T Nation

End of Cruising

Hi,

I’m taking 250 mg of Sustanon per week, 50 mg of Decadurabolin per week and 5000 i.u of HCG every 2 weeks for 2 years now.
I’m 35 years old, 5.9 inches, 185 pounds, 13 % body fat, training for 3 years.

The last two years, I gained 50 pounds (2 pounds per month) but now I’ve reach a plateau.

I would like to go to the 200 pounds, so I wanted to increase the sustanon and deca.
(750 mg sustanon and 250 mg decadurabolin)

This is my question: do you think it’s better to stop completely and doing a PCT before to increase the dosage, or can I directly increase the dosage ?

thanks for your help

[quote]ber wrote:
Hi,

I’m taking 250 mg of Sustanon per week, 50 mg of Decadurabolin per week and 5000 i.u of HCG every 2 weeks for 2 years now.
I’m 35 years old, 5.9 inches, 185 pounds, 13 % body fat, training for 3 years.

The last two years, I gained 50 pounds (2 pounds per month) but now I’ve reach a plateau.

I would like to go to the 200 pounds, so I wanted to increase the sustanon and deca.
(750 mg sustanon and 250 mg decadurabolin)

This is my question: do you think it’s better to stop completely and doing a PCT before to increase the dosage, or can I directly increase the dosage ?

thanks for your help
[/quote]

Are you a troll?? Because this seems like a joke.

Are you telling us you weighed less than 140 pounds before you started to juice??

You have also run AAS in the most lame-ass way I can think of. You are gonna have an extremely difficult time ever recovering your natural test production from this buddy. I mean, two years on sust and deca with 2500IU HCG per week?!!

When you say 5000IU HCG every 2 weeks do you mean you take that in a single dose. I sincerely hope you dont. Hate to scare you, but you seem to have seriously fucked this up.

I usually dont flame newbies but you are completley ignorant about anything to do with AAS and you have no business taking it. YOu are who give AAS a bad name.

I didn’t ask you to criticize what my endocrinologist is prescribing me…

And as you can see, I’m not insulting you.
You should do the same.

[quote]ber wrote:
I didn’t ask you to criticize what my endocrinologist is prescribing me…

And as you can see, I’m not insulting you.
You should do the same.

[/quote]
???

While the last guy did not answer your question like you wanted him to, he did bring up some important issues. You aswell did not answer his questions.

Normally I’d say just increase the dose, but as I do not see the logic in what you are running now…I don’t know, why don’t you try answering the last guys questions and let’s look at that HCG use…seems pretty screwed up to me.

Also just because someone is an Endo does not mean that they know what they are talking about - endo’s tend to be some of the most close-minded, think-that-they-are-a-god type doctors out there.

[quote]ber wrote:
I didn’t ask you to criticize what my endocrinologist is prescribing me…

[/quote]

Why don’t you ask him? You are only telling part of the story.

[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:

Why don’t you ask him? You are only telling part of the story.[/quote]

When i started to lift weights, my weight was 130 pounds for 5.8’.
At the end of the first year, It was 150.
(only lifting and dieting)
Then I made a blood test and the doctor told me that my T levels were too low.

So he sent me to an endocrinologist who prescribed me 250mg Sust/week, 50 mg deca/week.
Then I started to gain 2 pounds/month to reach the 185pounds in 2 years;
One year ago, the endocrinologist added to the prescription 5000 i.u HCG (one shot every 2 weeks).

I do a blood test every 5 months and the endocrinologist checks the results.
Last time I saw him, He told me everything is perfect, so he wants to decrease the dosage.
But I would like to reach the 200 pounds,
and to do so, I want to increase the dosage.

So I didn’t ask him if it was better to clean my T receptors before to increase the dosage, because I don’t want to tell him that I’m going to do that.

hey bro i would increase it to 500mg for the sust and have the deca at say 400mg. But in your case i would lay off the gear for at least 6 months , run a good pct and add lots of tribulus.

you better lay off because you are gonna be depending on the gear too much so i would really reckon you give your body a good break.

have your test levels checked by a doctor make sure your test levels are going back to normal then see if you actually keep your gains cause you might be dissapointed once you stop. so i reckon you try a routine of a 12-14 week cycle then have at least the same amount of time off after or even longer.

[quote]ber wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:

Why don’t you ask him? You are only telling part of the story.

When i started to lift weights, my weight was 130 pounds for 5.8’.
At the end of the first year, It was 150.
(only lifting and dieting)
Then I made a blood test and the doctor told me that my T levels were too low.

So he sent me to an endocrinologist who prescribed me 250mg Sust/week, 50 mg deca/week.
Then I started to gain 2 pounds/month to reach the 185pounds in 2 years;
One year ago, the endocrinologist added to the prescription 5000 i.u HCG (one shot every 2 weeks).

