Do This Routine Instead of That Dumb One

All in all a pretty good looking routine, i personally prefer a 2-a-week freq. but thats straight up preference. also, i find if i exhaust my arms the day before shoulders, my stability is dog sh*t

[quote]Maiden3.16 wrote:
But I can only train 3 days a week…

But I heard you shouldnt train arms directly…

But where is the cardio?..

But my pussy hurts…[/quote]

hahahahahahahahaha

[quote]g_trader wrote:
and what is WNG chest supported row machine and WNG seated rows?? Dont understand what WNG stands for.

WNG? (wide neutral grip)?
SHIPS?
NG (Neutral grip right?)
CNG (Close neutral grip?)
HS single leg curl ?

Also if I were set on including power cleans into my regimen, where would it be best fit?? I swear it works out my traps the most. Part of my legs. [/quote]

Everything you guessed, you guessed right. SHIPs = smith high incline presses, HS = HammerStrength. Shrugs are fine for traps, I’ve never seen a bodybuilder doing power cleans.

[quote]gymratnick95 wrote:
All in all a pretty good looking routine, i personally prefer a 2-a-week freq. but thats straight up preference. also, i find if i exhaust my arms the day before shoulders, my stability is dog sh*t[/quote]

I now prefer the 2x a week freq myself and there are 2 such routines in this thread, brah.

[quote]kingbeef323 wrote:
I now prefer the 2x a week freq myself and there are 2 such routines in this thread, brah.[/quote]

haha i knew the routines were there, just saying i find that 2x a week works best for me, and probably will for most others that are natty and eat properly

KB, what do you think of doing the sets straight in your routines? Me and ramping up really don’t get along well as I have experimentally found out.

Hey King,

Can you recommend a 5 day split based on what you’ve learned since starting this thread?

KB-
In your opinion what is the best way to cycle rep ranges? I am currently trying
cycle 1: 2x12
cycle 2: 3x8
cycle 3: 4x6

What about progression? Next time through I have been trying to add 2 reps with the same weight, then after those three rep ranges, I reset to the original set/reps and try to add some weights. On my fifth week and wondering what to do going forward.

Also, Since I train multiple mucle groups in the same session, I stagger them so one group will be on 2x12 and the other might be 4x6, I believe this balances the workouts?
I am interested on your thoughts on varying rep ranges and progression.

[quote]g_trader wrote:

[quote]kingbeef323 wrote:
Mon - Legs

Seated Calf - 4x15-20
Leg press calf - 3x10-15 (knees slightly bent, 1-2 sec squeeze and stretch on each rep)
Lying Leg curls - 4x10-15
Bulgarian Squat - 4x8-12
Leg Press - 4x10-15
SLDL’s - 4x8-12

Tues - Chest/Delts/Tris

Flat dumbbell - 4x8-12
Incline barbell - 4x8-12
Seated OH barbell (ass slid forward) - 3x10-15
1 arm up right row - 3x10-15
Seated lateral raises - 2x20-30 (both to failure)
Decline close grip bp - 4x8-12
Rope pushdowns - 3x10-15
Lying behind the head extensions - 3x10-15

Wed - Back/Bis

WNG chest supported row machine - 4x8-12
WNG seated rows - 3x8-12
Shrugs - 4x8-12
Rear delt row - 3x10-15
Standing reverse cable x’s - 2x20-30 (both to failure)
Pinwheels (meadows style) - 4x10-15
Machine “V” preacher curls - 3x10-15
Incline curls - 3x10-15

Thurs - Legs

Standing calf - 4x10-15
Donkey calf - 3x10-15
HS single leg curls - 4x10-15
Single Leg Press - 4x10-15
Squats - 4x10-15
Hack Squats - 4x10-15

Fri - Chest/Delts/Tris

Low incline dumbbell - 4x8-12
Flat barbell - 4x8-12
SHIPs - 3x10-15
Machine laterals - 4x10-15 + 2 dropsets
Dips (weighted) - 4x8-12
Straight bar pushdowns - 3x10-15
1 arm overhead exts - 3x10-15

