T Nation

Ecto Issues


Hey All,

I'm 5'11 and just 146lbs. My bodyfat was at 15% last week and when i got it measure this morning it was 14.5% but i had spared a bit of muscle. I'm eating a 1800 cal 50 30 20. Help plz, what other info would you need in order for me to lose fat but keep lbm?




before everyone comes in here and kicks your ass..

why are you wanting to lose more fat?

5'11" & 146lbs at 14.5% body fat...


1)14.5 and 15 are the exact same thing as far as your concerned.so quit looking at those numbers. period.

2)how old are you?

3)what are you training for? goals?

4)what type of training are you currently doing?

5)you are going to hear that you are: skinny as crap, a dumbass for asking a dumbass question and not giving more info, to eat more food, going to need to start lifting some kind of heavy weights...

6)post your other info before you are flamed to death!! ha!

7)as much as people around here are a bit austere, im going to have to agree with the typical "T-Nation general consensus" ;that you should probably be doing everything i touched on in point #5.

train hard,
ryan b.



i just read all of your other 6 posts.

in one you are asking about HOT-ROX to lose weight.

in another you are inquiring about Carbolin 19 for mass gains.

and in yet another you are anxiosly awaiting your JB book.

AND you eat 1800kcal/day. nice.

are you just lonely and want to have someone respond to you or do you have any idea of what in the crap you are trying to do?

not really trying to be a dick here but i see why so many people post lame ass responses to so many incomplete or just ill thought out posts.

look, you know all of those posts where people are like
"..welp fucktard.. you should probably just quit worrying about the macronutrient profile of your whopping 1800kcal and start EATING SOME FOOD AND LIFTING!! TA DA!!!!"

anyway, i posted enough above to help you out. dont let anyone (including me.ha!) discourage you if you are really intent on this. answer those other questions and get with it and im sure you will get some decent help.

good luck.

ryan b.


1) Im 19

2)ultimately i'd like to put on some mass however im just following the idea that with a lower bodyfat i'd be less likely to gain fat when i attempt to bulk up.

3)At the moment im doing 3 cardio days and 3 heavy weight training days and ive done this for 3 weeks now.

4)im not new to these ideas mate.

  • i know im skinny and im immune to that sorta flack

  • i would have been stupid not to have asked at all cos i know im doin somethin wrong

  • im experimenting mate and i know to gain MASS i have to eat more calories

  • i do lift heavy and i mean heavy til i need a wheelchair to get out of the gym

5) What else would ya like to know?

I really apprecite you reading my other posts but they were made over a year. Different periods and different goals...ive oly been training 100% for the past 3 weeks and im hoping to work more with you soon.

Thanks Mate



I think you're making a big mistake cutting right now. Three cardio sessions and three workouts a week on only 1800 calories will strip the muscle off you as fast as the fat.

110lbs @ 5'11 will just look ridiculous.

My advice, which I'm following myself is a longer term relatively clean bulk.

A year ago I started basically where you are; I was 160lbs @ 6' and 15%, now I'm 180lbs and 12%. I did this while consuming approx. 3000 cal/day.

I think that if you continue to cut now you'll just be slowing down your metabolism and digging yourself a very big hole.




your young, skinny (by skinny i mean very little muscle on your frame)and probably not very strong.

without going into a ton of crap here:

start "west side for skinny bastards" immediately.

keep your "cardio" but do it in the form of actual running exercises(they fit perfectly into the template above)--because these can build muscle too.

start eating. a lot more of everything.

if you are eating 1800kcal/day and you are getting 50% of kcal from protein, thats about 225gms of protein a day. thats GREAT! now just eat a bunch more carbs/fat and you will be doing fine.

check out the thread "bulking for college impossible" for some good ideas on some easy shakes and other good info.

dont waste money on supplements. eat food. read more.

if your fat loss goal is simply a goal to lose some fat because youve been slacking--i wouldnt sweat it. gain mass. by the time you gain 20lbs of muscle you will probably find yourself leaning up along the way.

