T Nation

Dumbing Things Down

I have been following a Westside template for about 6-7 months. Before that, I was following Madcow2’s version of Bill Starr 5x5.


I have been getting, quite honestly, not very good results on the Westside template and I am seriously considering switching back to the Madcow2 program. I have been eating enough and I have gained muscle and weight, but my strength is progressing VERY slowly. Here is why I want to switch back:

  1. I feel like I am not advanced enough for Westside
  2. I don’t like not being able to squat/deadlift in the same week
  3. I think that I responded better to the more basic template
  4. I prefer having multiple max effort days per week. Simply because it gives me more opportunities to add weight to the Big 3 rather than the Westside template where you only have 1 ME Upper and 1 ME Lower day.
  5. Due to my current schedule I can only exercise 3 days a week

What’s your opinion on all of this? One thing I will change to the Madcow2 program is that I will add in some assistance work (dips, some type of bicep curls, rear delt exercises, ab work, maybe some pullups).

Also, Madcow2 prescribes a 4 week deload period before the progression actually begins. This seems a little bit too much…I was thinking maybe a 2 week deload…?

The way I operate under the Madcow2 is once I stop adding weight to the bar each week, I just try and grind out more reps each session.

PS- also pondering the more advanced 5x5 geocities.com/elitemadcow1/5x5_Program

Westside not squatting and deadlifting in the same week, what template are you possibly using? Your not doing Westside if your only lifting 3 days a week…

Pick a new program that fits your schedule and skill level…

What “westside” are you following? Is it something you created or is it an actual template from somewhere? And besides that, what exactly are you lifting for?

On to your numbers:
1)How advanced, or not advanced, are you?
2)You can still squat and deadlift in the same week. You just have to be smart about it.
3)That’s possible. Some people over complicate things.
4)I guess this depends on what you can handle and what kind of weights you are lifting.
5)There’s a lot of ways to accommodate a 3 day a week schedule.

I’m not trying to sway you one way or the other. I’ve done westside and madcow’s and both programs work.

How can you not Deadlift and Squat in the same week?

If 3 days is your sweet spot, look into Sheiko or Stephan Korte’s 3x3 Program. Korte will have you performing Bench, Squat, and Deadlift 3 times a week for 8 week - it’s a gas.

I recently converted to a Powerlifting format and powered through Korte’s Program I’m currently finishing week 2 of Sheiko #29.

You can do it if you commit to the program.

Man up.

A number of people do Westside type training three days a week. You just follow the standard 4 workout template and do them in order, Jim Wendler & Dave Tate have written about this several times.