T Nation

Dirty Bulking to 230


#1

Hi everybody,

I started weight training 2months ago. I am 24, 205 pounds. 6feet.

After 1.5 months of doing bullshit stronglifts 5x5 I have decided to go for 1RMs and get a decent program afterwards. Bench is 190. Squat is 265. deadlift is 325. Overhead press is 135x3. 6 strict BW pull ups.

I want to do a dirty bulk up to 225-230 pounds. Then give the fat up and come back to 205-210. Does that sound reasonable or I am going the wrong way?

I also have strength goals, 300 bench. 400 squat and deadlift.

Enough with the introductions. Here is the main question,

How does twice a week per muscle sound for a 24year-old rookie? I am thinking of 2push 2pull 2 leg days. 1 for max effort (1-3 reps) and 1 for high reps (6-8)?


#2

Dirty bulk up to 230 and come down to your current weight? Did I read that correctly? The purpose of bulking is to consume calories over requirement in order to build muscle mass, hopefully, at a quicker rate. Fat gain is inevitable.


#3

He could be 20lb of fat right now?
He didn’t say…

I wouldn’t want to put on that much fat in so little time. If you are going to be dirty bulking, that’s your choice, just limit the acceleration of your caloric gain.
Slowly raise the calories, or, just as you admitted, you will get 25lb of fat for your 5lb of muscle.

But really…

I call a troll. lewl!


#4

What’s your BF% roughly now?

ugh…

1 rep maxes? Dirty bulk when you obviously have fat on your body already? Bullshit 5x5?

I don’t even know where to start here…


#5

What is the point of dirty bulking exactly? Because you don’t have the discipline to avoid shitty foods?

I’ve gone from 145lbs to 180lbs in 2 months on nothing but healthy foods so far. I couldn’t imagine the need to eat crap.

Unless you like being fat, go ahead.


#6

The idea of bulking with the specific AIM to gain significant amounts of fat along with muscle seems a bit retarded to me, unless you just signed a contract to do an ad in MD.


#7

You’re pretty weak for your weight, I imagine you’re not the leanest as is.

You oughta work on getting stronger and getting some GOOD eating habits down (like protein with every meal).


#8

With your current weight, height and lifts you listed…you don’t seem strong enough which means you probably have a lot of fat already.

If you ‘dirty bulk’ up to 230 with an already high bf% you have a better chance of gaining more fat.

I suggest you diet down to a reasonable bf% and slowly build your way back up. Unless you want more fat…in that case do it up!


#9

[quote]Ghost22 wrote:
You’re pretty weak for your weight, I imagine you’re not the leanest as is.

You oughta work on getting stronger and getting some GOOD eating habits down (like protein with every meal). [/quote]

HAHA

well put my friend.

“great minds think alike”


#10

[quote]mtuncer wrote:
Hi everybody,

I started weight training 2months ago. I am 24, 205 pounds. 6feet.

After 1.5 months of doing bullshit stronglifts 5x5 I have decided to go for 1RMs and get a decent program afterwards. Bench is 190. Squat is 265. deadlift is 325. Overhead press is 135x3. 6 strict BW pull ups.

I want to do a dirty bulk up to 225-230 pounds. Then give the fat up and come back to 205-210. Does that sound reasonable or I am going the wrong way?

I also have strength goals, 300 bench. 400 squat and deadlift.

Enough with the introductions. Here is the main question,

How does twice a week per muscle sound for a 24year-old rookie? I am thinking of 2push 2pull 2 leg days. 1 for max effort (1-3 reps) and 1 for high reps (6-8)?[/quote]

No.


#11

[quote]Growing_Boy wrote:
Dirty bulk up to 230 and come down to your current weight? Did I read that correctly? The purpose of bulking is to consume calories over requirement in order to build muscle mass, hopefully, at a quicker rate. Fat gain is inevitable. [/quote]

Ok. I should have given more detail, I carry a good amount fat. 39" waist should explain that. My BF was measured 17% a few weeks ago but I don’t know how accurate it is.

If I decide to cut now I must go down to 180-185 I guess. So going up to 225 and then cutting means gaining 15-20 pounds of lean mass and finally a low(er) fat 205.
I am also aware that this is not possible in a short time, 1.5 years? maybe two? if I train my ass off.


#12

[quote]forevernade wrote:
He could be 20lb of fat right now?
He didn’t say…

I wouldn’t want to put on that much fat in so little time. If you are going to be dirty bulking, that’s your choice, just limit the acceleration of your caloric gain.
Slowly raise the calories, or, just as you admitted, you will get 25lb of fat for your 5lb of muscle.

