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Ditch The Pressdowns?

http://www.T-Nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1140386

Well, uhh if you look at the above picture. I’d adventure to say don’t ditch the pressdowns [pushdowns]. Don’t get me wrong, you should do dips, but pressdowns work for some people. Dave Tate highly recommends them for the tricep bencher.

I love pressdowns, especially with the rope. I don’t find that dips and close grip bench hits my triceps like pressdowns do. Those other compound movements nail my pecs harder than my delts and triceps.

[quote]BIGRAGOO wrote:
I love pressdowns, especially with the rope. I don’t find that dips and close grip bench hits my triceps like pressdowns do. Those other compound movements nail my pecs harder than my delts and triceps.[/quote]

I do them all. I want to put at least another inch on my triceps and the only thing that will do that is a combination of pressdowns, dips and even kickbacks. The only exercises I don’t do are overhead triceps extensions and lying french curls. both of those movements hurt my elbows for some reason.

It is nice to see that the aversion to isolation movements is finally dying down.

i like the v-bar pressdown myself, and i’ll never ditch em’

[quote]Professor X wrote:
BIGRAGOO wrote:
I love pressdowns, especially with the rope. I don’t find that dips and close grip bench hits my triceps like pressdowns do. Those other compound movements nail my pecs harder than my delts and triceps.

I do them all. I want to put at least another inch on my triceps and the only thing that will do that is a combination of pressdowns, dips and even kickbacks. The only exercises I don’t do are overhead triceps extensions and lying french curls. both of those movements hurt my elbows for some reason.

It is nice to see that the aversion to isolation movements is finally dying down.[/quote]

Over head extensions and skull crushers hurt my elbows too. I think it stems from heavy benching though. Funny thing is, dips don’t hurt a bit.

I use them.

Good extra lift after I’m spent from my main compound lifts of the day.

[quote]mazilla wrote:
i like the v-bar pressdown myself, and i’ll never ditch em’[/quote]

Definitely a fav.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

It is nice to see that the aversion to isolation movements is finally dying down.[/quote]

Cosgrove is right…under reaction, then over reaction. Most guys who do pressdowns are guys that have no basic strength anyway, and it seems to me that they should be doing the compound exercises.

Then, of course, the guys who should be doing pressdowns get scared away by all the hype about “compound workouts”.

You’d think that people would eventually just try it for themselves and see if it works for them, but I guess not.

I, of course, like pressdowns, but heavy benching has produced more results in the tricep area for me.

I love pressdowns done correctly too. You can really load them heavy without the pressure on the elbow joint assosciated with overhead and flat extensions.

Lying french presses do suck, they seem to fuck with everyone’s elbows. Pressdowns aren’t exactly the msot efficient thing in the world but like prof said sometimes you need to hit the muscle from a bunch of different angles.

over-head rope extensions really burn the inner tricep. i love em

I love the ‘pressdowns’, especially with the rope and a very deep and wide extension at the bottom. I will keep doing these.

I like the tricep workout that I got from dips, but I cant do dips at the moment as everytime I do the long head tendon of my left bicep jumps out of its little groove (yes that is the technical term) and puts me in pain for a while. I will stick to pressdowns and close grip bench. Seems to be working at the moment.

[quote]jdrannin1 wrote:
over-head rope extensions really burn the inner tricep. i love em [/quote]

I like overhead extensions on a cable machine as well, but remember the price you pay for doing an isolation exercise on a machine is a trip straight to hell, so be careful!

good thread, it was a dumb ‘tip’ for sure. tricep pressdowns can be extremely valuable when properly implemented into a program and performed correctly. i love them, myself, but i feel like i never get much of a chance to do them… i spend so much time in the gym with other movements doing tons of sets i can’t seem to make time for another 15 minutes with a movement like tricep pressdowns.

but there are definitely all kinds of variations of cable pressdown movements which rock.

you gotta find what works for you. i hate pressdowns. as mentioned, perhaps implied in the tip was that pressdowns are about the third most popular movement in big commercial gyms behind only the bench press and curls.

anyhoo, i prefer regular ol’ dips, db tri extensions, the gasp hammer dip machine, and chile con queso dip … for me these activate the [governator accent] tlri-cips [/governator accent] without bothering my shoulders or elbows

I just do them last, after having exhausted the compound movements. Yes, including that evil drop-set that I do at the end.

Kind of like Jell-o, there’s always room for an isolation finisher. Bring the pain.

Everything can have a role someplace in a program.

Granted, 700lb 4 board presses will generally do “more” for your tricep strength, I believe that pushdowns can have their place as well. Louie reccommends band pushdowns for high reps to build work capacity and for recovery. In the “Road to the Arnold” DVD, I see Ryan Kennely doing pushdowns after his 990lb board presses.

If a person HAS TO ditch an exercise, it’d probably be better to ditch pushdowns than a compound movement. But, if the person is dedicated to improving their strength and physique and they won’t get lazy and skip the basics, the small stuff can help.

-MAtt

[quote]Matgic wrote:
Everything can have a role someplace in a program.

Granted, 700lb 4 board presses will generally do “more” for your tricep strength, I believe that pushdowns can have their place as well. Louie reccommends band pushdowns for high reps to build work capacity and for recovery. In the “Road to the Arnold” DVD, I see Ryan Kennely doing pushdowns after his 990lb board presses.

If a person HAS TO ditch an exercise, it’d probably be better to ditch pushdowns than a compound movement. But, if the person is dedicated to improving their strength and physique and they won’t get lazy and skip the basics, the small stuff can help.

-MAtt[/quote]

So, why are so many trainers suddenly so against isolation movements? Could be as simple as finding “something” to be against that was originally a basic foundation in bodybuilding so that newbies would turn away from the many years of knowledge gained there and only look to those trainers for further assistance?

Could this be about book sales and new clients? Naw.

I think everyone is against isolation movements lately because people tend to ditch the effective (re: HARD) exercises for them. Leg extensions and ham curls will never be as good for leg development as squatting and RDLs.

Now, if you’re already squatting and doing RDLs, then extensions and curls can help supplement that. But in most gyms, you don’t see a lot of people doing the “money” exercises. But, man, do they love their isolation (re: EASIER) exercises. (Aside: I never see the guys doing curls in the squat rack even get half the arm size of the guys that deadlift and never curl- GET OUT OF THE SQUAT RACK, CAPT’N BICEPS!) This doesn’t even take into account athletes whose recovery abilities are already stressed to the max.

Isolation can have its place (rehab/prehab especially), if the compound movements are already there (I, for one, LOVE pressdowns). But I think the above is why people are against so called “isolation” movements lately.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Matgic wrote:
Everything can have a role someplace in a program.

Granted, 700lb 4 board presses will generally do “more” for your tricep strength, I believe that pushdowns can have their place as well. Louie reccommends band pushdowns for high reps to build work capacity and for recovery. In the “Road to the Arnold” DVD, I see Ryan Kennely doing pushdowns after his 990lb board presses.

If a person HAS TO ditch an exercise, it’d probably be better to ditch pushdowns than a compound movement. But, if the person is dedicated to improving their strength and physique and they won’t get lazy and skip the basics, the small stuff can help.

-MAtt

So, why are so many trainers suddenly so against isolation movements? Could be as simple as finding “something” to be against that was originally a basic foundation in bodybuilding so that newbies would turn away from the many years of knowledge gained there and only look to those trainers for further assistance?

Could this be about book sales and new clients? Naw.[/quote]

Just wait until someone says eating is bad.

I’m counting the days!