T Nation

Estrogen Dominance, Reason Not Known


I have been copping some fairly insane side effects from what I believed to be low testosterone for around 2 years now. I have seen 12 doctors, 4 endo's, and now exploring naturopaths and chinese medecine because no one seems to know what the heck is going on.

It all started around 2 years ago when I noticed I wasn't interested in sex as much as I used to be. I put it down to over training and left it at that. It didn't go away, and it got worse. so I went to my doctor who got me tested. Total test was good, free test was absolutely miserable.

Total Test ranges were from 21-28 pmol/L (ref range 10-33)
Free test was 42-50 pmol/L (ref range 60-130)
E2 136pmol/L (ref range <150)
SHBG 72 nmol/L (ref range 13-71)

By bloods have stayed around the same for two years and I was trying desperately to work out the problem. LH and FSH were fine. DHEAs were high. Although i started to get a bit sub-clinical hypothroidism (fixed now with armour). Adrenals are fine even though I was fairly dependent on stimmed pre workouts for many years.

What I am wondering is... the reference ranges for E2...are they based on females? If they are, im surprised I haven't grown tits yet.

I get no wood. None. I never get restful sleep (8-10hrs) - always waking up tired and needing naps through the day. My skin has gotten very dry. I've put on around 30-40lb in 6 months.

I eat all organic, I do not drink, I am (was) a very physically fit guy who had played high level football. No history of any cancers, disease, and have never tried steroids. I don't eat gluten any more either

I'm at a loss. I know there's so much more I need to say but I have a bit of brain fog at the moment.

Since the doctors have not had any idea, I've had to do my own work. I have looked into haemochromatosis and iron overload, which I am experimenting with having less red meat.

One doc tried me on clomid - made things worse. I wanted to literally die, so he said the problem isn't with my balls. Finger is now pointing to liver/kidneys and maybe prostate.

I'm 32, and this is ruining the best relationship I have ever had.

This may not even be the right forum, but I'm at a loss...

Any ideas?


I have very simmilar labs, and also poor libido.
The problem might be DHT, which is the most important for libido.
Proviron/Andractim may be the best solution for you: SHBG will decrease and there will be more free T, but after few days you will have less Total Testosterone, because you will block your testicles.


Please start by carefully reading the advice for new guys sticky. We need more info about you.

!!! Post all of your labs including the thyroid hormones.

Read the thyroid basics sticky.

  • post waking and mid-afternoon oral body temperatures
  • post history of intake of iodine from vitamins that list iodine and iodized salt use

Post actuals for LH/FSH

Some guys react very badly to clomid. Nolvadex can do the same thing and does not have the estrogenic effects that mess a few guys up. What was the clomid dose?


Apollogies, guys.

My latest lab results as follows:

LH: 4 (ref <9 IU/L)
FSH: 6 (ref <10 IU/L)

TSH history

2.9 (06/2012) 3.1 (08/2012) 1.7 (12/2012) <–without tested t3 and t4
4.5 (4/2013) Free T4 15pmol/L (ref 10-20) Free T3 4.8pmol/L (ref 2.8-6.8)
5.0 (5/2013) Free T4 15pmol/L Free T3 4.9pmol/L

LATEST: TSH 1.9 Free T4 12.5 pmol/L Free T3 5.0pmol/L

I did have another test where the TSH was up to 5.5, but I don’t have it in front of me.


Total Test: 24.2 nmol/L (11-40)
SHBG: 71 nmol/L (10-70)
Free Test: 302pmol/L (260-740) <-- this was when I was on Trizaole (natural E blocker) and ISA Test (test booster) to see if anything would change. Highest reading in over a year.
E2: 83 pmol/L (55-165)

Total Test: 25.9 nmol/L (11-40)
SHBG: 61nmol/L (10-70)
Free Test: 376pmol/L (260-740) <-- Clomid results. 50mg EOD.
E2: 136 pmol/L (55-165)

Another E test was taken back in 3/4/2013. 130pmol/L This was on no clomid.

Clomid was terrible for me. 50mg EOD was bad, but 25mgEOD was even worse. I couldn’t even bare to be close to anyone, be in their breathing space and I was just heavy and severely depressed through the whole time. I had another blood test on that too, which I have not got the results back from yet.

In 2012, my free test and total test scores were:
Free Test - 42 (60-130)
Total Test - 21 (10-33)

Free Test - 48
Total Test - 26

Free Test - 46
Total Test - 28

DHEAS: 12.6 umol/L (4.3-12.2)

Cortisol (3/4/13) 510nmol/L
(26/7/13) 472 nmol/L (160-650)

I do know that an AI may help, but I am in a bit of a bind at the moment. I’m a tested athlete. I haven’t been able to compete in nearly a year and it’s driving me mental. Injuries, wear and tear on the joints (accelerated arthritis) and such have sidelined me from doing what I dearly love. AI’s, SERMS and nearly everything else is banned on the list, and I only tried clomid to see if it was my balls that were the problem. I have decided to sit out this season, which kills me. I just can’t compete…I can’t lift and I have no energy. I have lost my ‘alpha’ and I want it back.

Other things I have tried:

  • Isagenix - on the advice of a friend and sports scientist. He hates the company, but said it might help flush the liver and kidneys if there’s a problem

  • Chinese Medicine - basically telling me to focus on a colour while they put needles into me.

  • Meditation - makes me fall asleep.

  • Test boosters and e blockers - any decent ones I can get from a supplement shop that could help, I’ve tried with limited success.


Also, urine analysis was that I was not iodine deficient.

R-U-Creatinine 10.7nmol/L
Urine Iodine - 120ug/L (>100ug/L)


[quote]KSman wrote:

Some guys react very badly to clomid.
That’s right. Clomid is estrogen, and it is mostly used for PCT after steroids or to stimulate ferility. But it is difficult to increase free T after it.

[quote]KSman wrote:
Nolvadex can do the same thing and does not have the estrogenic effects that mess a few guys up.

Usually but not always. In my case Novaldex increased E2 twice to 60 pg/ml, so there is no rule. But it is better than Clomid because SHBG can be decreased after it, and free T will be higher.