T Nation

End of Days

I recently watched a show on the history channel that was about the end of the world. For centuries, people have attempted to predict when the world will end. Now, as mere mortals, no one can truly know.

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days?

We have been in the end of days since Jesus asscended into heaven. We are closer to the last day every day.

[quote]forbes wrote:

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

No one with any sense should think this so.

[quote]forbes wrote:

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

Hardly prophetic. This was happening LONG before Jesus and has been happening for 2000 years after his death.

We’re not at the end of days. No matter how bad things get…famine, plague, asteroid, laser-wielding Jesus riding triceratops…there will likely survive a portion of humanity which will serve as a bottleneck for future generations. Hopefully they’re reasonably bright…

[quote]Dustin wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

No one with any sense should think this so.[/quote]

Let’s not be so quick to judge. There is money to be made in these myths. Here’s a site where for a mere $14.95 per year, you can store information to send to those who are “left behind.” There are many sites like these, some being free. Just Google “rapture letters.”

http://www.youvebeenleftbehind.com/services.html

[quote]Dustin wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

No one with any sense should think this so.[/quote]

Absolutely agree. If people always think the end of days is just a day away, there is no motivation to improve the world around you today.

[quote]forbes wrote:
I recently watched a show on the history channel that was about the end of the world. For centuries, people have attempted to predict when the world will end. Now, as mere mortals, no one can truly know.

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

sigh honestly I have to say that is a bad interpretation of this passage. Just before it the disciples ask him when with the temple be destroyed and this is Jesus response. To attribute it to anything outside that requires a strong justification.

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
I recently watched a show on the history channel that was about the end of the world. For centuries, people have attempted to predict when the world will end. Now, as mere mortals, no one can truly know.

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

sigh honestly I have to say that is a bad interpretation of this passage. Just before it the disciples ask him when with the temple be destroyed and this is Jesus response. To attribute it to anything outside that requires a strong justification.
[/quote]

Matthew 24:3 NIV

"As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

[quote]MikeTheBear wrote:

Let’s not be so quick to judge. There is money to be made in these myths. [/quote]

Makes for interesting TV as well. The Hitler Channel has end times prophecy / disaster type shows on all the time.

[quote]Dustin wrote:

[quote]MikeTheBear wrote:

Let’s not be so quick to judge. There is money to be made in these myths. [/quote]

Makes for interesting TV as well. The Hitler Channel has end times prophecy / disaster type shows on all the time.[/quote]

Hitler has is own channel? Wow! :slight_smile:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
I recently watched a show on the history channel that was about the end of the world. For centuries, people have attempted to predict when the world will end. Now, as mere mortals, no one can truly know.

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

sigh honestly I have to say that is a bad interpretation of this passage. Just before it the disciples ask him when with the temple be destroyed and this is Jesus response. To attribute it to anything outside that requires a strong justification.
[/quote]

Matthew 24:3 NIV

"As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

[/quote]

and? When will this happen is concerning the end of the temple. The end of the age most likely is being used in the sense that the temple age would end.

G165
�±�¹�?�?�?�½
aioÃ??n
ahee-ohn’
From the same as G104; properly an age; by extension perpetuity (also past); by implication the world; specifically (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future): - age, course, eternal, (for) ever (-more), [n-]ever, (beginning of the, while the) world (began, without end). Compare G5550.

I also wouldn’t hang my case on one phrase.

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
I recently watched a show on the history channel that was about the end of the world. For centuries, people have attempted to predict when the world will end. Now, as mere mortals, no one can truly know.

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

sigh honestly I have to say that is a bad interpretation of this passage. Just before it the disciples ask him when with the temple be destroyed and this is Jesus response. To attribute it to anything outside that requires a strong justification.
[/quote]

Matthew 24:3 NIV

"As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

[/quote]

and? When will this happen is concerning the end of the temple. The end of the age most likely is being used in the sense that the temple age would end.

G165
�?�±�?�¹�??�??�??�?�½
aioÃ???n
ahee-ohn’
From the same as G104; properly an age; by extension perpetuity (also past); by implication the world; specifically (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future): - age, course, eternal, (for) ever (-more), [n-]ever, (beginning of the, while the) world (began, without end). Compare G5550.