Sat - Back/Bis

NG pull ups - 50
CNG pulldowns - 3x8-12
CNG seated rows - 3x8-12
Reverse pec deck - 4x10-15 + 2 dropsets
Hammer curls (both arms together) - 4x10-15
1 arm machine preacher - 3x10-15
Spider curls - 3x10-15

I’ll probably start rotating rep ranges when progress stalls, but for now making great gains and enjoying training with higher reps than I’m used to. Also, I’d say if you’re newer to just keep it to 2 exercises per bodypart with 3 ramped sets.[/quote]

Appreciate all your time you’ve spent laying it out flat for us. Mindless training, thats what I’m about :D. I’ve been using the first 5 day split you posted and its been working great. I’ve done a little research and I want to start doing more frequency so I will be starting this new plan that you posted up. My question is, instead of working to failure on these sets (or are you), about how much effort would you say you put throughout your sets? I would imagine you wouldn’t train to failure but leave some room for later in the week?
[/quote]

Missed this, somehow. Only the last set of each exercise is taken to failure, unless otherwise noted.

[quote]Lakkhamu wrote:
KB, what do you think of doing the sets straight in your routines? Me and ramping up really don’t get along well as I have experimentally found out.[/quote]

I can’t really say, as I haven’t really done straight sets in a long time. I’d say start with 6-8 work sets per week per bodypart, assess progress, and go from there. That’s pretty much what max ot is, now that I think about it, though now, I’m more of an advocate of hitting each body part at least once every 5 days, though I personally find twice every 8 optimalish.

[quote]yayeti wrote:
Hey King,

Can you recommend a 5 day split based on what you’ve learned since starting this thread? [/quote]

I’d say do Push/pull/legs 2 days on 1 day off style. If you wanted to have your workout days the same each week then do 3 on 1 off 2 on 1 off.

[quote]MiJuggernaut wrote:
KB-
In your opinion what is the best way to cycle rep ranges? I am currently trying
cycle 1: 2x12
cycle 2: 3x8
cycle 3: 4x6

What about progression? Next time through I have been trying to add 2 reps with the same weight, then after those three rep ranges, I reset to the original set/reps and try to add some weights. On my fifth week and wondering what to do going forward.

Also, Since I train multiple mucle groups in the same session, I stagger them so one group will be on 2x12 and the other might be 4x6, I believe this balances the workouts?
I am interested on your thoughts on varying rep ranges and progression.[/quote]

I was actually thinking recently about how I would cycle my rep ranges in the future and I’d probably do something like:

Workout 1 - 4-8
Workout 2 - 8-12
Workout 3 - 12-15

With the amount of sets being whatever I was doing before, considering the fact that at the frequency I train at, I usually only take the last set to failure for an exercise.

As far as progression, the only thing that really matters is that it happens, not how it happens. I really don’t think specific patterns of progression are necessary (though I know some programs like to use them, just not my style though). Just keep trying to put more weight on the bar within your designated rep ranges and you should be fine.

Hey Beef, how come you don’t do abs and traps anymore?

Hey King, why do you only do one set per exercise to failure? I was reading in Max-OT that if its not a warmup, acclimation, or set to failure, then the set is doing nothing. Are you including warmups when you say 4 sets for most exercises?

KingBeef, I saw you write something about this in the thread earlier, but what is your response to the following:

#1) If you are about 6’0 tall with very long arms/femurs and a small torso , you would get better quad/leg development/be more comfortable using FRONT SQUATS instead of Back Squats.

#2) You will get better hamstring development with Romanian Deadlift/Stiff Deadlift than normal Deadlift off the floor

Also a random question off topic, I really despise Shoulder Pressing, especially because I have a rotator cuff injury from a year ago.

Do you guys think it’s REALLY that big of a deal if I just stick with Incline Barbell Bench for Shoulder day, followed by High Incline Dumbbell Shoulder press for the Front Delts?

