T Nation

Don't Know What To Do. Overtraining?


#1

inb4 lol theres no such thing as overtraining. at least thats what bb.com phaggots say. let me tell you my story.

basically, have been lifting for 1.5years, came from nothing, literally. squatted the bar, deadlifted 30kg, could bench the bar for like 2 reps.

lifts before this 'decline' april 2011(kg)

squat-145
dead-190
bench-100
db row-52.5 x 3
military press 75kg

right so anyway on with my story. i had been hitting the weights hard for a year, pretty much no break but it was cool i felt really good. i was really motivated to hit the gym each time, was energetic all the time and just felt great basically. I had this awesome 'spree' from like feb-april this year, where my lifts skyrocketed. dead went from 140-165, military 62.5 to 75, squat 105-135. you get the idea. i should also mention, yes i do lift heavy usually every session, i start with one of the big lifts and work up to between 2-4 reps usually, some days maxing out. then a couple of other exercises with 6-8 reps usually. this has worked for me from april 2010-2011 so i saw no need to stop

since then (yes for 5 damn months) everything has gone down. i look like shit, i feel like shit daily. Thing is, i dont feel too bad when im not training. which is why i think im still in this rut. because basically im like 'oh i feel not bad actually, i think il go train' and quite literally within like 15mins i feel so bad.

to describe the feeling, face goes really red, overwhelming fatigue, i usually rest on a bench between sets; i dont want to get up from that bench. but i felt ok like 15mins ago? it puzles me greatly.

so basically this happened for like 3 months. id be like 'oh i must have pushed too hard the last session', i go to take 3 or 4 days off, come back and the same thing happens.

before i continue, my diet is in check, im getting enough (probably too much) protein, 1-1.5g/lb bodyweight. and i am def not under maintenance because i have gained a lot of fat since this all started. (from lack of training and shit unproductive sessions). also my logic was, whatever was wrong with me would improve faster if i ate over maintenance. which i still believe to be true tbh.

so as i was saying, i took 2 weeks off about a month ago, and felt pretty refreshed by the end of it, go back to the gym and i get that shit feeling again and i just want to go home. i havent done any training since.

to sum this up because it is getting long, i really want to keep lifting, but i cant. at least for now. and i am seeking out other who have been in my position of overtraining.

i should mention, i am only suggesting it may be overtrainnig. i have looked at symptom lists and i have nearly all symptoms. fatigue, muscle soreness, depression (especially after workouts). also while we are on that its worth mentioning that when i used to do really well i felt so ridiculously good post wo. i felt i could take on the world. now i want to crawl into a hole and die. (most workouts)

so yeah, anyone who has been overtrained, did you just bite the bullet and take time off until you felt 100% better? at this rate, we could be talking months.

lifting was what i got up for each day. now i have nothing. i spend days in front of the damn computer because im constantly tired. Also i dont know if this is related but il mention it, i always wake up with severe nasal congestion, and an extremely dry mouth. again this started back in april when the rest of the crap began. I thought it could be my supplements, so i stopped taking animal pak, zma and whey for a few days but to no avail.

im going to just post this and wait for some replies because i dont want to post a ridiculously long thread for it to not get any

i can see people asking 'what do you want me to say'. to that i answer: for the people who have been overtrained, have you been doing so for as long as me, did you have similar symptoms to me, what do you suggest i do. I am really upset because i look like shit, i am weak as fuk and i cant do anything about it


#2

I Read about half-

  1. 1-1.5g protein/Lb does not = Diet in check. If you consider Protein the only factor in whether or not a diet is in check, you're sorely mistaken.

  2. After your lifts "skyrocketed," and you invariably grew some muscle, did you up your diet? Did you consider the fact that your body would need more at levels of growth to push further?

  3. IMHO, Weakness/fatigue in the gym can come in waves. Submitting to the Lazy (because that what it is at that point (since Overtraining doesnt occur weekly for days at a time) factor turns into a trend, just as you described. You are succumbing to the 'It's hard' factor.

  4. Reread #1. Overwhelming fatigue? Sounds like poor nutrition. Redness in the face? Are you one of those people that hold their breath during sets? High blood pressure issue?

All in all, Nutrition is the culprit. Everything you described can be linked to poor diet. Post what your daily diet.


#3

You're not over trained. If you are, take time off, but I doubt that you are.

I can't even count the number of times I've felt like what you just described, but maybe you just need to push through it. And when I say that, I really mean, just push through it.

I'm doing intermittent fasting right now and its going great aside from feeling like shit half an hour before getting to the gym. I wanna just lie down and sleep, but I hit such a great stride that I don't wanna break that.

SO, to put it simply, you just need some mental toughness. Or maybe you can get a routine going from the moment you wake up. What you do the first hour usually has a great impact on how your day will be like.

The simplest shit you can do however is change your routine.


