T Nation

Enanthate

I am 54 in half decent shape and on Androgel 5mg for 1yr. I don’t like how I feel. I am about to start taking enanthate. I am looking to start with 200 weekly as I am taking for low tetosterone and don’t like the Androgel. My intention is to try it for 2 mo. and see how I feel and if no results go back to Andro. I like to stay in shape but not looking to get in an over 50 contest. Is this practical? I would appreciate any help.

yeah, actually looks good…your doc should be able to prescribe it, as well.

normally test is used at about 400mg/wk (or more) for mass/strength, but for your purposes, 200 is prolly fine…

Thanks for the response. I forgot to mention that I am feeling depressed, on .5mg Lexapro, but feeling anti social none the less. I have no desire to go anywhere or do anything. I thought the androgel would help but no dice. Work, gym 3 times a week, and the couch. Racquet ball on the weekends.

Should the enanthate change my mood?

[quote]scottflo wrote:
Thanks for the response. I forgot to mention that I am feeling depressed, on .5mg Lexapro, but feeling anti social none the less. I have no desire to go anywhere or do anything. I thought the androgel would help but no dice. Work, gym 3 times a week, and the couch. Racquet ball on the weekends.

Should the enanthate change my mood? [/quote]

Definately. Not sure about that dosage though.

[quote]scottflo wrote:
Thanks for the response. I forgot to mention that I am feeling depressed, on .5mg Lexapro, but feeling anti social none the less. I have no desire to go anywhere or do anything. I thought the androgel would help but no dice. Work, gym 3 times a week, and the couch. Racquet ball on the weekends.

Should the enanthate change my mood? [/quote]

200mg/week is quite high. As an example, 100mg/week took me to almost 900. Higher doses will create higher E and may give you gyno, poor mood results and lower libido. Initial effects can be great but transient. Don’t overlook HCG and anti-E.

Your gel dose is insane, it may not have increased your T levels at all as the body will have reduced LH. Your only result may be shrinking testes that may also be sore. If your scrotum is now up tight to your body, your LH is reduced for sure.

Testes in a younger healthy male produce on average, 10mg testosterone /day. Injections of 100mg/wk resolve to 70mg of test after absorption and the esters groups are removed to yield bio-identical testosterone. That works out to 10mg/day. So 100mg test cyp or test eth per week would be a good starting point.

I took testim (same as androgel) at 5g and 10g/day and still felt like shit. I started enanthate 100mg/wk and felt f-ing spectacular. No more depression, better motivation, much better sex drive, etc. The injections made a huge difference over the gels. You might want to give it a try since it sounds like you’re where I used to be with the gels.

Thanks for the responses. Needless to say I am new to anything other than Androgel. With enanthate,
would I still need the anti-e, which I know nothing about. As usual I’m looking for a quick fix, and am not looking to get into it to much.

I had a friend that basically told me what the last poster stated. He said he felt much better taking 200mg once a wk as the Androgel made him feel like crap. But he is younger 35, and huge. As for my gonads, they are fine and not shrunk from the Androgel. I am just looking to do the 100mg once a week. Any other input would be appreciated. Thanks again

Start at 100mg a week go a few weeks say 6 get a blood draw find out where you are. Your T, free T, E and hell check as much as you can always a good option. the adjust as needed.

I personally use 250mg a week and that has me just about 1000 feelin fine and no problems at all with E it stays low and level with no AI. Were all different and need to get a blood draw to really know.

Phill

Have you tried HCG? That might help your mood and it’s pretty important when on TRT( at least that’s what my doc told me). I’m on Cyp myself and although I’m still anti-social I do have more drive. My doc also recommended Pregnenolone cream or at least taking DHEA.

I am on 200mg/week of test also. It takes a couple of weeks for your body to adjust. I am also taking 1000 units/week of HCG. Results are very good and the recovery from workouts is excellent. What are you doing about Estrogen?

Thanks to everyone. I started 250/lml yesterday after being on 5mg Androgel. I stopped the Andro. I am taking nothing for est, and do not know much about any other t related supplements. I know that’s not the smartest route.

Is it ok to do my next week @ 125/1/2ml? As I say, I am not looking to get big. I am just looking to get away from the mood swings of the Andro which I think are comming from working out at different times each day as I get home early.

I think the showering at different times after workouts is effecting the Andro absobtion. No doubt I could be wrong. I had t of 120 before the Andro. Again, I’m 54 and with the Andro 5mg my t was 440. Thanks for any help you can give.

[quote]scottflo wrote:
Thanks to everyone. I started 250/lml yesterday after being on 5mg Androgel. I stopped the Andro. I am taking nothing for est, and do not know much about any other t related supplements. I know that’s not the smartest route.

Is it ok to do my next week @ 125/1/2ml? As I say, I am not looking to get big. I am just looking to get away from the mood swings of the Andro which I think are comming from working out at different times each day as I get home early.