Oh, and just for the sake of it , I will write up the training plan I will be using. Hate asking for ‘critiques’, but I figure some people here give some really nice advice. My main plan is to get a 365 Bench/315 Barbell Row/315 Incline Bench/405 Front Squat while building some decent muscle size in the process. Yes I know…2 goals at once, I should emphasize my main goals are the strength in those lifts above all else.

I’m currently making a drastic training change. I was doing Full Body 3x a week essentially on 3 working sets per muscle group; everything was low reps. Now I am doing everything essentially 1x a week(due to school starting, an injury that is starting to begin nagging me again, and trying to start Ed Coan’s training style to gain strength goals ASAP)

  • = ramped to a top set
    Mon - Incline ~Shoulder/Biceps~

Incline Bench (periodized on a 12 week strength program by Ed Coan)
High Incline DB Press * 3x10
DB Lateral Raise * 3x12-15
BB Front Raise * 3x12-15
Reverse Flye * 3x12-15

BB Shrug * 3x12
DB Shrug * 3x12

BB Curl,Hammer Curl,Preacher Curl * 3x12 each

Wed - Front Squat ~Quads/Hams~

Front Squat (periodized on a 12 week strength program by Ed Coan)
Stiff Deadlift 3x8 *
Leg Press 3x8 alternate w/ Hack Squat 3x8 *
Leg Extension 3x12 same weight all sets
Ham Curls 3x12 same weight all sets

Fri - Flat Bench ~Chest/Tri~

Flat Bench(periodized on a 12 week strength program by Ed Coan)
Paused Close Grip Bench(periodized on a 12 week strength program by Ed Coan)
Paused Incline Bench(periodized on a 12 week strength program by Ed Coan)

Flye 2x10-20

Lying Barbell Tri Extension 5-6x10-12
Lying Dumbbell Tri Extension 5x10-12

(sometimes alternate one of those for Pushdowns,may add a 3rd TRI exercise and do giant supersets)

Sat - BB Row ~Back/Posterior Chain~

BB Row(periodized on a 12 week strength program by Ed Coan instead of Deadlifts)
TBAR Row 3x8
Chins 2x8
Deadstop Dumbbell Row 3x8
Lat Pulldown 3x8 Wide,Medium,Narrow (Sometimes SS/ with Low Cable Row)

So yeah, drastic change for me. Basically everything once a week instead of 3x like I have always been doing.

Thoughts/input/advice; thanks.

[quote]Ethan7X wrote:
KingBeef, I saw you write something about this in the thread earlier, but what is your response to the following:

#1) If you are about 6’0 tall with very long arms/femurs and a small torso , you would get better quad/leg development/be more comfortable using FRONT SQUATS instead of Back Squats.

#2) You will get better hamstring development with Romanian Deadlift/Stiff Deadlift than normal Deadlift off the floor

Also a random question off topic, I really despise Shoulder Pressing, especially because I have a rotator cuff injury from a year ago.

Do you guys think it’s REALLY that big of a deal if I just stick with Incline Barbell Bench for Shoulder day, followed by High Incline Dumbbell Shoulder press for the Front Delts?

[/quote]

I agree with both of those statements pertaining to people with those leverages, such as myself, though I do still like to keep in the back squat for glutes/adductors and overall leg strength/development. Doing the “agile 8” and other mobility drills on a regular basis and adjusting your stance to suit your leverages makes them feel much less shitty.

As for your second question, I’d say do what’s comfortable for you that still allows for progression in your shoulder strength/size. I know John Meadows advocates doing shoulder pressing sparingly in his Mountain Dog routines, so that shouldn’t really be a big deal at all.

Thanks alot. appreciate the response : )

What are your thoughts on doing chest/back in the same day or maybe even chest/arms and then back/shoulders?

Also what about for working sets doing your heaviest set first, then the next one doing less weight with more reps vs just ramping up? Dont you think you would have more energy/strength to put into your first working set?

example A
flat bench
135x8
185x6
205x3
working
225x6
215x8

example B
flat bench
135x8
185x6
205x3
working
215x8
225x6

King, I’m going to drop this one by since the thread got bumped.