#4

thanks for your opinion.

i dont consider protein the only factor for diet, but along with good fats and complex carbs and a decent multi i fail to see how one can go wrong.

i am not being lazy. either i go to the gym and feel like shit immideatly or i dont go and i feel 'ok'. not i have not experienced feeling 'good' when not even going to the gym for months now. this possibly could point to a more serious problem..?

my diet really hasnt changed much from when i was doing well, to now. i dont have a 'set' diet, because i dont think it is necessary, and a lot of people dont. i am not looking to be shredded year round. i lift to get strong and look decent not to compete. i eat decent foods and get decent protein. an example of a day in chrono order would be:

tuna sandwich+2 scoop whey
chicken baguette
some sort of carb with more chicken
pb sandwich+ 2 scoop whey
dinner, whatever mum makes, it is always complex carb and a decent amoutn of prot
pb sandwich
natty cc
1 scoop whey

thats an average kind of day. the sandwiches are brown bread. to be honest, it could be better, even by my standards, but im out most days so this is what i end up with

i honestly dont see it being diet because as i say it hasnt changed from when i felt good. And yes i was eating more as i gained weight.

maybe high blood pressure, i hold my breath on each rep yeah because i thought you were supposed to as it gives support or some crap, as well as push abs out. well i know you are supposed to. obviously not the whole set though.


#5

bro i have been trying to 'push through it' for months. it isnt working, and it has made things worse. i did take time off and it didnt fix it. i dont blame you for doubting that its overtraining, a lot of people would. but im really not sure anymore. I had symptoms like this before, but they only lasted for a couple of days and like you said i took time off and i was ready to lift again, but now resting doesnt seem to help.


#6

how much does it feel like you're eating though? how challenging is it to finish every meal?


#7

It could be your training style. You said in the original post that you work up to a 2-4 rep max and often max out pretty much every session?

Working with weights at or above 90% of 1rm for weeks/months on end is doable for a beginner but will burn you out as you get more advanced.

If you on top of this takes most sets close to or to failure then that is only gonna reinforce the problem.

Have you ever followed a program that has a deload regimen?

What is puzzling though, is that taking 2 weeks off didnt seem to help. That suggests it may be some medical issue. Paying the doctor a visit and getting your hormonal levels checked wouldnt hurt.


#8

i think you are right. i have never followed a set program except starting strength for like 5 months from april 2010 to october 2010. i hated it but it did get lifts up.

i was also surprised 2 weeks off didnt help. i will get a blood test done i think


#9

very hard. because im rarely training now i dont get hungry anyway. when it was all going well i had a massive appetite. I have to force myself to eat atm. i could probably get by on like just over 2k atm in terms of how i feel. obviously i know i need to eat more than this


#10

Yes neural fatigue is a bitch. It could be your diet/sleep/stress, but a simple thing you can try is to stop maxing out often and going to failure less.

Worked for me-


#11

i will do this most definitely, when i actually am able to train. to be honest, im not sure what is stressing me out more. training, or not being able to train.

thing is, i really want to but countless times in the past months it has just fukked me up for days.

i need to figure out why time off didnt actually help me. maybe i needed more than 2 weeks.. if it is overtraining then sometimes it can take months, depending on how long you have been ovetrained for

i dunno if you guys have heard of lyle mcdonald. he wrote a series on overtraining. a good read


#12

That sounds how i felt before i realized i had depression - the sudden total loss of energy is what made me think this

You might of been over-reaching over training is pretty rare even in athletes that train 25 hours per week.

could be adrenal fatigure aswell

could be something else, I would seriously get yourself checked out


#13

thnks. yeah i had considered adrenal fatigue. i also have spates of depression, usually pwo (the bad ones recently, as i say before april this year i felt great pwo). but i have had bouts of depression even when i didnt lift so maybe i am more prone to it.

how would you go about 'getting yourself checked out'. do you mean like a blood test?


#14

i would get a full physical and psycological analysis


#15

At various times I have trained from 20-40 hours a week which inluded track work, weight lifting, and plyometrics along with specific sports training. Only two things made me feel like I was in an overtrained, depressed state. One was Mono..and it felt like it lasted about a year or two. The other was just plain "not eating enough". If I ate as much as I possibly could and took amino acids and got plenty of fruits veggies and meat...I hardly got sore or "down". If I ever felt that way...I knew I had not eaten enough.

But through the year there were variations in volume of training. Meaning intensity or quality was kept basically high... but the volume was reduced dramatically.

My $0.02 for what its worth


#16

If you are/were overtrained the rest would correct the problem.
I suggest you change the routine and cut the intensity way back. Take the PR's from when things were going good and start at 50% for 4 sets of 12. One primary movement and one assistance for chest, back, shoulder, and legs. One movement only for bicep, tricep, & calve.
Do not increase the weight or reps for any reason until you have made four weeks without missing a workout. Evaluate how you feel....make new plan.....put plan in action. If you still are having problems I think the problem is not workout related and you need to look for other causes.


#17

Have you ever taken a deload week?


#18

It sounds to be more medical than anything. Other than what others have said about regulating the intensity.


#19

I would say to definitely find a program with deloads built in for the future. Setting PR after PR day in day out for over a year can be pretty taxing, but I doubt your truly overtrained. Mental fatigue would be the more likely problem.


#20

This is excellent advice - follow it!

Also, I would say, aim to drop isolated, single body part workouts. Do an upper (A) and lower body routine (B). Do ABA one week, then BAB the next.(following the set/rep suggested above) If you still have problems after 6 weeks or so, then you need to check with a doctor