I think the showering at different times after workouts is effecting the Andro absobtion. No doubt I could be wrong. I had t of 120 before the Andro. Again, I’m 54 and with the Andro 5mg my t was 440. Thanks for any help you can give.[/quote]

Most test esters that are perscribed that I am aware of are 200mg/ml. Weekly injections will feel great a first, anything that works would, but the hole at the end of the week will be come longer over time and many feel that more frequent injections are better for them. so consider that. You should get nocturnal and morning wood. As the body changes and the initial transient effects wear off, watch for a loss of libido and loss of morning wood. The loss of morning wood is an indication of E levels interfering with the action of the T. Arimidex is the most common drug to reduce aromatization of T–>E. Smoking, alchohol and higher body fat increase aromatization. Higher doses of T increase aromatization. Higher spikes of T from injections also increase aromatization… so more frequent smaller doses that provide for a more steady state T level will be helpful.

Watch for shrinking nuts and your scrotum pulling up tight to your body. HCG at 250IU EOD will prevent that or restore. Some don’t care and some feel pain when their nut shut down. I you are older, perhaps fertility is not a concern. Search and read!

So HCG, which is injected and arimidex are the typical additions to T in TRT. Some start all at one and some add one at a time.

The fertility situation is a non issue and sexual activity is a solo act. After 20 yrs, although I love her dearly, my wife immediately looks like Bruno Sanmartino after the act. And I am faithful, so it’s internet activity. Hey, maybe all of that will change. At the moment, no morning wood at all and dimminished interest.

Again I ask if reducing to 1/2ml=125mg wk would be OK? And would the lower dose reduce the need for anti-e?
Thanks again guys.

www.chemroot.com

[quote]olderguy wrote:
The fertility situation is a non issue and sexual activity is a solo act. After 20 yrs, although a love her dearly, my wife immediately looks like Bruno Sanmartino after the act. And I am faithful, so it’s internet activity. Hey, maybe all of that will change. At the moment, no morning wood at all and dimminished interest.

Again I ask if reducing to 1/2ml=125mg wk would be OK? And would the lower dose reduce the need for anti-e?
Thanks again guys.[/quote]

More frequent injections, of the same total amount per week, will be better from an E point of view, and more natural. This feels better for most, and many complain that once a week is too much of a hormone roller coaster. So yes; go to once a week then try more often than that. You are the best judge of what works best for you.

Thanks KSman,
I am thinking of going to 125mg,1ml per week. My first was 250. I see that some people are telling me that they do fine on around 100 eth. So are you saying that I should go 60mg,1/2ml twice a week? Or are you saying I should split the 250 to twice a week?

[quote]olderguy wrote:
Thanks KSman,
I am thinking of going to 125mg,1ml per week. My first was 250. I see that some people are telling me that they do fine on around 100 eth. So are you saying that I should go 60mg,1/2ml twice a week? Or are you saying I should split the 250 to twice a week? [/quote]

60mg,1/2ml twice a week would work well if you are ok with doing that. I inject EOD. 250/wk would definitely create some risks of side effects: higher E, higher DHT, more acne, greater hair loss potential, increased SHBG.

Try the more frequent and get use to that, then later try longer periods and see how that feels. I did 14mg/day for a while just to see how dead level felt, then tried EOD and that seemed better. As I then got started on HCG EOD, it made sense to harmonize my T injections with the EOD HCG.

Thanks for the reply. How will my age play out in this? I know you output of t starts to diminish more after 50 but most of the guys I know are in their 30s or 40s that take t. I also wanted to know what DHT and SHBG stand for. One last thing. My ears have always rang (tinnitus) from the military and shooting which is the main cause, but it has been very bad last 6 to 8 mos. Could that be from the t? Thanks again.

[quote]olderguy wrote:
Thanks for the reply. How will my age play out in this? I know you output of t starts to diminish more after 50 but most of the guys I know are in their 30s or 40s that take t. I also wanted to know what DHT and SHBG stand for. One last thing. My ears have always rang (tinnitus) from the military and shooting which is the main cause, but it has been very bad last 6 to 8 mos. Could that be from the t? Thanks again.[/quote]

DHT is dihydro testosterone which is created in the skin and prostate from T. It is what drives acne and hair loss for those so disposed.

SHBG is sex hormone binding globulin, which binds 98-99% of testosterone. Most of your total T reading is T bound this way and that is mostly inactive. Measurements of free T indicate how much T is in your blood that is able to do what T can do. High T and low FT is not good. Having lower TT and higher TF would be a better state. Much depends on how one’s body does things… every one is different.

If brain function is responding to the T, you may simply be more aware of this stimulus, just as some report that music sounds better or colors brighter or scenery more impressive. I have tinnitus too, as may others have.

I think that all older guys have T fade, we also have young guys here with the same problem, one guy is 19 with very low T. So I guess its all over the map.

Edit: adding these links

I guess what I am asking is will the t have a different effect on a guy like me that is 54 than a guy say 35? Sorry for all the question but reading posts on this site is like going back to the college I never went to. Mind boggling what some of you guys know about hormones and everything that goes with it.