T Nation

Ephedrine Banned Again

Well our friends at the FDA have done it again. for those of you whom saw my last post on ephedrine ( http://www.T-Nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1218235&pageNo=2 )Guss what ephedrine is now Gone!! here’s how I found out my father and I had walked into a small supplement store called supplement city. upon asking the clerk where all the ephedrine was he responded with “its banned again” how ever my dad picked up the last 3 bottles which were being liquidated.

when I got home i sprung for my computer. Low and behold it was banned October 23 by the FDA after thy won the court case which held up their decision. but it does not stop there more products to be banned include: Synepherine & Yombhine (which the FDA are probably making cases for as I type). It’s unclear weather they’ll actually ban Synepherine & Yombhine but one thing is clear. now thy have officially declared on the bodybuilding and supplement community.

[quote]Gambles wrote:
It’s unclear weather they’ll actually ban Synepherine & Yombhine but one thing is clear. now thy have officially declared on the bodybuilding and supplement community. [/quote]

Nah, not bodybuilding at all. They’ve declared war on the non-pharmeceutical (herbal) fat loss industry. This opens a market niche for dangerous and expensive pharmaceuticals, that will be patented and marketed by the FDA’s true constituency (Big Pharma)…

[quote]Kailash wrote:
Gambles wrote:
It’s unclear weather they’ll actually ban Synepherine & Yombhine but one thing is clear. now thy have officially declared on the bodybuilding and supplement community.

Nah, not bodybuilding at all. They’ve declared war on the non-pharmeceutical (herbal) fat loss industry. This opens a market niche for dangerous and expensive pharmaceuticals, that will be patented and marketed by the FDA’s true constituency (Big Pharma)…[/quote]

You realize that more people have severe reactions to these supps than to many drugs, right?

Caveat emptor. If you can’t figure out what to put in your own body, and how to do it safely, you deserve a severe reaction. Why is it that the minority fucks it up for the rest?

[quote]buffalokilla wrote:
Kailash wrote:
Gambles wrote:
It’s unclear weather they’ll actually ban Synepherine & Yombhine but one thing is clear. now thy have officially declared on the bodybuilding and supplement community.

Nah, not bodybuilding at all. They’ve declared war on the non-pharmeceutical (herbal) fat loss industry. This opens a market niche for dangerous and expensive pharmaceuticals, that will be patented and marketed by the FDA’s true constituency (Big Pharma)…

You realize that more people have severe reactions to these supps than to many drugs, right?
[/quote]

Define “severe reactions” and explain how this number outweighs the numbers who died from using aspirin.

According to :

There were 7,600 deaths associated with NSAIDs like aspirin in the year 2000.

Are you about to claim that there were even a third as many deaths associated with ephedrine? A hint? There were not.

The truth? They tallied anyone who would call saying they got a headache or couldn’t sleep in with their numbers of “severe reactions” with no clinical follow up from a professional.

[quote]ocn2000 wrote:
Caveat emptor. If you can’t figure out what to put in your own body, and how to do it safely, you deserve a severe reaction. Why is it that the minority fucks it up for the rest? [/quote]

And that’s why you’re not in a position of power in the FDA.

Question for the Biotest boys then, if Yohimbine is banned will you go back to the old formula for Spike making it legal in my country again?

Drug abusers cost our nation over $67 billion dollars per year.
Maybe the FDA needs to focus on that,not supplement abuse.
Two thousand people die every year by simply taking asprin.
I don’t see the FDA emptying peoples medicine cabinets out.
Their only goal is money.

One fully referenced report shows the number of people having in-hospital, adverse reactions to prescribed drugs to be 2.2 million per year. The number of unnecessary antibiotics prescribed annually for viral infections is 20 million per year. The number of unnecessary medical and surgical procedures performed annually is 7.5 million per year. The number of people exposed to unnecessary hospitalization annually is 8.9 million per year.

The most stunning statistic, however, is that the total number of deaths caused by conventional medicine is an astounding 783,936 per year. It is now evident that the American medical system is the leading cause of death and injury in the US. (By contrast, the number of deaths attributable to heart disease in 2001 was 699,697, while the number of deaths attributable to cancer was 553,251.5)

And the FDA’s major concern is people taking too much ephedra?
Did you know creatine is on their hate-list also?
Please.

