The layer system does look intriguing. But even with using only the Ramp to Max, Clusters & HDL, I’m looking at ~11 sets (plus warm ups). I like this idea, but wonder if it violates CT’s recommendations for volume restriction…
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
Eazy-hard gainers respond better to training for performance. SPEND ALL YOUR EFFORTS ON GETTING STRONGER ON THE BIG BASICS. Drop the isolation work, they will do more harm than good and supplement your training with heavy loaded carries.
I now find that the key is to keep the workout duration at or under 40 min. But try to train as often as possible . 6 workout of 30 min is much better than 3 of 60 min[/quote]
A few questions:
- Does the 40min include warmup sets? I’m thinking not but would like to make sure
- What makes loaded carries effective?
- Wouldn’t 6 workouts put more stress on the CNS than 3 of 45min?
thanks
If it helps - im the ONLY person who walks around my local public Gym carrying weights…so far, no one seems to care. I am careful to avoid a collision and keep my distance - after all, if it all went horribly wrong and someone got hurt, Im sure I should be held to blame as
I am the the " odd - one - out"…its not going to stop me though ! Personally speaking, whatever works and brings results, it its decent and legal - ItS IN !!! I never allow dogmatic convention to limit my training.
[quote]flch95 wrote:
- Does the 40min include warmup sets? I’m thinking not but would like to make sure
- What makes loaded carries effective?
- Wouldn’t 6 workouts put more stress on the CNS than 3 of 45min?
thanks[/quote]
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YES, it starts when you begin to lift anything, so no time to mess around. Last time I was at Biotest HQs, I increased my high pull by 50kg (110lbs) and my bench press by 20kg (45lbs) in 3 weeks without ever training longer than 35 minutes, I also gained 15lbs in the process.
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- The long time under tension 2) the muscles working in a state of hypoxia (when the muscles are constantly contracted oxygen cannot enter in the muscle and this hypoxic state causes the release of a ton of local growth factors) (3) they target many muscles that are neglected by regular lifting movements
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No, there is nothing harder than doing a CNS-intense session after a day off. When you train daily the nervous system becomes used to it and doesn’t suffer from sudden switches from relaxation to full activation.
So insightful. A few questions:
Is the <40 min recommendation what allows for multiple daily sessions (assuming tolerance is built up)?
Would isometrics (static/yielding) like ring holds be an upper body equivalent of loaded carries?
Point 3 is unique - CNS being more stressed by major intensity fluctatuions rather than daily exposure - and could this explain why I always feel a bit crappy (and even body composition seems worse?) day after intense deadlift capacity workout?
[quote]-Sigil- wrote:
So insightful. A few questions:
Is the <40 min recommendation what allows for multiple daily sessions (assuming tolerance is built up)?
Would isometrics (static/yielding) like ring holds be an upper body equivalent of loaded carries?
Point 3 is unique - CNS being more stressed by major intensity fluctatuions rather than daily exposure - and could this explain why I always feel a bit crappy (and even body composition seems worse?) day after intense deadlift capacity workout?
[/quote]
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Not necessarily. In fact when doing multiple sessions I often prefer 30 + 30 or 40 + 20 , or sometimes 40 + 30
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Ring holds work, but they do not have the same overall metabolic effect as carries… the fact that you are burning more overall energy (and using more oxygen) make the carries more effective. Furthermore, many carries (most) hit the upper body hard, so they do not need an “equivalent”.
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No, it has more to do with elevated cortisol
Eazy-hard gainers respond better to training for performance. SPEND ALL YOUR EFFORTS ON GETTING STRONGER ON THE BIG BASICS. Drop the isolation work, they will do more harm than good and supplement your training with heavy loaded carries.
I now find that the key is to keep the workout duration at or under 40 min. But try to train as often as possible . 6 workout of 30 min is much better than 3 of 60 min[/quote]
This concept is profoundly liberating and certainly worth a try. Thanks CT.
[quote]ns182 wrote:
The layer system does look intriguing. But even with using only the Ramp to Max, Clusters & HDL, I’m looking at ~11 sets (plus warm ups). I like this idea, but wonder if it violates CT’s recommendations for volume restriction…[/quote]
Should be fine…
And will get you in and out in circa 40-45 mins.
First 2 you can get done in 20 mins.
HDL’s and the last layer is where the time sink is trying to catch your breath 
I’ll mirror everything CT said and add one word: density. When I’m in the gym I know I come off as kind of unfriendly, non-interactive, and single mindedly pre-occupied–because I am! I simply don’t have any time to mess around. One of the worst habits anyone can develop in the gym is being distracted and taking too much rest between sets; it simply takes you out of the “zone” and has a greater negative impact on performance than most people realize. keeping a quick pace keeps you psychologically and physiologically “locked in”.
This is to say that density is key. Density–or the ability to complete a high amount of (quality) work in a relatively short amount of time–not only activates the CNS and keeps it fresh (by preventing over stimulation), but also creates a physiological environment conducive to both LBM gains and leanness. Besides all that, it simply trains your body to be more resilient, tougher, with greater work capacity.
