T Nation

Equal Rights, Equal Lefts


#21

The beginning of the altercation, who started it?. I am typing this from my phone but if I recall correctly he didn’t prevent her from going to her car until after the altercation had begun.


#22

I get your question. My point is we see the middle and end of the altercation. Not the beginning so we are at a loss as to who started it.

She threw the first punch from what we saw. There’s no disputing that. But they both were aggressors throughout the ordeal.

You do recognize, then, when he prevented her from getting into the car, it becomes a separate issue as she was trying to end the altercation by separating herself from it. There’s a clear shift in her body language from offensive to defensive. It’s then and there that HE becomes the aggressor.


#23

How do we know she is not trying to drive off in his car? He was grabbing something from the other woman, which I presume was his keys. I don’t know.

It also depends if there is a duty to retreat in this particular jurisdiction. I can only tell this is somewhere in Europe from the plates. If so, he should have walked away – unless she was trying to take his car, which makes this defense of property, too.

All that said, “provocation” is a defense to simple assault in 99.99% of the world. She sure as hell provoked him by hitting him 10-20 times, grabbing his throat, and kicking him. The whole “blocking from leaving” business is not particularly relevant.

There have been a lot of studies on domestic violence and women are just as likely to be the initial aggressor as the man. The man, however, typically finishes it, both due to size and knowledge how to fight. This seems to fit the sad pattern rather well.

Long story short, don’t date a bitch or a bastard.


#24

I actually think he was trying to get her phone so she couldn’t call law enforcement. Thats just my prediction


#25

Judging from his body language, he looks drunk as fuck.


#26

This was what I thought I was watching. I took the other woman as a stranger trying to intervene and was really caught by the mixture of courage and fear she displayed. But again, I perceived her as a stranger stumbling onto the situation rather than as connected to the other two.

As for them, I believe both behaved abominably and both deserve criminal charges, but I found him terrifying and wish such people did not occupy the same streets I do (figuratively speaking, I know he’s not in the US).

Yes, exactly.


#27

Doesn’t matter… when you have a clear advantage (be it physical size, combat training, or a weapon) it’s your responsibility to meter it’s use.

This guy was an indecisive little bitch. He let her hit, kick, and slap him multiple times… none of which posed any threat of physical harm (as evidenced by his body language). Now, had he backhanded her onto her ass after the first (or second, or third) time she struck him… I could understand (and even say she got what she deserved)… but he didn’t. There was no sign of retaliation while she was “attacking” him. It looks like she ultimately said something that really set him off… he proceeded to chase her down, and maul her until she was unconscious.

He let her get under his skin… he let his emotions get out of control… he abused her and the responsibility that comes with his advantage (size)… because he’s a weak, miserable excuse of a man with no self control.


#28

I found it very odd that he stood there and let her hit him for so long; not a couple of times but repeatedly. He was either drunk, stoned or not right in the head. It’s almost like he didn’t quite take it in. While she may not have been hurting him all that much, the disrespect would make most people turn, disengage or try to leave. I could imagine once, twice or even three times but her blows were relentless.

She looked like a child having a tantrum and then he looked like an enraged bear.


#29

I’m guessing she caught him fucking another woman, or something else that he was ashamed about, so he just stood there like a whipped dog while she went to town on him. It became too much when she tried to take his car. That’s when he started to get aggressive, so either she said something to him or the mere attempt to potentially leave him stranded drove him over the edge.

Speculation aside, the only thing to do when you’re being attacked by a woman like that (ineffectual but irritating strikes that are potentially dangerous) is to close the distance and clinch right away. Don’t ever answer with strikes or you’re going to wind up in jail, and don’t stand there and take it until you get so mad that you break her fucking jaw either.

They sound like Russians. I could be wrong though, you can’t hear them that well.


#30

Yes, this. I also got the impression that they might be Russian, or from somewhere nearby. What a weird and disturbing thing that video was altogether. I can’t believe some guys are using this to advance their “but hey, if they want to be equal so badly, they gotta deal with the bad part of being equal” agenda.

I would think it’s much more effective as Jewbacca’s “don’t date a bitch or a bastard” cautionary tale. Because watching a guy that size pound a woman into a bloody puddle on the ground was sickening, not what I think of as consciousness-raising.