I do a blood test every 5 months and the endocrinologist checks the results.
Last time I saw him, He told me everything is perfect, so he wants to decrease the dosage.
But I would like to reach the 200 pounds,
and to do so, I want to increase the dosage.

So I didn’t ask him if it was better to clean my T receptors before to increase the dosage, because I don’t want to tell him that I’m going to do that.

[/quote]

Cool. Now that you have laid it all out hopefully someone can give you a little help.

Ok, so now we have the full story…

Not to criticize your endocrinoligist (because I amn’t one myself)but I find it difficult to see the rationale behind his prescription of HCG in a single dose of 5000IU. A shot that large (especially every two weeks for a year) will likely have burnt out your leydig cells, making recovery all the more difficult.

There are lots of pub med studies on hypogonadal men and men with fertility problems where HCG doses are even larger. I have not seen anything on leydig cell desensitization.

[quote]Over40 wrote:
There are lots of pub med studies on hypogonadal men and men with fertility problems where HCG doses are even larger. I have not seen anything on leydig cell desensitization. [/quote]

From every thing I’ve ever read about HCG, which isn’t that much, you’re supposed to inject a lower dose every 5 days.

Man, if you are only 5.9 inches tall and weigh 185 pounds, you must be about 3 feet wide.

[quote]sharetrader wrote:
Man, if you are only 5.9 inches tall and weigh 185 pounds, you must be about 3 feet wide.[/quote]

LOL!

Holy shit! 5,000 IU HCG in one shot every 2 weeks! WOW.

How big are your balls now?

Large doses of HCG have been used to increase fertility of guys who had such problems and wanted to have a kid. That is a short term thing and should never be sustained. The high dose will cause the down regulation of the LH receptors which makes getting natural a problem.

But if your natural T is low, you are on TRT and you stay on that and never cycle off and on, just stay on.

250iu HCG SQ EOD is all that is needed by normal guys who are LH supressed from taking gear. That does will maintain baseline testicular activity.

HCG is available in multi dose vials, so you do not have to shoot a whole ampule at once. You mix with the water and keep it in the refrigerator and inject with .5ml insulin syringes.

I agree with the others, this is shocking.

Read this, and provide a copy to your doc!

http://dspace.hsl.washington.edu/dspace/bitstream/2012/52/1/JCEM_2005_Low_Dose_Human.pdf

[quote]jwillow wrote:
sharetrader wrote:
Man, if you are only 5.9 inches tall and weigh 185 pounds, you must be about 3 feet wide.

LOL![/quote]

just have a look to this guy who is 3 pounds heavier than me for the same height

http://www.T-Nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1397208

is he 3 feet wide ?

[quote]KSman wrote:
Large doses of HCG have been used to increase fertility of guys who had such problems and wanted to have a kid. That is a short term thing and should never be sustained. The high dose will cause the down regulation of the LH receptors which makes getting natural a problem.

But if your natural T is low, you are on TRT and you stay on that and never cycle off and on, just stay on.

250iu HCG SQ EOD is all that is needed by normal guys who are LH supressed from taking gear. That does will maintain baseline testicular activity.

HCG is available in multi dose vials, so you do not have to shoot a whole ampule at once. You mix with the water and keep it in the refrigerator and inject with .5ml insulin syringes.

I agree with the others, this is shocking.

Read this, and provide a copy to your doc!

http://dspace.hsl.washington.edu/dspace/bitstream/2012/52/1/JCEM_2005_Low_Dose_Human.pdf

[/quote]

thank you for your comment.

I read the document and this is coming from it:

“A review of the literature reveals a broad range of relatively high doses of gonadotropin replacement using hCG
ranging from 1250 IU three times weekly to 3000 IU twice weekly. Even higher doses of hCG (5000 IU, three times per week) have been shown to be safe in experimental models of gonadotropin withdrawal”

does it means that 15000 IU of HCG per week is safe ?

and it also says:
“Lower doses of hCG may be as effective in treating male infertility due to
hypogonadotropism as the higher doses used historically”
Note the use of MAY BE in “lower doses of hcg MAY BE as effective…”.
Does it means it is not proved ?

[quote]ber wrote:
jwillow wrote:
sharetrader wrote:
Man, if you are only 5.9 inches tall and weigh 185 pounds, you must be about 3 feet wide.

LOL!

just have a look to this guy who is 3 pounds heavier than me for the same height

http://www.T-Nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1397208

is he 3 feet wide ?[/quote]

Umm… he says he is 5 feet 8 inches tall. You said you were only 5.9 inches. That is less than 1/2 foot.

[quote]sharetrader wrote:
ber wrote:
jwillow wrote:
sharetrader wrote:

Umm… he says he is 5 feet 8 inches tall. You said you were only 5.9 inches. That is less than 1/2 foot.[/quote]

You are right ! I’m not so small :slight_smile:
It’s because usually I’m using the metric system.