T Nation

Disagreeing With The Flow

Not long ago a member “miniross” (I believe) was attacked and called a “troll” for posting negative comments about tattoos, on a tattoo thread. I wonder in retrospect was he attacked because the majority on the thread liked tattoos, and it is a gross violation of forum etiquette to disagree with the flow of general consensus on any given thread?

Furthermore, do you feel that it’s appropriate to comment negatively regarding the topic of a thread, if it goes against the general consensus on that thread?

The general subject matter is unimportant. The topic happened to be tattoos. The topic could have been anything from safe sex to how much someone loves his Jeep.

Thank you in advance for your opinions!

If I recall, he was attacked more for the way he disagreed with tattoos on women, not on his opinion. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with posting a differing opinion on a thread, it happens all the time on here. But I think if you are mean-spirited, or overly aggressive in your approach, you have to be prepared to get lambasted by others. Just like at a cocktail party. If you walk up and call a women a crack-whore because she has a tattoo showing, you should expect that her husband, right next to her, will crack you across the nose, which is my recollection of what went down on the tattoo thread.

DB

I don’t think you should be posting about people posting against what other people are posting. So, whatever you said, I say the opposite.

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Not long ago a member “miniross” (I believe) was attacked and called a “troll” for posting negative comments about tattoos, on a tattoo thread. I wonder in retrospect was he attacked because the majority on the thread liked tattoos, and it is a gross violation of forum etiquette to disagree with the flow of general consensus on any given thread?

Furthermore, do you feel that it’s appropriate to comment negatively regarding the topic of a thread, if it goes against the general consensus on that thread?

The general subject matter is unimportant. The topic happened to be tattoos. The topic could have been anything from safe sex to how much someone loves his Jeep.

Thank you in advance for your opinions![/quote]

Hmm. A little food for thought on a slow afternoon - I like it. On your 2nd question, I don’t think there is any problem with negative comments on a thread if it goes against the flow/grain of that thread. Lord knows that we really don’t need consensus just for the sake of consensus here. I think that is the acceptable use of your right to voice your opinion here.

Where I would take a lot more issue is with what is described on your first question. I think miniross even said he was just doing it to bust chops, but why go onto a thread about a topic strictly for the purpose of denigrating the entire topic itself? What possible constructive reason could there be for that? You’r really just jumping in and basically diverting the entire course of the discussion. Now, I know that may sound like doubletalk given what I said about commenting that goes against the general flow (I am a lawyer after all. lol), but I think there is an important difference. If you disagree with someone else and are commenting to express that opinion on an open topic, good stuff. Debate is healthy.

But if your only comment when people are talking about tattoos or Ford Mustangs or molecular biology is to pop on and tell everyone how “gay” or stupid it is, what the hell is the point? I think the dividing line (at least to me) is whether you are actually adding to the discussion vs. openly insulting the people enjoying that tread for even finding interest in that topic. It’s like the people who get a rise out of the powerlifters by flaming them and their sport in the strength/powerlifting forums. Pointless and only meant to ruin someone’s day.

Kuz

  • Return with honor.

I happened to post to the “tattoo” thread as well.

Someone asked how having a good body and showing it off was different than having tattoos and being proud of them. I questioned people being proud of their tats when I think getting a tattoo is something anyone can do. Needless to say my thoughts weren’t appreciated.

I was not attacked like “miniross”, but others on the thread had a valid point in that it was a thread for people who liked ink. I realized my comments did not belong there.

I felt compelled to defend my point, but why? It was not the place to do so.

So unless someone is asking for OPINIONS, I think a person should not post a contrary viewpoint. If a thread is for people who love Jeeps, what purpose would it serve to say that “Jeep sucks”?
(I happen to own a Jeep, the “Jeep Sucks” was just an example)

I think he got flamed because the topic was “tattoos” and suggested that people post pics of theirs. No one was asking for the pros and cons of tattoos or even if he likes them. He even made some broad generalizations and derogatory remarks about people(especially females) with tattoos.

Not only this, but he also went on the jeep thread and called jeep owners “fruity”.