Crowbar
[quote]ns182 wrote:
The layer system does look intriguing. But even with using only the Ramp to Max, Clusters & HDL, I’m looking at ~11 sets (plus warm ups). I like this idea, but wonder if it violates CT’s recommendations for volume restriction…[/quote]
Even when I ramped up to 425 on the bench press my layer session never laster more than 45 minutes. You will have to work on gradually shortening the rest intervals without affecting performance.
CT - apologies if you’ve covered this but aside from bench press (which you’re avoiding currently to practice o-lifts?) what other press movements are suitable for layering?
Specifically, I’m focusing on overhead presses (some from pins), continous power snatch and clean/press but I think these are not as layer friendly?
Can one get good results from just 1-3 rep ramp “practices” on these lifts, done with high volume for gains?
I’ve moved away from BP due to lowering bodyweight (and shoulder tenderness) so trying to focus on other barbell pressing movements. DO you see BP as necessary for optimal development of pressing muscles?
Many thanks.
Any alternative (or recommendations) to the bear hug carry for chest day?
I am good with the other carries, but I tried the bear hug today and found it quite physically awkward for me. Plus, I was feeling it more in the biceps than the chest.
[quote]timmcbride00 wrote:
Any alternative (or recommendations) to the bear hug carry for chest day?
I am good with the other carries, but I tried the bear hug today and found it quite physically awkward for me. Plus, I was feeling it more in the biceps than the chest.[/quote]
It’s normal to feel it in the biceps, that’s not necessarily a bad thing! I see carries as a way to hit bodyparts that might not get hit optimally with the main exercises.
KB or DB squeeze carries… hold the KB or DB mid chest and try to squish it with both hands with the elbows pointed straight outward., then walk.
If you are an athlete and need to build some conditioning into these recommendations where would you work it in and what frequency?
What are some broad recommendations for somewhat that’s little bit of an easy-hard gainer leaning more towards the hard gainer part that’s wants to increase a power lifting total. I want to maintain my weight of 180 @ 5’10" too. I also have to run 2-3x a week 1.5-3 miles depending on the intensity of the run.
[quote]-Sigil- wrote:
CT - apologies if you’ve covered this but aside from bench press (which you’re avoiding currently to practice o-lifts?) what other press movements are suitable for layering?
[/quote]
Scrape-the-Rack Overhead Press; Kneeling Overhead Press from Pins; Savickas Press from Pins; and Top-Half Press from Pins (set right at the top of the head).
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
You would be better off doing heavy carries as a second workout.
Squat day: yoke walk; put the bar on your shoulders and walk[/quote]Would it be a good idea to use slightly less load on the bar and walk on toes, for better calf stimulation ?
[quote]tolismann wrote:
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
You would be better off doing heavy carries as a second workout.
Squat day: yoke walk; put the bar on your shoulders and walk[/quote]Would it be a good idea to use slightly less load on the bar and walk on toes, for better calf stimulation ?
[/quote]
No, the goal is whole body stimulation. This will reduce the overall body tension and thus the efficacy of the exercise.
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
It’s normal to feel it in the biceps, that’s not necessarily a bad thing! I see carries as a way to hit bodyparts that might not get hit optimally with the main exercises.
[/quote]
Good point, I am not exactly rocking mountains for biceps. : )
[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
KB or DB squeeze carries… hold the KB or DB mid chest and try to squish it with both hands with the elbows pointed straight outward., then walk.[/quote]
I will try this, thanks!
Can I also say, that the Overhead Press walk is probably one of the awesomest things I have ever tried. I did it yesterday afternoon and instantly fell in love with it. Felt great all through the tricep and upperback, too areas that can’t get too big IMO.
[quote]-Sigil- wrote:
CT - apologies if you’ve covered this but aside from bench press (which you’re avoiding currently to practice o-lifts?) what other press movements are suitable for layering?
Specifically, I’m focusing on overhead presses (some from pins), continous power snatch and clean/press but I think these are not as layer friendly?
Can one get good results from just 1-3 rep ramp “practices” on these lifts, done with high volume for gains?
I’ve moved away from BP due to lowering bodyweight (and shoulder tenderness) so trying to focus on other barbell pressing movements. DO you see BP as necessary for optimal development of pressing muscles?
Many thanks.[/quote]
“Layering” refers to ramping up than doing something else with the same movement to take advantage of the state of neural activation. It doesn’t have to be the clusters and HDL.
For example one could do density work after the ramp.
Here are some possibilities:
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Use 80% of your max (in the ramp) and perform a total of 30 reps as quickly as possible (doesn’t have to be sets of a specific number of reps, just get done with the 30 as fast as you can)
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Use 80% of your max and perform as many reps as you can in 6 minutes
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Use 80% of your max and perform as many reps ad you can in 4 minutes; then use 70% and get as many reps as you can in 4 minutes
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Use 90% and get 10 reps as fast as you can; then use 80% and get 20 reps as fast as you can.
Etc.