T Nation

Dr. Mel C Siff.

Shurbert:

How about getting the good old doctor to write something for t-mag? Or maybe an interview? T-mag is suppose to have the best…I think Mel is in that company. Do you agree? Thanks Chris.

Keago

I really don’t know that much about Siff. Is this the guy Ian King calls Mr. Poison Keyboard or something like that? I honestly don’t know, but I do know that the only time I ever hear of Siff is when he’s telling everyone else in the field that they’re wrong and he’s right. Seems like Poliquin had a beef with him too if I recall. Nothing wrong with that; he may make an interesting interview. We’ll think about it.

Mel’s a bright guy – no doubt. But he spends more time analyzing how many angels can dance on the head of a pin then providing actual advice that can be used in the gym. I participate on his “Supertraining” list. I asked detailed question about setting up an active recovery routine. Despite the fact that he and Dr. Yessis have a book entitled “Sports Restoration and Massage” he has not provided any answer. Instead he writes ad nauseum about proper grammar and scientific issues which are wholly unrelated to training. In fairness he will actually provide advice in his area of specialty, Olympic Weightlifting. Also he love to criticize every other training guru on the planet. If you can get a straight answer out of him I am sure it would be useful and accurate… it’s just next to impossible to do.

Ummmmmmmm well ya I can see where their coming from it’s more like nerve toxin keyboard. Actually he’s not that bad. I don’t think he should be passed up just because of this reputation. I think this guy really really knows his stuff and he get pissed with all these pretenders(not implying Ian is one of them…Ian’s the man). Dave Tate and Louie like him so he can’t be that bad. You can give him this chance to prove he’s not a dick or at least that he knows his shit. I feel if he disproves something that is almost of more valve then finding something new. Why waste your time with crap right? Thanks for the quick response…like under 2 hours…now that’s service. :slight_smile:

Keago

I seriously doubt he would consent to an interview. T-mag is probably considered filler to him,i.e. pop fitness. I suggest you join the supertraining group to learn more of Siff’s views. I agree with Dr. Siff that Ian King and Poliquin are lightweights when it comes to the actual science of exercise–more like marketing gurus. Chris, I suggest reading Siff’s Supertraining or Facts and Fallacies of Fitness. Westside Barbell has a close relationship with Dr. Siff. That in itself might appeal to some readers.

Siff is a prick whose never had any real world results or trained any world class athletes. He’s the guy who rearranges deck chairs on the sinking Titanic. Mr. Minutia is a better term for him.

Yeah, Dave–it sounds like you’re really familiar with his work. You shouldn’t get snippy just because you can’t understand any of his writings. You see, you have to actually use your brain to understand it. Nah, better yet, stick with Flex or Ironman for your info.

Damn this sure turned into a pissing match quick. Ha I love this board. It has however insighted me to go to the site mentioned and get information from Dr. Siff as too much information is always better than not enough. Peace Let me know who has a bigger one. haa

I think a quote from Good Morning Vietnam sums up Mel Siff. He “is in more dire need of a blowjob than any white man in history.” I agree an interview would be entertaining, but I’ve never seen him come up with anything original yet he bashes anyone that does. (And yes, I’ve read Supertraining.)

Soul Crusher, you may be right. However, he isn’t a “guru” trying to sell a service. His niche if you will is to promote exercise science in it’s truest form. The supertraining board is a place where open exchange of ideas/questions is welcomed. His dislike of popular coaches/trainers stems from the fact that a lot of them promote ideas/concepts, when, in reality, those ideas were around for years. Also, few of those coaches really understand the complicated science behind what they preach. He relies upon research and references in order to originate or refute any idea as it relates to exercise/nutrition. He certainly has enabled me to open my eyes to think critically about a lot of things.

I agree that there are a lot of false gurus out there. However, Mel goes to great lengths to show that every trainer in the worl is just using variations of things that have been around forever (and coincidently can be found discussed in his “Supertraining” book which you can buy from along with “Facts and Fallacies of Fitness” and “Sports Restoration and Massage” as well as paying to attend one of his “Supertraining” camps"). Often times he comes across as petty to me. Moreover, he criticizes various strength trainers until he actually meets them – i.e., Dave Tate and Louie Simmons. He used to be very critical of WSB (read past weights dot net posts). Now that he is buddy-buddy with the WSB boys – narry a word, except in praise. When he criticizes strength trainers for “just putting well known training concepts together in a different manner” all of which are cateloged in “Supertraining” it sounds to me like Meriam Webster criticizing great literature by saying, “yeah, but all he did was put well known words (all of which are cateloged in my book ‘Webster’s New Collegiate Dictionary’) together in a different way”. He has a lot of knowledge and a lot to offer – I wish he would do more of it rather than trying to prove his superior intellect. Because he can win debates doesn’t mean he is right. And yes, I am a regular reader of Supertraining (the board and the book – as well as his other book) – but frankly, I learn more from the other members of the Supertraining list than Mel.

I read a post by Mel Siff that muscular friction is not a factor because the viscosity of the individual fibers is too low. That is the most ignorant and foolish thing I have heard in a while. Most people here are pretty skeptical of famous Medical or Nutrition PHDs, and rightly so, but some jerk off with a 7 year degree in Gym comes alont and alot of people are on his nut sack (I am not only refering to this thread). The message is more important than the source.

Okay, Colin–you sound brilliant. Thanks for the enlightenment.

Yay me I started a fuckin war. I’m so proud of myself. I have to agree with everyone a bit here. I’m on the supertraining group too and I notice Mel does like to hammer people and prove how smart he is. However at the sametime I think he has alot to offer. An interview can’t hurt…unless Shugs and Mel duke it out. Which would be even more entertaining. Remember to video it Chris. Sillyness aside (which we all know is difficult for me) give the guy a shot and see what happens.

Hey Chris you could ask him "Ummmmm Mel it's come to my attention that alot of people think your a dick please explain."

How did you guys like the Supertraining book? Thanks all. :slight_smile:

Keago

jd, don’t sell me short because I question your guru. This guy really did say that muscular friction is a non factor (or at least to the extent that it helps a lifter during negative exercise and that it accumulates as meaningful work is done) and you can read it for your self. I saw it quoted (it’s from the Super Training board) on SeriousStrength about a week ago. Anyhow, this is a very simple and obvious rule of physics and you should see that. His point was that the viscosity of muscle fibers was too low for friction to have an effect, which is both sill and demonstratably untrue. Even if every other thing out of his mouth is bloody gospel, that statement shows a real lack of understanding of “the science behind training” and should bring about the same skepticism you have for King and Poliquin.

kind of unrelated, but I think that Ian King want to be Anthony Robins. I also think he has a chip on his shoulder. My 2 cents.

although some of the criticisms of Siff are kinda true, it should be noted that he isnt some nerd that’s all brains and no brawn. On the brains side, he has met Verkoshonsky, Zatsiorsky, and was friends w/ Serge Redding. In practice, he was (a proffessional i think) OLer and competed in martial arts. So he isnt like the fat trainer guy at the gym telling the ripped guy how to get in shape (which some of the posts make him out to be).