T Nation

Dosage, Training Advice for Older Fat Guy?


Okay, this is long, but the sticky threads suggest if I want advise I should provide as much information as possible.

Let me say up front that I am not a body builder. Iâ??m an over-50 fat guy who is going on t-replacement and who is seeking to make the most of it.

Iâ??m going to get into my stats infra, but about three years ago my doctor told me that I had a testosterone level that put me below the 5 percentile mark. He gave me a bunch of bottles of Axiron as well as a prescription, as well as a prescription for a testosterone cream to be compounded by a local pharmacy. My insurance paid for the Axiron once and said no more. I filled the cream off and on, but I really didnâ??t like using either because I worried about getting it on my wife or kids.

In November, 2014, I mentioned injectable and my doctor was like â??hell yeah, thatâ??s a lot better.â?? So he wrote me a prescription and gave me a slightly larger dose in his office. My sex drive had dropped to nothing, but four days later I was walking around the house thinking about sex non-stop when my doctor called me and told me not to take any more testosterone, my PSA level was through the roof.

With my urologistâ??s permission I took a shot before going on vacation in San Juan, and between that and Cialis my wife and I had a sex fest. I had the prostate biopsy and there is no cancer, so I can resume the depo-testosterone. Of interest is that I am instructed to take 1 ml every 10 days, but I actually can refill 10 ml every 60 days. So if I wish I can take 1.5 ml every 10 days, or perhaps save up for a two or three week cycle. I confess to not really knowing about these things. Also, I have a full bottle of Axiron, plus a tib-bit left in a couple of other bottles, which I think I might be able to use to get me over some low spots that other people describe.

At the end of this very long thread Iâ??m going to have some questions. I do hope somebody hopes to read it through. If not, just skip down and answer anyway!

-age: 54
-height: 5-10
-waist: 38"
-weight: 210; as an adult my weight has been as high as 230 (briefly) and as low as 160 (somewhat briefly), but mostly between 190 and 210
-describe body and facial hair: fairly hairy, quick growing beard
-describe where you carry fat and how changed: fat is around my middle and face. I have very little muscle above my waist. No chest muscle, but fortunately no chest fat, either. Pencil arms. Given my unmuscular, fat condition, my legs are actually pretty muscular with only a little fat inside the thighs, and my calves are somewhat large (my wife laughs about it, because her brother is a bodybuilder and apparently has tiny calves that refuse to grow).
-health conditions, symptoms [history]: If you want my health problems the Internet will shut down. Chronic sinus infections. Acid Reflux. Exercise Induced Asthma (somewhat treatable with inhaler use before exercise), essential tremor that gets pretty bad after strenuous exercise such as weight lifting. For what itâ??s worth, I do not have the CYP2D6 liver enzyme at all (no genetic test, just personal observation),
-Rx and OTC drugs, any hair loss drugs or prostate drugs ever: Took Propecia in early 2000's for a couple of years, and yes, started having ED problems shortly thereafter off and on. I have taken Flomax, but not much, and not regularly. I doubt I have taken two weekâ??s worth at a time, and sounds like I shouldnâ??t.
I currently take:
Wellbutrin, 300 mg day/ (I think this has pooped out to some degree)
Vyvanse: Off and on, mostly off right now, I am ADD as hell, but not treated until adulthood
Prilosec: mornings
Zantac: night
Tianeptine: Self-prescribed, 60-100 mg per day
Topamax: Just restarted, 100-150 mg per day

Note: Although I donâ??t drink like an absolute fish, Wellbutrin, Tianeptine, and Topamax all reduce the desire to drink and also are reported to slightly reduce essential tremor. All three slighly reduce appetite. I took them several years ago and they sent my sex drive through the roof. Sadly, thatâ??s not happening right now, but weâ??ll see when I start taking the testosterone. Also, Iâ??m only a few weeks into taking them. Iâ??ve dropped about 15 pounds, though without trying.
-describe diet: Ruffles? Okay, just kidding, but I donâ??t have a special diet. I do not plan on going on a super high protein diet. I like pasta and carbs and vegetables, but donâ??t mind gobbling down a ribeye.
-describe training: right now, virtually none. Wanting to get a light training schedule to build my upper body. In the past Iâ??ve done a pretty heavy treadmill schedule.
-testes ache, ever, with a fever? My right testicle was infected once when I was 21 and had strep. I just started gobbling more antibiotics and it went away.
-how have morning wood and nocturnal erections changed: Less, a lot less. There are times when I can tell when I am healthier because I wake up with a rager.

Goals: I really just want to ramp up my sex drive and build up my upper body some in the process. Iâ??ve got to go easy, because if I get really out of breath itâ??s just pretty uncomfortable for an hour or more, sometimes several hours. Iâ??ve gotten myself in better shape in the past, but it is a slow process.

I think I am kind of lucky in that I can pretty must set my test injections where I want them to be. I really regret not filling all of my outstanding prescriptions for the past few months, but as things are now I have two bottles of unused test, a bottle-plus of Axion, plus my new prescription, which calls for 6 ml per two months, but which allows me to get 10 ml per two months. So I can start out for a couple of months with the goal of reducing fat and then in two months go for some muscle.

I donâ??t think Iâ??m going to be doing any more testing any time soon.

In talking to my doctor, he said he had a patient who was taking some type of estrogen blocker along with testosterone. But when I suggested that I might get this, he said, â??Aw, you donâ??t need that!â?? If I were to buy this estrogen blocker from an overseas pharmacy would it be considered a steroid and thus subject to prosecution? I currently have a really flat chest with no muscle, but also with no â??fat,â?? and Iâ??d love some muscle, but I do not want any breast tissue, and I understand the testosterone can cause this. What is the best pill I can take to prevent the conversion to estrogen?

Any recommended estrogen blocker, and are they legal to import?
What gauge needle is recommended, and can I do this in the thigh so I can see what I am doing?
What dosage cycle advice do you guys have?
Any workout advice for an absolute weakline subject to being really and truly short of breath, to the point of being sick?
Any other thoughts for a fat blob?


I managed my first shot today, and it wasn’t nearly as bad as I thought it was going to be. Used a 20 gauge needle to draw it up and a 25 gauge to inject into my outer thigh. I was surprised that I could just slowly stick the needle all the way in without pain.

It was kind of hard to get the stuff to go through, and I wiggled the needle some. May be some paiin later. Used 1.5 ml today. Will drop back to 1 ml every 10 days or .75 ml every five days until I lose some weight.


You can inject with 1/2" #29 0.5ml [50iu] insulin needles.
You need more frequent injections.
E2 management is important for weight loss
You should check your thyroid function via body temperatures
Have you always used iodized salt?

You will benefit from these stickies:

  • advice for new guys – pay attention to the first paragraph as it might relate to your weight problem
    — and provide more info , labs with ranges
  • protocol for injections