T Nation

Dr Freaked Out Over Bloodwork

Pharma
#1

i have been on a body recomp. mission for 5 years. i was obese and pre-diabetic reaching 200lbs at 5’6.

i started a training and nutrition program and eventually turned to the dark side. i have been reading this forum for nearly 5 years gathering data from some of the top contributors who i credit for changing my life for the better, so thank you!

i have been using testo enanthate for about 3 years. 250mg/ml. i pin twice per week, 1/2cc so 1 cc per week. i pin subq

i am not taking any other meds or ancillaries, test only!

i feel fine, i look amazing and am down to a solid 145lbs. i am 49 years old. i have not been tested but i would guess i between 8-10% bodyfat.

so i finally got health coverage and had bloodwork done. my doctor called me yesterday and was freaked out. she said my test levels are WAY TO HIGH along with above average thyroid and cholesterol. she said she wants to me stop for a few weeks then start again with 1/2cc per week (1/4cc x 2) to see if things level out.

my questions are:
Is this normal for us that are pinning behind the scenes?

I thought i was on the low end, i read about guys taking way more than 250mg per week?

Is my doctor just being a doctor for a lack of better terms? legally?

she told me that these levels could lead to blood clotting, stroke, heart attack, ect later down the road.

below are the levels she was concerned about but i have my complete panel available if anyone needs to me copy and paste something i didn’t list.

thank you again for any and all feedback. happy new year!

Thyroid (TSH) 0.36 mcIU/mL
normal range 0.55 - 4.78 mcIU/mL

T4, FREE 1.1 ng/dL
normal range 0.9 - 1.8 ng/dL

TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL 4589 ng/dL
normal range 250 - 1100 ng/dL

ESTRADIOL 52.6 pg/mL

#2

Not on TRT personally, but have been fairly well informed by more than a few threads in this forum.
250mg/wk is likely well above a medically justifiable TRT dosage, and you are certainly not on the low end of the spectrum. Given your weight and blood results, this should be considered a mild ‘cycle’ that you are consistently taking.

Yes, there are people taking more than 250mg per week, but most are not even at that amount. There are others who take far more than 250mg/wk and they are most certainly cycling.

Your Total T levels are amazingly high at 250mg/week. How long after your last pinning was the blood taken? As in, were you at your peak or trough when your blood was sampled?

2 Likes
#3

It should be based on blood levels, not on the dose IMO. 250 mg/wk can be legit TRT. I know of people pinning twice a week with this dose or higher that are within range for both TT and FT when pulling bloods at trough. IMO it is TRT.

You are correct for most people though. Most will be outside of ranges significantly at that dose and it’s not TRT. I just would advice against such a blanket statement in regards to what is and isn’t TRT.

For OP, your TT and FT are almost what my levels are on 875 mg/wk blast. It is too high to run sustainably IMO. I think half your dose might be too much for you. You may be someone who is over range on 80-100 mg/wk. I would start at the recommended amount of half and see.

What is your injection frequency, and when did you pull bloods?

3 Likes
#4

I will ammend my original response

1 Like
#5

no worries. thanks for taking the time to respond.

i pin on sundays 5am and wednesdays 5am because it is easier on my schedule. i know ideally it should be an am pin then a pm pin but i can not pin at work. i have been doing this for 3 years straight! feel fine. bloods are concerning.

at least i know my gear is real, lol

1 Like
#6

thanks for your response.

my bloodwork was down approx. 27hrs after a pin. i pin at 5am, the bloodwork was done at 8am the next day.

i used the term TRT just to be safe here on the forum. i made the choice to use gear years ago and knew i would be above TRT. i decided to blast and cruise rather than cycle. i stopped blasting after i reached my goals and starting cruising on 250mg/week.

1 Like
#7

Thanks for your honesty here - you would be better served being straight forward about this stuff so you can actually get the info you need though!

This being the case, do you still have the questions you originally posted:

I am running about to the end of my knowledge here and others on this forum could likely help more, particularly @iron_yuppie @hankthetank89 @swoops39 and @mnben87 (commented above) come to mind

#8

i was not being dishonest i forgot to mention it in my op. i have no issues being transparent.

yes, i still have the same questions. i basically just wanted feedback on my blood work and is it normal that our doctors get concerned with us

1 Like
#9

Your levels are insanely high and your doctor is right to be worried. If you’re living with that level of TT for a long time you’re almost guaranteeing an early grave. Supraphysiological levels are great for building muscle and they’re useful in planned out, short bursts each year. They are not optimal for long term health. Your “trt” dose is way too damn high. It’s not even debatable. 200mg/w is pushing the envelope for pretty much any doctor in the US. You’ve been on a low permablast this whole time.

Because your response rate is ludicrously good you should be using no more than 100mg/w. You should also be getting regular blood work in order to make sure your dose is still putting you in the right place. That you hadn’t done blood work for three years is unbelievably irresponsible and reckless. A man your age should behave differently than a know-nothing 22 yr old bro on Reddit. You owe it to yourself to be better, dude. Sorry for the lecture, but someone needs to tell you to act like a damn adult.

8 Likes
#10

no apology needed for the lecture. in fact, thank you. this is why i use this forum. i appreciate the feedback.

now that i have medical coverage i will work this all out.

thank you again!!!

happy new year!

#11

I’m curious. Why did you have your GP pull blood for testosterone? I mean thats not a normal wellness check up panel. Usually a wellness panel is simple a CBC/CMP in my experience unless other symptoms deem further bloodwork necessary. Plus you had to know it was going to be high. IMO, if you’re self medicating or blasting with T, you pull your own labs outside of the GP.

#12

I agree, testosterone is never tested unless there are specific questions the doctor is looking to answer. It’s an expensive test, not one insurance companies normally like to see included on their bill. Secondly, your TT at 250mg seems absurd. Were you recently blasting?

#13

as i mentioned i recently obtained medical coverage. during my physical i told my doctor i was pinning. she was quick to suggest i take a full blood panel so she can see what is going on.

nothing, per se, alarmed her other than the fact i have been using for more than 3 years with nobody monitoring anything. its with kaiser so i can not comment on the cost. my health was more important to her.

obviously, it turned out to be a good thing. i had no idea i was on my way to an early grave.

#14

no sir, not blasting. i have been cruising for more than 3 years, 250mg per week.

not an excuse, but i was obviously given bad advise when it came to using test.

thank you again for all the replies.

#15

The fact that you told your doctor is pertinent info, I’m not sure if you included it and I missed it maybe. That makes sense. When she told you to decrease your dose did that accompany a script to keep it legal, that would have been a great outcome? The good news about being honest about your use is that you got it checked, the bad news is that it is now part of your medical record.

#16

Why the f would anyone tell that to a doctor…

2 Likes
#17

She did suggest going legit YET. I am sure she will. For now she told me stop until I hear back from her and another doctor.

I am sure they are figuring it out.

I do not mind its part of my medical history. I am almost 50 years old, I need to keep an eye on everything.

#18

Did she tell you to stop pinning cold turkey or has she recommended a certain protocol? This part is important

#19

She suggested I dial back, however, I told her that I had to stop cold turkey for 3 months over the summer when I was stuck in Cambodia with no side effects so she said go cold turkey until I hear from her in about 10 days.

#20

I am not convinced this is the best call, but I’m just some dude that’s frequented a pharma forum - I’m no doctor and I’m certainly not qualified to advise otherwise.

This would probably be the better advice to follow though