I also wouldn’t hang my case on one phrase.
[/quote]

It wasn’t until the resurrection that the disciples understood the reason why Jesus Christ was here. Prior to the resurrection the disciples beleived that Jesus would reign as King as the Jewish Teachers had been teaching about the Messiah for thousands of years. So at this point the disciples thought that Jesus would be both King and Priest, Messiah, and the Temple was the spot where he would rule.

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
I recently watched a show on the history channel that was about the end of the world. For centuries, people have attempted to predict when the world will end. Now, as mere mortals, no one can truly know.

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

sigh honestly I have to say that is a bad interpretation of this passage. Just before it the disciples ask him when with the temple be destroyed and this is Jesus response. To attribute it to anything outside that requires a strong justification.
[/quote]

Matthew 24:3 NIV

"As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

[/quote]

and? When will this happen is concerning the end of the temple. The end of the age most likely is being used in the sense that the temple age would end.

G165
�?�±�?�¹�??�??�??�?�½
aioÃ???n
ahee-ohn’
From the same as G104; properly an age; by extension perpetuity (also past); by implication the world; specifically (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future): - age, course, eternal, (for) ever (-more), [n-]ever, (beginning of the, while the) world (began, without end). Compare G5550.

I also wouldn’t hang my case on one phrase.
[/quote]

I was referring to -“what will be the sign of your coming”-in response to only attributing the passage to the question of the temple. It seems the question was more than that.

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
I recently watched a show on the history channel that was about the end of the world. For centuries, people have attempted to predict when the world will end. Now, as mere mortals, no one can truly know.

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

sigh honestly I have to say that is a bad interpretation of this passage. Just before it the disciples ask him when with the temple be destroyed and this is Jesus response. To attribute it to anything outside that requires a strong justification.
[/quote]

Matthew 24:3 NIV

"As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

[/quote]

and? When will this happen is concerning the end of the temple. The end of the age most likely is being used in the sense that the temple age would end.

G165
�??�?�±�??�?�¹�??�??�??�??�?�½
aioÃ???n
ahee-ohn’
From the same as G104; properly an age; by extension perpetuity (also past); by implication the world; specifically (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future): - age, course, eternal, (for) ever (-more), [n-]ever, (beginning of the, while the) world (began, without end). Compare G5550.

I also wouldn’t hang my case on one phrase.
[/quote]

I was referring to -“what will be the sign of your coming”-in response to only attributing the passage to the question of the temple. It seems the question was more than that.

[/quote]

Here is a question for you. Why would the disciples who clearly didn’t understand the following

  1. Christ was to be crucified
  2. would ascend into Heaven

Think that Jesus was coming again?

You do know that the word used for coming can also meaning presence and is used that way in the NT?

G3952
Ï?αÏ?οÏ?Ï?ιÌ?α
parousia
par-oo-see’-ah
From the present participle of G3918; a being near, that is, advent (often, return; specifically of Christ to punish Jerusalem, or finally the wicked); (by implication) physical aspect: - coming, presence.

also cross that with the olivet discourse in mark

Mar 13:3 And as he sat on the Mount of Olives opposite the temple, Peter and James and John and Andrew asked him privately,
Mar 13:4 “Tell us, when will these things be, and what will be the sign when all these things are about to be accomplished?”

or Luke

Luk 21:5 And while some were speaking of the temple, how it was adorned with noble stones and offerings, he said,
Luk 21:6 “As for these things that you see, the days will come when there will not be left here one stone upon another that will not be thrown down.”
Luk 21:7 And they asked him, “Teacher, when will these things be, and what will be the sign when these things are about to take place?”

Now when these other two gospels were written they clearly had knowledge of the ascension and claimed return of Jesus, yet neither of them even care to act like the disciples were asking when are you returning. Why should we force that upon the text of matthew?

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
I recently watched a show on the history channel that was about the end of the world. For centuries, people have attempted to predict when the world will end. Now, as mere mortals, no one can truly know.

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

sigh honestly I have to say that is a bad interpretation of this passage. Just before it the disciples ask him when with the temple be destroyed and this is Jesus response. To attribute it to anything outside that requires a strong justification.
[/quote]

Matthew 24:3 NIV

"As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

[/quote]

and? When will this happen is concerning the end of the temple. The end of the age most likely is being used in the sense that the temple age would end.

