I've been box squatting recently to build more strength at the bottom of the movement. Today I took the box away and started with like 10 reps of 135 and I did a full depth like thigh to calf squat set for like 9-10 reps. Iadded 30 more pouunds and went to paralel for like 4 reps, then all of a suddem my legs caved on me.
I've been havving problems with squats. I think it's because I snatch and deadlift before them. Should I change up my rotation? I used to max 200 squat but when I'm squatting now I can get nowhere near that.
I've been doing full effort snatches, I've been trying to add more weight to the bar in these... is it affecting my squat that much? or am I just weaker?
To snatch, deadlift & squat in the same workout is very demanding on the CNS, in fact doing any two of these exercises for multiple sets is awfully ambitious. It may be more than you can handle. I would take a few days off and next time you squat, do it fresh at the beginning of the workout. Your performance should improve. You might get away with doing snatches and deadlifts on the same day (snatches first), but save the squats for another day.
You can't handle 3 big lifts like that and expect to be putting up weights that are relatively heavy for you. Doing deadlifts, snatches, and box squats are all hitting your hamstrings, back, and glutes really hard. Pick one of these exercise for your workout of that day and try to hit heavy numbers on that one lift.
The other two lifts you should then either do for volume or not do at all. You might be able to handle Snatches first and then squats or deadlifts after and still break weight records but those are the only two combinations I can see working.
If your Snatch Weight is going up there's pretty much no way in hell you're getting weaker.
I disagree. I think you can do all three. In fact, I routinely do all three in my workouts. I just finished up a two week phase where I did that 2 times a week, and squated 2 other days as well. And a couple summers ago I did whole body routines with squats and O-lifts together at least once a week, generally twice. I think it comes down to your conditioning level.
Right now you're just weak. And, as a relative beginner you can handle large quantities of intense work because you haven't yet developed to the level of really frying your CNS doing it.
I suggest working on getting more reps and/or sets at the same weight of snatches/cleans. You don't need to work at the near max level with O-lifts at your level. Stick to 5 reps or so per set and avoid failure like the plague. Work on getting more tolerance to volume and more refined technique. You'll end up being able to add weight eventually because your body will be more coordinated and have a base level of conditioning to the demand placed on it.
As for squats, stick in the 8-10 rep range for the majority of your work. The fact that you drop off in strength so rapidly when adding weight has to do with several things, but the biggest issue is that you're just weak.
Bottom line, you need more volume tolerance. Many coaches have said this: as a relative beginner, getting conditioned to volume leads to more gains in size and strength than lifting at the low rep ranges--this is because you lack the coordination and technique to effectively push heavy weights to great results. Also, your strength qualities are very poorly differentiated--this means that anything you do is going to help your max strength, including high volume stuff.
Says Thibs from "Training for Newbies, Part 2"
I'm assuming through all of this that you have satisfactory form in the O-lifts and squats, but I rather doubt you do. You should work on form above all else, for your health in the future and longevity in lifting.
My squat form is satisfactory.... but my snatch form leaves somethnig to be desired. Which is what I've been working on. (been doing snatches for 2 weeks)I am pretty efficient at squatting for sure. it's more about weight on the bar and your pride then anything else.
My deadlift though...once It gets heavy starts to break down. I can rep 225 with good form relatively easilly but add 75 on and the first 2 aer barely satisfactory and the third one is nearly stiff legged.
I'm mostly working on efficiency in O lifts at the time being. getting proficient in these while young may give me an edge in whatever the future holds.
I hate to tell you this, but if you've been lifting for about a year and your max is about 200 lb as you said, you're not efficient at squatting. And pride is a dangerous thing with squats. That is precisely the opposite of the correct approach.
Besides, if you're working on the O lifts as your priority, then you should expect your squats to take a back seat. I agree that getting good at explosive lifts is great for your future. But lets face it, you need work on everything. Not trying to be a dick, but that's the way it is.
Alternating which lift comes before the others each week is a good way to spread some progress around.
I've only been doing leg work seriously for like 5 or 6 months. other then that I was justr doing a few half assed sets of leg press once a week. I have another thread running about a new routine. If yoyu have advice put it there.