Maybe he was joking. I don’t know. It’s hard to tell with his…umm…mechanics and sentence structure. His posts are just hard to read sometimes.

To answer your question if it’s ok to go against the flow and disagree with a thread; yeah, most of the time. However in the case of the tattoo thred, I don’t think it was that type of thread. I think it was more of a “show and tell” type thread. I don’t think the posters on that thread were looking to argue reasons to have/not have a tattoo.

And even if he did want to state his dislike of tattoos, he could have done it more tactfully. He pretty much called Ericka chain-smoking, trailer trash. He deserved to get flamed.

It’s like this in any thread. If it is a discussion/debate style thread, then by all means, disagree. But if it is show and share type thread, then keep the disagreement to yourself. Or at least be very tactful about how you disagree.

It’s like me going on the “What Do You Drive?” thread and telling everybody all their cars are stupid, gasoline-powered transportation sucks, and you’re all pussies for not walking. Except for proteinpowda who showed us his bike, and that he cleaned his apartment.

Anyway, I hope you understand what I’m saying.

I disagree with you. I don’t think you should have started this flow. : )

I didn’t call him a troll, but I think that the purpose of the post (in the Photos forum) was to exhibit and appreciate tattoos. I think that everyone is entitled to their opinion, but a debate on the value or merit of bodyart should be a seperate thread.

just to interject, i wasnt doing it to bust chops, but i guess i got sucked in to a low level conflict, which was innappropriate for that thread.

this resulted in a bit of tit for tat and things taken out of posts that were in the context of that post, to which i responded.

the fact that it died says it all.

Re the jeep issue, it would have been valid for a poster in the uk (“alternative lifestyle” i think my comment was). please note that the issue was ironic due to this cultural difference, and not jeep owners per se. however, if that was the meaniing that was taken, that again was not the intention.

[quote]malonetd wrote:
I think he got flamed because the topic was “tattoos” and suggested that people post pics of theirs. No one was asking for the pros and cons of tattoos or even if he likes them. He even made some broad generalizations and derogatory remarks about people(especially females) with tattoos.

Not only this, but he also went on the jeep thread and called jeep owners “fruity”.

Maybe he was joking. I don’t know. It’s hard to tell with his…umm…mechanics and sentence structure. His posts are just hard to read sometimes.

To answer your question if it’s ok to go against the flow and disagree with a thread; yeah, most of the time. However in the case of the tattoo thred, I don’t think it was that type of thread. I think it was more of a “show and tell” type thread. I don’t think the posters on that thread were looking to argue reasons to have/not have a tattoo.

And even if he did want to state his dislike of tattoos, he could have done it more tactfully. He pretty much called Ericka chain-smoking, trailer trash. He deserved to get flamed.

It’s like this in any thread. If it is a discussion/debate style thread, then by all means, disagree. But if it is show and share type thread, then keep the disagreement to yourself. Or at least be very tactful about how you disagree.

It’s like me going on the “What Do You Drive?” thread and telling everybody all their cars are stupid, gasoline-powered transportation sucks, and you’re all pussies for not walking. Except for proteinpowda who showed us his bike, and that he cleaned his apartment.

Anyway, I hope you understand what I’m saying. [/quote]

That probably sums it up.

for the record, i was not aiming the “CH” comment at specific members of the forum, it was a hell of a ill judged sweeping statement, but not personal.

[quote]malonetd wrote:
I think he got flamed because the topic was “tattoos” and suggested that people post pics of theirs. No one was asking for the pros and cons of tattoos or even if he likes them. He even made some broad generalizations and derogatory remarks about people(especially females) with tattoos.

Not only this, but he also went on the jeep thread and called jeep owners “fruity”.

Maybe he was joking. I don’t know. It’s hard to tell with his…umm…mechanics and sentence structure. His posts are just hard to read sometimes.

[/quote]

He is from England. They drive on “the other side”…

vaughn5000
Nicely said!

People had a problem with both his opinions and the way he expressed them. He felt that tattoos were an ostentatious display of this or that, but did not realize he was doing the exact same thing by repeatedly posting his negative and (self-described) narrow-minded views. He displayed hypocrisy and a beligerent ignorance, both of which are frowned upon by the members of this site and humanity in general.