IMO -The reason ephedra is being banned and/or regulated (psuedoephedrine) is due to methamphetamine production.
They are useing a few poster boy incidents to justify the ban but in reality it’s because they couldn’t control the meth production.
Since the ban and regulation of ephedrine based products they are busting less meth labs and production in the U.S. is on the decline.
Meth use however is NOT on the decline - it now gets smuggled across the border from Mexico and the severity of the problem remains unchanged.

[quote]Cthulhu wrote:
Drug abusers cost our nation over $67 billion dollars per year.
Maybe the FDA needs to focus on that,not supplement abuse.
Two thousand people die every year by simply taking asprin.
I don’t see the FDA emptying peoples medicine cabinets out.
Their only goal is money.

One fully referenced report shows the number of people having in-hospital, adverse reactions to prescribed drugs to be 2.2 million per year. The number of unnecessary antibiotics prescribed annually for viral infections is 20 million per year. The number of unnecessary medical and surgical procedures performed annually is 7.5 million per year. The number of people exposed to unnecessary hospitalization annually is 8.9 million per year.

The most stunning statistic, however, is that the total number of deaths caused by conventional medicine is an astounding 783,936 per year. It is now evident that the American medical system is the leading cause of death and injury in the US. (By contrast, the number of deaths attributable to heart disease in 2001 was 699,697, while the number of deaths attributable to cancer was 553,251.5)

And the FDA’s major concern is people taking too much ephedra?
Did you know creatine is on their hate-list also?
Please.[/quote]

Where are you getting these numbers? (not that I am saying they are wrong)

[quote]Gambles wrote:
more products to be banned include: Synepherine & Yombhine[/quote]
Anyone know the deal with topically applied Yohimbine products if this happens?

If you guys think the FDA is bad, you should try dealing with the Irish Medicines Board, they don’t even try to hide the fact that they’re more concerned with doing the bidding of pharmaceutical companies than the genuine health of the public.

I’m not doubting you, but could the original poster link to where he found this information. I couldn’t find anything new at the FDA website. Also if this simply upholds the original ruling it isn’t actually banned altogether, but can’t be marketed as a dietary supplement. It’s been all over my area forever as “bronchial dilator” type products in liquor stores and gas stations.

Any of these guys who don’t believe the FDA is ALL ABOUT MONEY should have an immediate cranial anal extraction performed.

Ephedrine is just one example. I’m only one guy, but I ate 200 mils a day for over a year at one point and was according to our doctor at the time “the finest example of human fitness on all levels” that he’d seen in 18 years of practice. My blood pressure for example was actually a little low. This has been beaten to death.

[quote]pwilliams wrote:
Cthulhu wrote:
Drug abusers cost our nation over $67 billion dollars per year.
Maybe the FDA needs to focus on that,not supplement abuse.
Two thousand people die every year by simply taking asprin.
I don’t see the FDA emptying peoples medicine cabinets out.
Their only goal is money.

One fully referenced report shows the number of people having in-hospital, adverse reactions to prescribed drugs to be 2.2 million per year. The number of unnecessary antibiotics prescribed annually for viral infections is 20 million per year. The number of unnecessary medical and surgical procedures performed annually is 7.5 million per year. The number of people exposed to unnecessary hospitalization annually is 8.9 million per year.

The most stunning statistic, however, is that the total number of deaths caused by conventional medicine is an astounding 783,936 per year. It is now evident that the American medical system is the leading cause of death and injury in the US. (By contrast, the number of deaths attributable to heart disease in 2001 was 699,697, while the number of deaths attributable to cancer was 553,251.5)

And the FDA’s major concern is people taking too much ephedra?
Did you know creatine is on their hate-list also?
Please.

Where are you getting these numbers? (not that I am saying they are wrong)

[/quote]

I can give testimony to the fact that these numbers are correct. I’ve read them on rense.com and Dr. Mercola’s website. If you go to Jeff Rense’s site and search the archives on medical deaths you should be able to pull it up, and they had references and links to sites along with the article.