i know where you are coming from . at age 24 (when i started training seriously) i was 6'1" 165lbs (10%bodyfat). pretty damn skinny! in about 2years i was weighing 210(at a lower bodyfat). i busted my ass, learned everything i could(still learning) and ate and trained like a war horse.

at age 19 you have everything going for you right now. start kicking some ass..stick with it and you will make AMAZING gains.

train hard,
ryan b.


making a point:

if you are really training as hard as you say you are then i would surmise "THE" THING THAT IS HOLDING YOU BACK IS INSUFFICIENT CALORIES.


once you apply this you will see exactly what i am talking about.

good luck mate!


Save yourself many wasted years and take the ryan's advice!


Damn you guys are right, and i know it within myself. I feel so destroyed guys, where do i start :frowning:


I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not, but I'll assume you are not.

Find John Berardi's articles in the search engine. All of them. Check out Massive Eating I and II.

Next, maybe a DeFranco's "Westside for Skinny Bastards" (There are a million great workouts, but I am very partial to this one). Its great for...skinny bastards.

If you were being sarcastic, then let me say that 5'11 and 146 is anorexic. I'm 5'6 and 165 and still not even close to where I want. No one that is 5'11 and lifts should weigh less than 150. Not healthy man.


Reason number one why this concept doesn't need to be spread around as if it is truth. If you are seriously overweight, then yes, worry about getting lean before bulking. If you are "skinny/fat" or lacking in lean body mass to the point that even at substandard weight for your height you are still very "smooth", you should not be following this concept. No one with a lean body mass below 130lbs of near average height should be dieting unless they are near obese.


Thanks X,

Now from what im doing, how do i go about making a smooth transition into what you are saying?


These are excellent stats. For a woman.

Before you worry about losing LBM, how about you get some LBM.


Just finished watching a documentary on Discovery Channel (I think!). The documentary was about a starvation experiment that was done back in the 1950's. The starvation calorie limit was 1600 per day. You are eating 1800.

Now what does that tell you?


On your workout(weight lifting days) days consume 100-300 cal above your maintenance level of total calories.On your rest days consume 200 below your maintenance level,and on the weekend consume your maintenance level of total calories.

One reason why you could be losing muscle is when you're on a restricted calorie diet and you lift weights you burn calories (glycogen,not fat.)So,say you lost 350cal working out.350-1,800= 1,450 calories.So,you really ate 1,450 calories thus giving you a HIGH chance of losing LBM.In reality(yes,something the diet industry doesn't tell you),you'll have to eat an extra 350(the 350 cal you lost during weight lifting) to replenish your muscles.Because protein repairs muscle and helps muscles grow,so does calories.You can have all the protein you want on a bulking(mass building diet),but if you don't eat more calories than you burn off,then you won't gain muscle mass!So,in short:eat a couple hundred calories above your maintenance level on weight lifting days and about 200-300 below maintenance on rest days.I've used this method(and did other stuff) and gained 6 pounds of muscle and lost 15 pounds of fat.And no,it didn't take a year either.



you dont need to "transition smoothly" into anything. start right now. quit what you are doing and start eating as suggested. did you ever get your JB book? go to Johns site and use the Massive Eating Calculator--it may seem a bit high but go with it anyway.

i still recommend "Westside For Skinny Bastards". look over that program and plug in exercises that you like to do. its very easy and right there for you to print out. dont stress/worry to much about the mobility drills and whatnot--make sure you are lifting. a lot.

i think grim reaper makes some good points but at your weight and lean body mass i wouldnt recalculate calorie intake for off days. your body is still recovering on those days and the extra food is only going to help--not hinder you.

dont sweat the small shit. thats why you arent making gains right now. if you would just do this you would gain so much mass in 6months that you wont give a shit about 14.5 or 11.08%body fat.

i know it works.

and its very simple:
eat as above.
train as above.
its all drawn out for you.

train hard.
\ryan b.