#31

Nobody knows what the initial gripe was that started the whole issue, so who is to blame is a moot point, though the man does act like he is guilty of doing something that has made the women angry. Unfortunately for the woman she did the wrong thing on many levels. Had she not done these things she would have walked away untouched by violence.

A: she initiated physical contact, B she continuously escalated the intensity and the frequency of the strikes. I actually think that man was incredibly restrained for a very long time.
Unfortunately striking someone like this more often than not stimulates the adrenalin and the “fight response”, rational thinking goes out the window, whether the perceived threat is real or not.

That man was doomed pretty much no matter what his response was. The best option for him would have been to walk away the first time she hit him or even before. Now that’s easy to say in hindsight, or if your not the individual directly involved. Unfortunately for the guy he had a strong emotional connection, (boyfriend or husband) which is supposed to be what usually makes a good relationship, ie not walking away at the first sign of trouble. If he had just walked away some people would have accused him of being weak, cowardly for not taking control.
The same type of people usually say he is a coward or unmanly if he reacts violently. No win situation for him.


#32

My reaction to any situation like this would be to get out of it not because the woman doesn’t deserve it, but I just don’t want to have to say I beat a woman.


#33

Pretty much pretty much


#34

Walk away and be perceived as “possible coward”, or beat her and be “confirmed coward”. True the distinction is easier to make in hindsight… that’s the primary reason for not allowing it to escalate to such a degree.


#35

I doubt anyone would have perceived him as a coward had he walked away … Obviously, given hindsight, that would have been his wisest course than that which he took … i.e. pummeling her like the uncoordinated galoot that he is


#36

Seriously. If that was his thought process I would have to call him “an idiot.” Although I already believe, as ouroboro noted, that he seemed slightly “off.” I disagree with this:

Walking away was an honorable, non-doom option for him. He could have brushed her off like a fly, and should have.


#37

Its the emotional ties that will get you every time, whether your a man or woman, because its stops you from thinking rationally. If that was his wife or long time girlfriend I can understand why he didn’t walk away in the heat of the moment(even though that would have been the best option).
Think about domestic violence in general. How many battered wives still stay with their partners, even though friends and family or even some guy walking by on the street, can say you gotta leave him. She answers “He still loves me” or “I still love him”. Its not until many of these women are seriously hospitalised to the point of life threatening injuries can they start to clearly think they have to get out of the situation.
That initial bond can be so strong it takes a lot before it can be broken. In virtually every other situation that bonding is ideally what most people value in a good relationship.

Shit can be so complicated these days, and gets even worse when you add alcohol, drugs, or mental illness into the equation.


#39

Makes me think of the castrating bitch Russian bride wife in Orange is the New Black, whose prison social worker husband keeps trying to make romance with her, but she hates him and spends all day talking smack about him in Russian with her mother, whom he also supports. Sad!

But the Ukraine girls are probably different. That castrating bitch mail order bride wife was probably from a less family-oriented region.

Seriously, though, there’s a very high rate of domestic violence in families with “oversees brides.” Be careful men! ALL WOMEN SUCK.

Edit: but not necessarily in the good way.


#40

Maybe or just keeping very calm until he snapped. Although, given that this is Russia or the like, I am pretty sure they start drinking with morning coffee.

I am an leaning toward both the she-has-his-keys and phone scenario. She goes for the driver’s door, then he ends up driving after taking something.

Car aside (which does change things; no one will take my vehicle without my permission and does justify reasonable force), I’ve been in a position when a much smaller woman is wailing on me twice. Both times was because I decided to date a female because she was insanely hot, but insane AND I had legitimately done something to piss her off.

I ended up getting slapped and punched and a drink in my face.

Anyway, both times I walked away.

I’d like to say it was because I am a gentleman, but the real reason is I live in a small town and would have gotten arrested or jumped by a group of White Knights or just generally had a bad reputation (or likely all three), so I took the abuse briefly and walked away.

Indeed, the ONLY time I have threatened a woman (outside of Iraq, where I sure as hell put women at gun point and was part of a fire team that ended up shooting some women who were combatants, but that is different, I suppose) was when this same woman threatened to burn my barn and kill my horses. I made it very clear my intent to resolve the situation with violence if my animals were hurt in any way.


#41

The guy could have also just ran some distance away from her while she was slugging him. Or ducked, or blocked, or did SOMETHING instead of passively receiving slaps, kicks, and punches. With that said, I don’t see anything wrong with giving a sub-maximal slap or punch to a woman assaulting someone.