But really…

I call a troll. lewl![/quote]

What little time? Did you read anything about time? I am not talking about 5 mcdonalds meals but clean bulk with 4-5k cals seems really optimistic and far from real to me.

I expected the troll comment. Some of you call everybody who posts troll.


#13

[quote]tw0scoops2 wrote:
What’s your BF% roughly now?

ugh…

1 rep maxes? Dirty bulk when you obviously have fat on your body already? Bullshit 5x5?

I don’t even know where to start here…[/quote]

These are 1RM. Of course 5x5 is not bullshit I really like 5x5, but I think stronglifts is.


#14

You lost me at “bullshit stronglifts.”

If it is bullshit then chances are you are doing it wrong.

I am with the get stronger group. You need a much better base of strength before you “bulk” anything.


#15

[quote]Goodfellow wrote:
What is the point of dirty bulking exactly? Because you don’t have the discipline to avoid shitty foods?

I’ve gone from 145lbs to 180lbs in 2 months on nothing but healthy foods so far. I couldn’t imagine the need to eat crap.

Unless you like being fat, go ahead.[/quote]

That is a good point I really don’t have the discipline to eat clean.

Wow you ARE hardcore and disciplined, 35 lean pounds in 2 months. I can’t even imagine that.


#16

Hi everybody,

I started weight training 2months ago. I am 24, 205 pounds. 6feet.

After 1.5 months of doing bullshit stronglifts 5x5 I have decided to go for 1RMs and get a decent program afterwards. Bench is 190. Squat is 265. deadlift is 325. Overhead press is 135x3. 6 strict BW pull ups.

I want to do a dirty bulk up to 225-230 pounds. Then give the fat up and come back to 205-210. Does that sound reasonable or I am going the wrong way?

I also have strength goals, 300 bench. 400 squat and deadlift.

Enough with the introductions. Here is the main question,

How does twice a week per muscle sound for a 24year-old rookie? I am thinking of 2push 2pull 2 leg days. 1 for max effort (1-3 reps) and 1 for high reps (6-8)?

WOW. You are really going for the post count aren’t you?


#17

[quote]RWElder0 wrote:
You lost me at “bullshit stronglifts.”

If it is bullshit then chances are you are doing it wrong.

I am with the get stronger group. You need a much better base of strength before you “bulk” anything.[/quote]

I agree I am weak and I agree on “get stronger” type of training. But I also think that I should add as much lean mass as possible when I can, while I am a rookie and while I am young.

It is not related to the topic but do you really think it is a good idea to squat heavy 3 times a week? As a person who did not lift shit before stronglifts helped me to learn the lifts but it is nothing more.


#18

I was in the same exact boat as you in July 08. But a little fatter. 6’ 210 lbs around 20%bf , 205 bench press. By Oct 08 I was 190 lbs less than 15% bf and benching around 250. I looked much better, but wish I hadn’t lost the weight so fast. I’m currently 210 trying get to 230 and my 1RM max on bench is 290.

My point, if I could go back to July 08 I’d try and stabilize my weight by eating clean and lifting heavy. Don’t try to bulk if you’re already fat. And I really don’t see the point in trying to diet down to 185 before trying to bulk. This is what I did and I think I would be been in a better place now if I did what I just described.


#19

I guess that I did not expres myself well. I should rephrase my questions.

There are two questions here.

First is, I carry a good amount of fat but is it a good idea to waste my newbie time on cutting?

Second is, how does 6 days, twice per muscle a week, push/pull/leg split and 1 heavy day 1 high(er) rep day sound?


#20

[quote]sam_sneed wrote:
I was in the same exact boat as you in July 08. But a little fatter. 6’ 210 lbs around 20%bf , 205 bench press. By Oct 08 I was 190 lbs less than 15% bf and benching around 250. I looked much better, but wish I hadn’t lost the weight so fast. I’m currently 210 trying get to 230 and my 1RM max on bench is 290.

My point, if I could go back to July 08 I’d try and stabilize my weight by eating clean and lifting heavy. Don’t try to bulk if you’re already fat. And I really don’t see the point in trying to diet down to 185 before trying to bulk. This is what I did and I think I would be been in a better place now if I did what I just described.
[/quote]

Finally a useful answer. Thanks man.
So you suggest maintaining weight? What was your training like?