T Nation

EDT for Arms: Results

About a month ago I started an EDT arms specialization program based on Charles Staley’s T-mag article (www.testosterone.net/articles/208edt.html) and his new EDT book. I wrote the foreword for the book so I had the chance to read a pre-release copy.

Arm training was done twice per week, EDT style. Everything else was trained once per week on non-EDT maintenance programs. Cyrotherapy, Surge and Power Drive (in club soda) were used, as per Staley’s instructions. One or two of the exercises were changed to fit the equipment I had available. One arm workout was missed during this time due to soreness from taking up racquetball again. Diet was slightly above maintenance.

Results: a little over one-half inch increase on each upper arm. Noticeable improvement in forearms as well. (Other people told me this, but I neglected to measure them.) Considering my training age and background, these are remarkable gains for only 4 weeks of training.

I truly believe that specialization is THE KEY to growth for advanced lifters who are long past their newbie gains. EDT fits into this perfectly.

Future plans: Do two more weeks of EDT arms and shoot for three-fourths of an inch total gains. Then diet down a little while doing a “regular” training program. In January I’ll start another EDT specialization program; haven’t decided what body part to target yet.

Just wanted to pass along my results. I’ll provide more info soon at T-mag in the “Stuff We Like” columns, plus I may do a whole article on specialization techniques for experienced lifters if there is interest. If you have any questions, fire away.

WOW that’s awesome !!.. growing a half-inch being a vetran is quite incredible in 4 weeks. you’ve gotten me even more pumped about it…!!..i’m going to start EDT for arms in january when i start back on MAG-10. I wonder if there’s a good EDT training program for delts ? i’ve been thinking about it for a little while, trying to come up with my own routine in EDT style.

I have using a modified version of the EDT progrm and HST training and I have had great results. For gaining mass and dieting. The only other thing that I was using to help was the Mag-10 which help me recover tremendously.

I’m seriously considering EDT as a booster right before pre-contest. This and other posts are really convincing me as to it’s effectiveness. Thanks, Shugs for providing this info. It’s much help.

What was your split like Chris?

Any chance some of that half-inch is temporary, i.e., due to trauma-induced swelling or increased glycogen storage?

Ahh yes, EDT. One half of my “Perfect Plan!™” toward buffness.

Paul: The usual split looked like this:


Monday: EDT Arms


Tuesday: Legs


Wednesday: Off (except for racquetball)


Thursday: Chest/Back/Shoulders


Friday: EDT Arms


Weekends: Off (racquetball one of those days)


I switched Thursday and Friday around once or twice as I recall.


Zev: Measurements were taken cold a few days after an EDT workout, and 1 or 2 days after I reduced carbs in my diet a little, so probably not. Plus I know my body pretty well, and I can judge when it’s “real” muscle and when it’s not (water retention etc.)

Great gains Chris. It would be nice to add 1/2 to my arms since my genetics are terrible in the upper arm area. Do you think it is better for a natural lifter to only use EDT on a certain bodypart at a time? I noticed in one of Eric Cressey’s posts he was using EDT for Legs with a lower volume 6x4 for the upper body. I beleive this to be a good approach due to the higher volume of EDT. I’m with Patricia, all this talk about 1/2 inch gains has me pumped to give it a shot.

Justin - I’m leaning that direction, yes. I’ve used EDT as a whole body program and while I had good results, I felt it was a little “too much” for me recovery-wise. Plus it’s just hard to be as “on” mentally as you need to be when using this program four days a week. After a couple of weeks I was starting to dread my workouts.

That said, younger lifters, low stressed individuals, those using an androgen (legal or otherwise), those with better genes than me, and those who only use the program for a shorter time frame could get away with it. I can only speak from personal experience, but I think it works much better as a specialization program rather than a whole body program. I will admit however that when I tried it as a whole body program I did not use cryotherapy as Charles says to do. Using the ice massage along with, say, 4 weeks of 4-AD-EC or double dose Methoxy may make me change my mind.

Right now I really think specialization is better for me, or for anyone who has been in the game seriously over ten years. That goes for a variety of training programs, not just EDT.

Hey Chris, I’m training EDT-style with three full-body workouts each week. Like you, I haven’t been doing the cryotherapy thing either. I do have access to a hot tub though, and that definitely helps to alleviate the crazy soreness that this program is so infamous for. I’ll keep you posted on my results (I’m doing this for three weeks) - BTW, congrats on your results!

How did your chest/back workouts go with that split?

It looks like a good split for me, but is my triceps are sore, then my chest workouts are terrible. Same for back wo’s when biceps are sore. I just can’t move enough weight or perform enough reps to work the taret muscle sufficiently due to the smaller muscles giving up first.

Do you emloy some form of pre-exhaustion?

The other thing I was curious about, was why is only 1/2 serving of surge suggested post-workout instead of a full serving?

Chris Merrow - You can do cryotherapy even without the suggest Cryocup. Just freeze water in a paper cup, then tear off most of it, leaving only a little “handle”. Basically any block of ice with a towel wrapped around it will work. The Cyrocup is handy because it’s rounded and has sort of a built in handle. They’re only six bucks on most websites. Shipping is about the same though!

j77 - Chest/Back/Shoulders work went fine with the split. Yes, I am training chest/back right next to arms day, and normally I try to avoid that (or do it all on the same day). But in this case it was okay because 1) chest/back/shoulders day was only around 12 sets, none taken to failure or using excessive negatives and 2) proper exercise selection, meaning that I used wide grip bench (to take the tri’s out a litte), and avoided things that hit the arms too much (dips, chins ect.) So it worked out fine. No problems.

I will say that your first week on EDT may be rough because the initial “shock soreness” of the new program may last longer that you think. You may still be sore from the first arm day by the time the next one rolls around. This is much better the second week, especially if you use the ice and take care of proper post-workout training. I think I may have allowed an extra rest day in my first week.


Pre-exhaust techniques may be a good idea in your case on non-EDT days.

As for Surge, Charles recommends that you take half a serving between the two 15 minute sessions and the other half after training. So that’s one scoop between sessions and one scoop after for most people. I sometimes do my first scoop before training however. Probably not a major difference either way.

This may be a really stupid question, but how are you supposed to cryocup both of your arms right after your workout? Do you do one for 15 minutes and then the other for 15 minutes, alternate 5minutes/5 minutes three times, get a partner to ice one of your arms whle you do the other, or what? I don’t see how it’s possible for 1 person to ice cup both of their arms at the same time.

Zev - I ice one arm for 30 seconds, then the other for about 30 seconds and just go back and forth based on comfort level. (It’s not too pleasant.) You do it until it melts, which is under 10 minutes on average. Perhaps you’re not visualizing correctly what a cyrocup is. See here: www.asuperbuy.com/cryocup.html

Thanks for the response, Chris. I knew what a cryocup was; I just didn’t know how one would use one to ice both arms simultaneously. But your answer clears that up – you just alternate arms every 30 seconds or so. Or, if you wanted to go for simultaneity, you could just do what I used to do when I was a pitcher – get two buckets, fill them with ice water, and plop one arm in each.

Zev - Nope, wouldn’t work. You have to massage the muscle with the ice. Staley explains it a bit better in his T-mag EDT article.

Okay, how about you get two buckets filled with ice water and put a miniature mermaid with a degree in massage therapy in each? That should do the trick.

If I had a miniature mermaid with a degree in massage therapy I’d put her in my pants, but that’s another story. :slight_smile:

Okay, 3 buckets.