I am looking to start bodybuilding(after 1.5 years of powerlifting&strength training), and read all your routines in here. They’re great,but I can not commit to training 6 days in a row(I have also found I always get sick due to a bad immune system if I train 6 days in a row with no break);and that’s the only one you have with a 2x/week frequency.

As a result,I was looking to do 3on/1off like all the greats in the 70’s and 80’s were basically doing.I decided to use what Arnold,Ferrigno and others were using:

Day1- Chest/Back
Day2- Arms/Delts(only 2-3 delt)
Day3- Quads/Hams
Day4- Off
Repeat

What is your input on this; and also, do you feel it is ok to superset the Chest & Back work like Arnold did, or should I just finish Chest completely,then do Back? Same goes for Arms…Superset Bi+Tri is A-OK or should I finish biceps then start triceps.

Thanks!

[quote]Ethan7X wrote:
King, I’m going to drop this one by since the thread got bumped.

I am looking to start bodybuilding(after 1.5 years of powerlifting&strength training), and read all your routines in here. They’re great,but I can not commit to training 6 days in a row(I have also found I always get sick due to a bad immune system if I train 6 days in a row with no break);and that’s the only one you have with a 2x/week frequency.

As a result,I was looking to do 3on/1off like all the greats in the 70’s and 80’s were basically doing.I decided to use what Arnold,Ferrigno and others were using:

Day1- Chest/Back
Day2- Arms/Delts(only 2-3 delt)
Day3- Quads/Hams
Day4- Off
Repeat

What is your input on this; and also, do you feel it is ok to superset the Chest & Back work like Arnold did, or should I just finish Chest completely,then do Back? Same goes for Arms…Superset Bi+Tri is A-OK or should I finish biceps then start triceps.

Thanks![/quote]

I’m going to post a routine using that split later today.

[quote]kingbeef323 wrote:
I’m going to post a routine using that split later today.[/quote]

Awesome!Very stoked to see it. I have been doing it this week verbatim like the Governor/Ferrigno and whatnot did it,and it’s been brutal.

Chest&Back day was supersetted between the two,I’m thinking it should probably just be chest only , then do back after because it was just insane.

Flat Bench->Pullups (2 working set)
Incline Bench->Chinups (2 working set)
Incline DB Bench->TBAR Row (2 working set)
DB Flye->BB Row (2-3 working set)
Dumbbell Pullovers to tie the 2 Superset w/ Cable Crossover(2-3;What lou says to do)
*10,8,8,6-8 rep range[first 2 are warmup,last 2 are working]

The DOMS is out of this world… something about the Chest being stretched right after benching and going to Pullups/Chinups…man the feeling was something I have just never felt before.

Can’t wait to do arms and see how it feels!

[quote]Ethan7X wrote:

[quote]kingbeef323 wrote:
I’m going to post a routine using that split later today.[/quote]

Awesome!Very stoked to see it. I have been doing it this week verbatim like the Governor/Ferrigno and whatnot did it,and it’s been brutal.

Chest&Back day was supersetted between the two,I’m thinking it should probably just be chest only , then do back after because it was just insane.

Flat Bench->Pullups (2 working set)
Incline Bench->Chinups (2 working set)
Incline DB Bench->TBAR Row (2 working set)
DB Flye->BB Row (2-3 working set)
Dumbbell Pullovers to tie the 2 Superset w/ Cable Crossover(2-3;What lou says to do)
*10,8,8,6-8 rep range[first 2 are warmup,last 2 are working]

The DOMS is out of this world… something about the Chest being stretched right after benching and going to Pullups/Chinups…man the feeling was something I have just never felt before.

Can’t wait to do arms and see how it feels!

[/quote]

Damn, that’s nasty volume, lol. I was thinking more 2 exercises per bodypart with 3-4 sets per exercise, last set to failure. Or a hybrid of that and Nubret style training. Chest and back supersets are fine if your conditioning is superb and you want to cut down the workout time and arm supersets are always good.