From what I’m reading, so far, it seems that posting a diametrically opposing view is fine if, it is done appropriately. It must also be done on a thread that was created for opposite opinions.

For (a silly) example:

If someone begins a thread entitled “I love teachers” in order for everyone to give reasons why they love teachers, would it then be unacceptable for someone to post why they hated teachers?

I am really curious what the general consensus on “bad form.”

Hmm, I was posting before but somehow lost my place. Let’s see if I can remember what I was saying.

I think it comes down to two issues:

  1. Respect for the thread and posters.
  2. Understanding of when you have something to say.

When a thread is in one of the softer topics, like “off topic” or “politics”, I don’t think it matters so much. People can and do jump in on all kinds of tangents.

However, whether or not a thread is in a soft topic, I think many people talk when they don’t have anything to say. They just want to jump in and state their opinion, like the world needs to hear everyone elses negative opinions.

Now, I’m not talking about particular situation or a particular poster, but just in general. I also won’t say I’m not guilty of both transgressions.

So, to agree with others, I think it is okay to disagree with the flow, but you can certainly do it in a respectful and thought out manner. Of course, we have a lot of comedians around here… so that makes it harder to tell whats really going on at times.

Being that I am probably one of the best posters that I know of - I feel it is my duty to enlighten some of you on on what is proper ‘thread etiquette’.

  1. Never cuss

  2. Always start off with a witty quip.

  3. Never resort to name calling.

  4. If you drive a yellow mini-cooper, and are British - learn how to freakin’ spell!!! I can’t understand you about 68% of the time.

  5. If the subject is a support thread (I like teachers, I like Justin Timberlake, etc.) you’re not going to make any friends by setting off a cherry bomb in the toilet so to speak.

  6. Finally, when short on time, just tell ProfessorX he is right.

[quote]rainjack wrote:
6. Finally, when short on time, just tell ProfessorX he is right.[/quote]

Professor X already knew you were going to say that.

wtf???

[quote]rainjack wrote:

  1. Never cuss

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Not long ago a member “miniross” (I believe) was attacked and called a “troll” for posting negative comments about tattoos, on a tattoo thread. I wonder in retrospect was he attacked because the majority on the thread liked tattoos, and it is a gross violation of forum etiquette to disagree with the flow of general consensus on any given thread?

Furthermore, do you feel that it’s appropriate to comment negatively regarding the topic of a thread, if it goes against the general consensus on that thread?

The general subject matter is unimportant. The topic happened to be tattoos. The topic could have been anything from safe sex to how much someone loves his Jeep.

Thank you in advance for your opinions![/quote]

On the other side of this, I was attacked for labeling someone a “troll” prematurely. I did not do it to antagonise for fun but it was in reference to the limited info/stat the poster was supplying. The poster took it all with a sense of humor and it actually turned out to be a really informative thread after the initial hurdle and worthless attacks on my abruptness.
It depends on your personal interpretation and sensitivities, and what is a negative comment and what is not.
I don’t believe everyone agreeing with each other is necessarily going to make a good thread, help people progress, and ultimately make people more knowledgeable in the iron game.
If this is being negative then being negative is appropriate, as long as it progresses the poster’s questions and knowledge.

[quote]rainjack wrote:
Being that I am probably one of the best posters that I know of - I feel it is my duty to enlighten some of you on on what is proper ‘thread etiquette’.

  1. Never cuss

  2. Always start off with a witty quip.

  3. Never resort to name calling.

  4. If you drive a yellow mini-cooper, and are British - learn how to freakin’ spell!!! I can’t understand you about 68% of the time.

  5. If the subject is a support thread (I like teachers, I like Justin Timberlake, etc.) you’re not going to make any friends by setting off a cherry bomb in the toilet so to speak.

  6. Finally, when short on time, just tell ProfessorX he is right.[/quote]

Good advice all…just one issue–#6. You don’t need to tell ProfX he’s correct, he’ll do that for you. It saves time.