It was actually a pretty interesting read as the guy that did the research pointed out that the 783,936 deaths by conventional medicine is probably much lower that the real number. He pointed out that often times the Doctors will perscribe the wrong drug and kill a patient, which is not listed as medical or malpractice death but it is listed as a drug interaction death, plus many times the patients death is listed as natural or unavoidable due to their ailments.

He also pointed out that the number of patients that are mis treated, mis diagnosed, even if it did not result in death, is more likely to be much higher than his numbers show as the medical community does their best to hide these problems, not report them or cover them up.

He explains that the biggest problem with Doctors is that there is no accurate reporting method for cataloging their errors, and doing so is greatly discouraged. The medical system is not set up to provide a clear number on this point, and there are no standard practices available to them for reporting purposes.

As he pointed out, these were only the numbers that were reported and far from complete. Given that, in reality it is even scarier than the numbers show.

Ain’t that a bummer!!!

Big Pharma is the devil incarnate, they would pull every healthy thing from the shelves feed us posion, tell us it is regulated and good for us, and then monopolize our treatments so that there is no possibility for us to ever get well.

Why do they target Bodybuilding supplements. Healthy strong men and women do not go to the doctor often, nor take their meds. Only way to keep up their profits is to turn us all into unhealthy fat disgustingly sick people, that way we will keep going back and getting more of their meds for our ills!!!

Oh! also, how can we trust a Agency that put nutra sweet on the shelves?

Another fact, the year Nutra Sweet was approved brain tumors jumped 30% that year and climbing ever since!!

BTW Nutra Sweet never passed one toxicology study back in the 1970s NOT ONE, interacted with almost every drug ingested. It is a neuro-excitotoxin causes obesity and fat gain!!!

Don’t believe me on Nutra-Sweet, go search it out on the Web, read the book “Sweet Posion Sweet Misery” the information is there. Nasty Nasty stuff!!

And not only no but hell no do the number of people experienceing reactions from herbs even come close to big pharma meds. Hell the chinese have been using herbal formulas for thousands of years with no ill side effects. Some of the Chinese Herbal Patent Formulas are 5000 years old. What’s the oldest pharmaceutical I think it is Digitalis which is like 110 years old.

Go search this stuff out on the web lots of great referenced info out there to look at!!!

[quote]buffalokilla wrote:
Kailash wrote:
Gambles wrote:
It’s unclear weather they’ll actually ban Synepherine & Yombhine but one thing is clear. now thy have officially declared on the bodybuilding and supplement community.

Nah, not bodybuilding at all. They’ve declared war on the non-pharmeceutical (herbal) fat loss industry. This opens a market niche for dangerous and expensive pharmaceuticals, that will be patented and marketed by the FDA’s true constituency (Big Pharma)…

You realize that more people have severe reactions to these supps than to many drugs, right?
[/quote]

Is this true? It seems quite the opposite to me. Real drugs are often so much more powerful they have more severe side effects.

Of course real drugs are also more rigorously tested and more proven to work as intended than many supplements.

The supplement industry has too much snake oil in it and the FDA should be helping trying to determine what works and what does not work rather than randomly banning select supplements based on media demonization.

[quote]ocn2000 wrote:
Caveat emptor. If you can’t figure out what to put in your own body, and how to do it safely, you deserve a severe reaction. Why is it that the minority fucks it up for the rest? [/quote]

Bullshit. Nobody knows enough about this stuff to make smart decisions.

We need our government to fund studies to determine what is useful and what is not useful and stop bowing to the pressure of the drug companies.

[quote]MODOK wrote:
buffalokilla wrote:
Kailash wrote:
Gambles wrote:
It’s unclear weather they’ll actually ban Synepherine & Yombhine but one thing is clear. now thy have officially declared on the bodybuilding and supplement community.

Nah, not bodybuilding at all. They’ve declared war on the non-pharmeceutical (herbal) fat loss industry. This opens a market niche for dangerous and expensive pharmaceuticals, that will be patented and marketed by the FDA’s true constituency (Big Pharma)…

You realize that more people have severe reactions to these supps than to many drugs, right?

