Ive done 2 really high frequency things like that. I did pavel tsatsouline's push-up programme which has you doing push-ups every 30-60mins for 2 weeks (i ran through it twice). got me awesome at push-ups and added a little to my chest and arm measurement during a cut when i lost 1/2lbs a week.
also did a pull-up programme for 4 weeks where you did pull-ups everyday (neutral grip) but adding 5 reps to your daily target each week, ended up at 65 a day for the final week. cant remember exactly but think i added 1/2" to my around my chest in that time (during a gaining phase). that was a tough one but seemed to do the trick, although i didnt want to even look at a pull up bar for about 3 months afterwards.
I think theres no reason programmes like that cant work, as its just a form of specialisation really, so long as you make accomadations for it in the rest of your programme. for example during the push-up programme i did no other pressing work other than an overhead press workout once a week. but i also think it depends on your development level, i was a noobie at the time. I dont think someone with already very well developed pressing strength would get much out of it. The pull-up one of the other hand.....
100+x a day exercises are probably best when being used as GPP or pre-hab.
But to my mind, the problem with using a 100x day scheme for a developmental exercise or accessory/assistance exercise is that you really end up training work capacity more than strength. I mean, if you are capable of performing 100 pullups every single day, there is no way your body is getting any stronger or bigger after a certain point, and for a couple reasons: 1) there is no progressive overload or periodization, and 2) the loads you are using are to small to induce any adaption. But, you will definitely be a badass at performing pullups and your GPP will be better off for it.
Now, if you switched it to 10 pull ups a day, 5 sets of 2, while progressively adding more and more resistance (vests, hanging weights, etc.) for example, I could see a correlating progressive increase in back strength and a carry over to deadlift.
Just my opinion, though. Maybe others with first hand experience could say otherwise.
I did 100-200 leg curls a day for a few months, and the results were awesome. I used to have constant problems with those bastards, quads were too tight, hammies were too loose and weak. I once severely pulled my hamstring running long distance in high school track. Since that frequency, no hammy problem and my DL position has improved too. Also, I've gotten a lot stronger in a wider squat stance.
I've also done high volume pull-ups, but not every day, more like 3 times a week Id either do 100 BW or the equivalent work with weight strapped on, and this thread just made me realize I have no excuse to not still be doing this, haha. Results for that were good too.
Military presses every day. Within 3 weeks surpassed my PR. After 6 weeks added 10% to it (went from 225 to 265). Did an arm training program for 21 days straight and added 3/4 of an inch Currently doing 50 bodyweight triceps extensions every time I walk into the gym (at end of session) . Program CT was kind enough to share in his thread. Also do lockouts every time for 3-4 sets of 5 reps. Elbows have never felt better and triceps are getting stronger and bigger (I am on day 10). Also squatted daily for 19 days in a row regaining 2 inches in size after having been sick for a year.
I echo the fat loss results from doing this...
Also have an old thread somewhere on here where I did Waterbury's high frequency training and did full body for 6-8 times a week for 6 weeks. Made retarded gains...
Being cursed with narrow shoulders I'm always on the lookout for ways to grow some delts. I read somewhere that Arny did lateral raises daily so that's what I did for a while. I should start doing that again...
Depends. But even if so, that certain point is a long ways off for most people. Just looking at the total volume is one thing, but the breakdown of how you get there is what causes (and shows) the strength/size gains.
Those aren't the only two ways to cause an adaptation. Density is a viable route, and probably the most common with "grease the groove"-type training. You end up doing more total work in each mini-session.
And the periodization depends on the lifter. Some GTG-type methods use staggered progressions or a kind of "delayed linear progression", so you'd stay at one "level" for a few sessions before increasing; other methods do use waves that gradually increase and then briefly decrease the work being done.
If I hit fatigue at the 7th rep in week one, and hit fatigue at the 12th rep in week three, and hit fatigue at the 15th rep in week five, how am I not adapting?
I'm pretty sure that's called "working out." I'd say most "train everyday"-situations don't mess with the load often, if at all, due to sheer convenience or to avoid one more variable to juggle.
Fair enough. Not trying to bust your balls, just addressing some points made.
I've been doing Waterbury's SOB Training recently (every session is squat or deadlift variation and horizontal or vertical push and horizontal or vertical pull and accessory work) 3-5 days a week.
Not totally comparable with what you did (okay, it's about half what you did, ha), but I'm very happy with what's going on. There's definitely something to higher frequency work, even with/especially with big lifts involved.
I really like phases where I do the same lift every day for 7-10 days. Did it with pullups, overhead presses, and cleans. Also did things like 100 kb swings the first day, 200 on the second and so on up to 700 on Sunday. I always make sure to never come close to grinding and just let the volume do the work. Great 'overreaching' tool to boost plateaus.
haha, start with 50 and see where that leads you! This might not seem that much the first couple of days but 3-4 days later you will feel the accumulated fatigue. Oddly on day 5,6 you start feeling better and the reps become easier. I have noticed several times now that anywhere between day 10-12 I can a lot more reps per mini-set.
