided that im not trully convinced of what im doing. plus i havent seen any improvement.

What am i suppose to do now? Ive had no sex drive, and very bad ED. what protocal should i follow, should i attempt a restart?
I didnt do any bloodwork after the 2 test injections i took but im sure they killed my numbers again.
Any help would be appreciated.

Mark


#2

You’re not going to get anywhere injecting 250mg every 2 weeks, that protocol is ancient and outdated. You need to inject 50mg twice weekly until you find out your SHBG level, then you can develop a protocol specifically for you and not these cookie cutter protocols designed for everyone.

Throw out your free T score, nobody measures free T directly as it’s inaccurate and unreliable, we calculate our TT and SHBG to get our free T score. Your E2 is elevated because you dosage is too high and infrequent, inject smaller doses more frequently.

Clueless doctors alway start out using Test E, T-Cyp is the popular choice for TRT since it’s half life is a little better. It’s time for another doctor.


#3

Hello,

I appreciate the feedback man! Yes i realised that i was doing something wrong and it just didnt seem right. I did all the blood tests again today and i should get them in a couple of days.
What do you suggest i should do? do 50mg 2x weekly? If so, what kind of Test?
When i took the 250mg test E, it did not improve my sex drive and im still suffering from ED.
Or should i do a hcg/serms restart again?
Cheers


#4

Erections and libido require consistent hormone levels, injecting infrequently often leads to big swings in testosterone levels and these swings cause dead zones in the blood where testosterone is in low concentration towards the end of your shot, Test E has a shorter half life than T-Cyp.

The average half life of T-Cyp is 8 days but can be less than that on low SHBG guys and even shorter if you’re a hyper T metabolizer and hyper excreter. You want to keep your levels steady, not 800 one day and then 400 days later, a drop in hormone levels is felt as low energy and low mood or not feeling right.

Note it can take up to a year to regain maximum sexual function. These are hormones, it’s not at all like medication where you start feeling the effects right away. Tissue must be repair and this just takes time. If your SHBG is lower you may require even more frequent injections than twice weekly, this is why SHBG levels are important.

Any doctors that thinks it’s not is clueless.

My erections didn’t start happening with any consistency until I started injecting more frequently, twice weekly wasn’t enough for me sexually, but was fine mentally. I inject smaller doses EOD.


#5

thanks for the reply man!

So i should inject test 2x weekly lets say 50mg then do some bloodwork and find what keeps it steady?
Or should i just do a restart attempt? Whats more appropriate in my case?
Im getting my bloodwork results in a few days and it includes SHBG tests.


#6

Injecting 50mg twice weekly is the most broad protocol, it works for guys with SHBG in the 40’s all the way down to the 20’s, sometimes injecting EOD has it’s advantages at lowering E2 levels and keeping levels even more stable. You might want to try a restart, once you get above 30 years old the chances get slimmer.

You want to wait 6 weeks before making any changes to any protocols, it takes this long for blood level to reach a stable state. I’m 4 weeks into a new protocol and have 2 more weeks until blood levels are stable, I will gauge how I feel and as it stands now I feel fantastic.

Usually a successful protocol sees me doing well just after the 4 week point, if I’m still having trouble at this point it’s a failed protocol for me.


#7

Well the last time i took the Test E was around 3 weeks ago.
So you suggest i attempt a restart? Or start with the frequent test injections m?
and if i were to try restarting my hpta, What protocol should i follow?
@systemlord
cheers bro


#8

Just got some bloodwork done, waiting for SHBG should have it in a couple of days.
Bare in mind my last test E injection was on 21/1, been 3 weeks now.
@KSman are you here?

What do you think i should do guys? HPTA restart?


#9

@systemlord how do we calculate our own Free T from Total T & SHBG? What is the formula for that, please?


#10

Formula–> http://www.issam.ch/freetesto.htm


#11

When you do TRT, you must manage E2 with anastrozole as needed to get near E2=22pg/ml.

All of your PCT is bad because BB forums are full of flawed advice. See the HPTA restart sticky.

We need to know more about you. See the advice for new guys sticky for that.


Please read the stickies found here: About the T Replacement Category

  • advice for new guys - need more info about you
  • things that damage your hormones
  • HPTA restart <<<<<<<<<<<<<<
  • protocol for injections
  • finding a TRT doc

Evaluate your overall thyroid function by checking oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky. Thyroid hormone fT3 is what gets the job done and it regulates mitochondrial activity, the source of ATP which is the universal currency of cellular energy. This is part of the body’s temperature control loop. This can get messed up if you are iodine deficient. In many countries, you need to be using iodized salt. Other countries add iodine to dairy or bread.

KSman is simply a regular member on this site. Nothing more other than highly active.

I can be a bit abrupt in my replies and recommendations. I have a lot of ground to cover as this forum has become much more active in the last two years. I can’t follow threads that go deep over time. You need to respond to all of my points and requests as soon as possible before you fall off of my radar. The worse problems are guys who ignore issues re thyroid, body temperatures, history of iodized salt. Please do not piss people off saying that lab results are normal, we need lab number and ranges.

The value that you get out of this process and forum depends on your effort and performance. The bulk of your learning is reading/studying the suggested stickies.


#12

Thanks for the reply! I took a look earlier but ill re read them. What i was asking mainly though, should i go through the trt path at just 26? Or should i attempt a restart protocal? Hcg for 4-6 weeks then bloodwork and if test responds properly i switch to nolva then check fsh/lh?
Cheers


#13

Thanks Systemlord :slight_smile:


#14

I’ve read a lot of your post but I have a few questions and want to double check that I’m on the right track because of the massive long term consequences it could have if I’m doing this in a way that isn’t optimal.

I’ve given up on PCT, because it’s too traumatic and my natural test levels aren’t ideal. If I’m going to just do TRT for half the year and spread out two 3-month long blast periods for the remaining 6 months, is there any point in using Nolva or other SERMS at all? Right now I’m doing TRT with 150mg Test E every 3 days and .5mg Arimidex every other day. I’ve occasionally been using HCG but I haven’t stuck to a set regimen. Is there anything else I should be taking? How much should I generally ramp up Arimidex during a blast?

I recently found out there’s no way to PM people on this forum, but I wouldn’t mind paying you for advice if you could contact me directly. I understand you give a lot of your time to helping people here and the constant “is my cycle good?” posts must get old.