G165
�??�?�±�??�?�¹�??�??�??�??�?�½
aioÃ???n
ahee-ohn’
From the same as G104; properly an age; by extension perpetuity (also past); by implication the world; specifically (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future): - age, course, eternal, (for) ever (-more), [n-]ever, (beginning of the, while the) world (began, without end). Compare G5550.

I also wouldn’t hang my case on one phrase.
[/quote]

It wasn’t until the resurrection that the disciples understood the reason why Jesus Christ was here. Prior to the resurrection the disciples beleived that Jesus would reign as King as the Jewish Teachers had been teaching about the Messiah for thousands of years. So at this point the disciples thought that Jesus would be both King and Priest, Messiah, and the Temple was the spot where he would rule. [/quote]

I agree with your statements, but I am missing your overall point. Also that passage and exchange took place before the resurrection. I would also state that it wasn’t until the ascension that the disciples understood and not the resurrection which is very clear by just reading the last part of John.

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]haney1 wrote:

[quote]forbes wrote:
I recently watched a show on the history channel that was about the end of the world. For centuries, people have attempted to predict when the world will end. Now, as mere mortals, no one can truly know.

Jesus speaks in Matthew 24:7-14 of the build-up to this. He says:

"For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. And there will be famines, pestilences, and earthquakes in various places.
All these are the beginnings of sorrows.
Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name's sake.
And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another.
Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many.
And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold.
But he who endures to the end will be saved."

How many people think we are in the end of days? [/quote]

sigh honestly I have to say that is a bad interpretation of this passage. Just before it the disciples ask him when with the temple be destroyed and this is Jesus response. To attribute it to anything outside that requires a strong justification.
[/quote]

Matthew 24:3 NIV

"As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. “Tell us,” they said, “when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?”

[/quote]

and? When will this happen is concerning the end of the temple. The end of the age most likely is being used in the sense that the temple age would end.

G165
�??�??�?�±�??�??�?�¹�??�??�??�??�??�?�½
aioÃ???n
ahee-ohn’
From the same as G104; properly an age; by extension perpetuity (also past); by implication the world; specifically (Jewish) a Messianic period (present or future): - age, course, eternal, (for) ever (-more), [n-]ever, (beginning of the, while the) world (began, without end). Compare G5550.

I also wouldn’t hang my case on one phrase.
[/quote]

It wasn’t until the resurrection that the disciples understood the reason why Jesus Christ was here. Prior to the resurrection the disciples beleived that Jesus would reign as King as the Jewish Teachers had been teaching about the Messiah for thousands of years. So at this point the disciples thought that Jesus would be both King and Priest, Messiah, and the Temple was the spot where he would rule. [/quote]

I agree with your statements, but I am missing your overall point. Also that passage and exchange took place before the resurrection. I would also state that it wasn’t until the ascension that the disciples understood and not the resurrection which is very clear by just reading the last part of John.
[/quote]

My point is when the guys were talking about all this they thought Jesus was going to Rule here on Earth immediately. So the statement about the temple holds a lot of water because of this.

I agree with your statment about the assention and not the resurrection, but it is the resurrection that completes the plan. Without the resurrection the crucifiction would be for naught. I am waiting for the return, but I am not going to stop living the life that God has given me waiting for that return. I will continue working for the kingdom.

Every second PWI thread is about bible study…

If our pious souls would know how illeterate those times were, how poorly some texts were copied and translated, with how little remorse scribes or priests changed or inserted words!

For those confused so tragically: Please pick up some classic novels; for these are at least works where you can argue all day long about syntax and semantics. Because the artist actually cared about that.

2012 is it man. Better get your ass moving on those PR’s.

[quote]Schwarzfahrer wrote:
Every second PWI thread is about bible study…

If our pious souls would know how illeterate those times were, how poorly some texts were copied and translated, with how little remorse scribes or priests changed or inserted words!

For those confused so tragically: Please pick up some classic novels; for these are at least works where you can argue all day long about syntax and semantics. Because the artist actually cared about that.
[/quote]

care to state a case or are we only graced with your drive by comment with no substance.

As an article of faith, for Baha’is like me, the Last Days have already happened. A century and a half ago. God’s manifestation emerged into a den of iniquity and wickedness with a message from Heaven, just like the first time, and nobody noticed or cared.