I started out doing the bodyweight extensions for example at 5 sets of 10 and now 10 days later I am doing sets of 18-17.
I did it before with pull ups and started with sets of 3 and four weeks later was doing 4-5 sets of 12-10 and that was at 250lbs with a complete dead hang.
I like Jim Wendler's advice: start light so you are sure to make your goals.
Start with 50 reps for the first 10 days and then inch upwards till you can do a 100 reps daily. A buddy of mine is doing this with chest push ups and he is quite frankly blowing up. He has his Chest session on Monday (fucking cliche, I know) and than does push ups every except Sunday. He started at 25 a day actually. 5 sets of 5 explosive reps and worked up to 10x10 (with very little rest) currently.
The problem with your analysis is that you're addressing the points of trainee's history between A) being far from capable of performing 100 pullups a day and B) actually being able to do/doing 100 pullups a day. Obviously, if you are not capable of of doing 100 in a day, actively working toward that goal means you are getting bigger and stronger to some extent.
However, I'm addressing this in the specific context of csulli, who from what I can gather, either has in the past or already is performing 100 pullups a day. Furthermore, I was addressing his specific example of 100 pull-ups a day to increase back strength as a means to aid in the deadlift.
So, respectfully, I don't think your points about increasing volume are valid, because that wasn't the question presented. The question PRESUMES you are already capable of hitting those numbers.
And I do think high frequency methods work, but even you admit that Thibaudeau's program is much lower volume, and Dan John's program advocates that, at some point, you increase load.
Neither of those programs, as I understand it, advocate 100 reps of the same movement every day without increasing load as a means to become stronger.
If I can do 100 pushups in a single session right now, and I do 100 pushups every day from now until October 30, 2014, do you think my bench will improve? Do you think anything will improve other than my ability to do 100 pushups in a single session?
100s a day are going to be awesome for maintaining general work capacity, prehab (I love facepulls, FWIW) and GPP, but I just can't see any serious carry over to anything else once you get good at doing 100xday. Training has to be dynamic in order to make improvements.
Very good point. I could not agree more. Having tiny joints it is not always possible for me to add weight and/or reps BUT I can always add more sessions even if it is just a few sets on the 'off' days.
Everybody can do 100 reps of whatever in a day. How that 100 is broken down into mini-sessions will be the deciding factor in what happens to their strength, body, conditioning, etc. Doing 1x10 ten times a day will be different than doing 4x25 before bed, which is different than knocking out 1x100 before breakfast.
So you were addressing csulli specifically, and I was addressing the idea in general.
I suppose I did focus more on the "every day" part, which would require the attention to volume, rather than the "ultra-high rep" part.
I didn't see that as a presumption at all. I think you're presuming it was presumed.
I can agree with this, if we're talking about something like 1x100.
Once you get up to that 100 in a row, sure. But, I'd still say that the progress of getting to that many in a single set is certainly sufficient to cause other improvements.
But it comes back the reason why someone's doing 100+ reps everyday. For prehab, doing pullaparts for 3x33-34 (to make the math right) with a light or mini band might be the right call. For size, doing pullaparts five times a day for 2x10 with an average or heavier band would be more appropriate. Both put the body through "100 reps a day" of the given exercise. As with all training, the goal should determine the details.
Your point about training density is well taken and I should have said that in my last post.
Pullups are a unique beast for this example, though, because it would be a rare thing to say the least to see someone perform 100 unbroken dead hang pull ups, meaning training density will almost always come into play for those.
But things like band pull aparts, face pulls, curls, what have you, are all going to be easily accomplished even after you reach maximum training density (100x unbroken). In order to increase performance in that movement, you will need to add volume or loading. There's no other way around it.
And even then, you have to wonder WHY you would be doing such a thing. I look at training as having a goal, rather than being the goal in and of itself. Every movement and training parameter should have a specific relationship with your training goal. If you want to be the unbroken pullup champion, it makes a lot of sense. If you are trying to improve your deadlift it makes less sense. The movements are very different, so you can't train it as a SPP movement. At best, it would be an accessory/assistance. And in that context, It makes little sense to do the movement 100x a day every day and only worry about training density. To me, that sounds like a greater emphasis on GPP and work capacity than on improving SPP or even related musculature.
Now, if you are just doing things to do it - then everything works. So, there can be no failure. Yes, training pullups, regardless of density, every day is "working out" and you will be in "better shape" than you were before. If you are increasing your training density, you will see benefit in hypertrophy, too. In a certain context, everything "works"
But, as Csulli alluded to in his second post, if doing 100s a day is such killer method for everything, why not just do all your compound movements 100x a day, every day?