Ummm, wrong. Why don’t you do a little research, or better yet, ask a health care professional like a physician (X) or pharmacist (me) before you get diarrhea of the mouth again. THe adverse events of legend pharmaceuticals versus herbal supplements isn’t even comparable.

[/quote]

You mean ask my fat, donut eating, cigerette smoking doctor about how to maintain drug free health? That’s like asking a car salesman if you need a new car.

You spout off about research, yet you show nothing to support your claims.

Not very biased are we?

[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
ocn2000 wrote:
Caveat emptor. If you can’t figure out what to put in your own body, and how to do it safely, you deserve a severe reaction. Why is it that the minority fucks it up for the rest?

Bullshit. Nobody knows enough about this stuff to make smart decisions.

We need our government to fund studies to determine what is useful and what is not useful and stop bowing to the pressure of the drug companies.[/quote]

Let the government decide for us.

Maybe we can let them take away creatine next.

F the FDA and their appeasers.

[quote]matt88 wrote:
IMO -The reason ephedra is being banned and/or regulated (psuedoephedrine) is due to methamphetamine production.
They are useing a few poster boy incidents to justify the ban but in reality it’s because they couldn’t control the meth production.
Since the ban and regulation of ephedrine based products they are busting less meth labs and production in the U.S. is on the decline.
Meth use however is NOT on the decline - it now gets smuggled across the border from Mexico and the severity of the problem remains unchanged.[/quote]

This might, however, be the only way to get rid of meth.

The government has done this before. Ever wonder why there’s no such thing as qualuudes any more? It’s because the US government "persuaded’ all the factories around the world (I think there were only seven or so) to stop making the base ingredient.

Meth is similar in that the base ingredient is complicated enough to need to be manufactured in a serious facility by skilled, trained people.

get the factories to make something else, end the existence of meth.

[quote]matt88 wrote:
IMO -The reason ephedra is being banned and/or regulated (psuedoephedrine) is due to methamphetamine production.
They are useing a few poster boy incidents to justify the ban but in reality it’s because they couldn’t control the meth production.
Since the ban and regulation of ephedrine based products they are busting less meth labs and production in the U.S. is on the decline.
Meth use however is NOT on the decline - it now gets smuggled across the border from Mexico and the severity of the problem remains unchanged.[/quote]

I see over-the-counter drugs that are abused and used to MANUFACTURE METH.
I don’t see the FDA pulling these drugs off the shelves.
But ephedra is should be?
B.S.

[quote]harris447 wrote:
matt88 wrote:
IMO -The reason ephedra is being banned and/or regulated (psuedoephedrine) is due to methamphetamine production.
They are useing a few poster boy incidents to justify the ban but in reality it’s because they couldn’t control the meth production.
Since the ban and regulation of ephedrine based products they are busting less meth labs and production in the U.S. is on the decline.
Meth use however is NOT on the decline - it now gets smuggled across the border from Mexico and the severity of the problem remains unchanged.

This might, however, be the only way to get rid of meth.

The government has done this before. Ever wonder why there’s no such thing as qualuudes any more? It’s because the US government "persuaded’ all the factories around the world (I think there were only seven or so) to stop making the base ingredient.

Meth is similar in that the base ingredient is complicated enough to need to be manufactured in a serious facility by skilled, trained people.

get the factories to make something else, end the existence of meth.
[/quote]

Banning supplements like Ephedra might be the only way of getting rid of Meth?
Triple C derives its name from Coricidin Cough and Cold. This cold medicine, along with dozens of others including some pediatric cold formulas, contains dextramethorphan (DXM). When used in prescribed doses, DXM helps alleviate cold symptoms. When taken in large quantities, it makes kids high.
As long as we have over-the-counter drugs that can be abused,which will always be here, there will always be Meth or drugs like Meth.

If the FDA is concerned about the dangers of Ephedra being used for METH production,then they should be equally concerned about Triple C and drugs like Triple C.

Why aren’t they?
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