Dropping Dose & Splitting It?

Drop it. E2 isn’t bad. Mine is 73, no issues.

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Dexter, at that high E2 do you feel symptoms related to high estrogen? You said you haven’t had Gyno at that level while on TRT, but have you get anything else?

Yes, not knowing exactly where my E2 is at is bothering me. I’m also not sure why they didn’t run free test or SHBG. I do labs after I finish a vial, and my next lab will be scheduled for next Friday. I will make sure one, or both, of those tests are run. You’ve now got me wondering if I could drop the AI next week and see what my labs look like when I get tested Friday. You may be right, and I may not need one. I’m definitely in agreement that 1mg a week is obviously too much for me. If anything, I may dial it back to .5 a week starting Monday.

There is no such thing as symptoms of high estrogen. I know this will break your head (it broke mine at one point).

Hormone fluctuations throughout the week can cause issues. Some men can do one injection a week and be fine. Others need to do more frequent shots.

Some men take too much and that causes issues (their bodies just can’t handle it)

Some men don’t take ENOUGH and that causes issues (androgen deficiency)

There are LOTS of reasons to have issues.

Here is something else that will break your head:

The doctors that I deal with don’t even MEASURE it anymore because they realize half the benefits you are looking for on TRT comes from the conversion to estrogen. As long as you are worried about something you should be worried about, you’ll never get it figured out. It will be dose and protocol dependent.

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By the way, you don’t just drop and AI and do labs a week or two later. There is no reason to do labs after you finish every vial. Do labs 8 weeks after you’ve made a change to your protocol, not before. You may even feel like crap for a couple of weeks while your body gets balanced out with the AI so don’t panic. Your crashed E2 is what is hurting you more than anything right now. Don’t go so much with the numbers. Go with how you feel. You try more or you try less until you figure out the best dose for you. When you change something, wait 8 weeks before you make any other changes.

I guess once I let go of the fear and anxiety of getting Gyno again I will feel much better. I still work out extremely hard. I’m coming off of a “dirty” bulk I did this winter where I took myself from 190 up to 220lbs. This could be causing my bloat, and the whole time I’m thinking it’s due to my high test level and/or E2 level. I just started my cutting phase this week and I’m back to my normal clean eating habits. I take pride in my appearance and body, so that’s why Gyno is to me what nightmares are to a child.

On another note. Thank you to everyone who has responded so far. Great information that truly has me rethinking the entire way I view things. I look forward to hearing and talking more about it with y’all.

So would your recommendation for me be to continue 200mg/week (split into 2 injections of 100mg) and reduce the AI dosage, or ditch the AI completely and see how I feel?

Excellent videos Danny. I’ve watched the first two. The doctor you had on made some outstanding points.

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Stick to that dose for now and ditch the AI. Tell yourself that over the next few weeks you’ll be all over the place. At one point you’ll stabilize and things will improve. Once it does, you’ll never touch an AI again, I assure you.

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Your TSH might be hinting at a problem and rarely do I see guys claiming to feel optimal on TRT with TSH 2.5>. The median TSH level is 1-1.5, I would at least check free thyroid hormones to be sure.

AI’s are bad long term, so you should make plans to dial in on TRT in isolation because this is the end game.

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Yes, agreed with @systemlord (again ffs!!!)

Add Free T3 and Free T4 to your labs next time. Ensure your doc knows something about thyroid.

To me, the glaring variable was the 1mg of Arimidex. That has to go. Once I saw that I really didn’t bother looking at anything else lol

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No symptoms. Everything I associated with high estrogen in the beginning turned out to be just my body getting used to hormones and learned the hard way time heals all wounds. Now I’m living my best life. Only wasted a year before I got there. I’ve never felt or looked better. Get on the train.

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I’ll definitely bring this up when I go back for labs. I’ve made up my mind I’ll try the advice I was given here and ditch the AI for a little while and then go have more labs done, and see what they look like. I’ll keep everyone updated as I go along.

Stop. What if your labs show E2 at 100 but you feel better than ever? Will you take an AI? Will you blame your issues on the ‘high E2’ or will you, instead, fine tune your protocol?

Spoiler alert: Fine tuning your protocol and forgetting about the E2 is your best bet.

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Don’t expect your doctor to be concerned about your TSH in a healthcare system (sick care) where normal is good enough but not always healthy.

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I’m guessing my best bet would be fine tuning protocol. I came across this article on this website:

What do you make of these claims that high E2 levels lead to increased health risks?

It’s stuff like this why we have the TRT and Hormone Optimization YouTube channel. This is called ‘Bro Science’. They make all these claims about estrogen yet most of the claims cannot be demonstrated in any medical literature. In fact, it’s the opposite. Do you want libido, erection strength, improved cognition, better bone mineral density, less visceral fat, less risk for diabetes and cardiovascular disease etc. etc. etc.? Guess what does that? Estrogen.

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I’m just reading through this article and I’m literally laughing my head off out loud.

This is hilarious. Sheesh! I’d love to have this guy on my channel for a discussion! :wink:

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I guess I know why we’re all pudgeballs now so at least that’s settled

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I’m with you, and I’m going to take your advice and ditch the AI. The main reason I started reviewing my last labs, and ultimately seeking advice here, was due to the fact that I’ve been having none and joint pain when working out. The bone pain in my forearm right now feels like someone hit my forearm with a hammer and bruised it. I’m currently at the gym doing chest. This is usually my favorite day in the gym, but today and the last few times have been horrible. I usually work out with 270, and push to the 300s when I’m feeling really good. Today the pain was nearly unbearable at 225. That’s a red flag to me. I am in the beginning of a calorie deficit to start my cut, and usually expect to feel a little weaker during the beginning stages of a cut. This is different. This is telling me I took my estrogen and flushed it down the toilet. Really wish I would’ve looked at the labs harder when I had them done. I wish I would’ve sought advice sooner. My doctor will freak out and probably try to take extreme measures when he sees what my E2 will be next labs. He was a former bodybuilder so he is a believer in the bro science of estrogen control. I don’t care though, something has to change.