T Nation

Dianabol First Cycle

I am looking into steroid use and have been tempted for some time. I’m thinking of starting with dianabol at a low dose, say 10-20mgs a day no more. Just to get a feel for it a little more than natural results. I would really like to know your opinions. Have trained for seven years and am now nearly 24. Have only over the past year seen big improvements going from 11 stone to 14. However have not really been in excellent shape since i was around 20. I’m seeing strength gains workout to workout and do not want to see this mucked up by messing up my natural hormone levels. But at a low dose dianabol shouldn’t shut me down too bad. Any experiences before and after steroid use. I don’t want to end up weaker than i could be naturally. Gyno worries me but again this is usually dose related right. Just want to expand my knowledge and see others experiences, particuarly with dianabol

To be honest…that could still shut you down taking it daily at 20mg…besides the fact that you really wouldnt see tremendous results…its not worth compromising your natural T levels. Seriously i use to think like this…but now…i honestly think you are better off either staying natural completely…or deciding to roid but doing it right and going all out. You either can accept the risks and side effects and do it for real…or just forget about it…If you really do wanna roid…very simple

Week 1-12 - Test 500mg/week

And have a good PCT in order.

if you are making gains on a consistent basis…wait until they stall out…and after you have made several failed attempts to break the plateau (with hard training and proper nutrition/rest)…then and only then consider AAS.

first cycles should generally be test based, or test only.

D-bol only for a first (or any time) is not ideal, and will get flamed by most on the board…but IMO it is not all that bad an option. forget the 10-20 mg bullshit dose. 50 mg ED with low dose arimidex throughout the cycle. 4-6 week duration. with dialed in nutrition and hard training you could make very good gains…and recovery should be a breeze.

I tried this almost exactly and it shut me down in 3 weeks. Not crazy shut down but enough to warrent a light PCT. I took 20mg ED in the AM only in 2 divided doses because I had read that that would have the least effect on your natural T-levels. Total crap. My levels where strait again in a few weeks after a simple clomid PCT, but it wasn’t worth it as in risk vs reward. I got next to nothing from it. The health risks of a light oral cycle is about the same as a light Test Enanthate cycle at about 500mg/wk. The injectables will give you more solid gains, less sides, no liver issues and you only need to inject 1-2x per week. I know the thought of injecting yourself is kinda fuct up but if your gonna juice, do it right or just stay natural.

Didn’t the bodybuilders mainly use dianabol for years with success. I’m refering to those of the schwarzenegger era and they looked amazing

They did but not at 20mg/day. Try 3-5x that. As far as I know most hit Deca with it. I know guys who have used a D-bol only cycle to some success but they where using 50-100mg/day.

[quote]gettinbigger wrote:
They did but not at 20mg/day. Try 3-5x that. As far as I know most hit Deca with it. I know guys who have used a D-bol only cycle to some success but they where using 50-100mg/day. [/quote]

So then how did Arnold, Franco, and other legends like Bill Pearl not get gyno and the side effects you commonly see today?
Since I don’t believe they had any PCT or anti-e. Correct me if I’m wrong.

1st off, not everyone needs to take something to prevent gyno. I do, but one of my 1st training parters who is currently ranked in the top 10 at the 198lb class for powerlifting takes 50mg of Dbol a day along with test and has NEVER taken an anti-estrogen or done a proper PCT. He didn’t even know what A-dex or Nolva was.

Thats not to say that this is the norm but neither are bodybuilders like Franco and Arnie. You have to take that into account as well. I saw pics of Arnie when he was 16, he had a better physique than most guys who’ve trained for 5-6 years. But I don’t think for one second that Arnie’s BS story about just taking 15mg of DBol a day is true.

So were looking at say 50mgs a day. I have thought about test and it seems quite simple. But i’d like to start slowly and build up to higher levels of steroids later in my training career. Also money might be an issue as i’m not loaded. Can even try m1t as its still legal over here but by all accounts the sides are too severe. But its powerful and cheap as shit.

I’d rather go with the tried and tested. Could anyone report gains (weight and strength) of of dianabol and even test?
My aims are to get really strong, with appreciable size to go with it. Also tren attracts me for strength gains.

How about a dianabol, test, tren stack? All opinions welcome. I’m just getting started so i’m pretty much a novice. Done research but mostly from bodybuiling.com - ha i’m sure you guys will love that. Now big boys what do you take/suggest?

My 1st proper cycle (after the Dbol crap I mentioned) was 500mg/wk Test Enanthate with 50mg Proviron ED. I train for powerlifting so I didn’t gain a crap load of muscle mass but I gained 10 lbs, and actually got abs in the process some how.

I went from 215 lbs@15.5% to 225 lbs@12% (before I cut water to make weight) during this 12 week cycle. I didn’t follow any sort of diet, just ate healthy with lots of protein (1.5 grams/lb).

I didn’t eat too much because I was only 5 lbs under my weight class and I’m not a fan of dropping 15lbs before a meet. I’m sure if I ate more and trained for hypertrophy I would have gained 20lbs muscle easy.

My squat went from 225kg (gym) to 275kg (Competition), my bench from 185kg to 220kg (Competition) and my DL from 210kg to 245kg (Comp.). But keep in mind that I was peaking for a powerlifting meet using the westside method which was all about strength.

Most importantly when I got off I used a very simple PCT (clomid) for 4 weeks. I lost about 5 lbs and put on some fat. I think 8 weeks post cycle I was 220 lbs @13.5%.

Its hard to say how much I kept strength wise. My strength levels vary so much from my peak to my off season, but the next meet I hit 3 more PR’s so I’m sure I kept most of it.

As for sides, I didn’t notice any. I had no acne, no hair loss, not even any bloat (thanks to the Proviron), etc. I did get more agressive, but not to the point where I was going nuts. I used some Nizoral (sp?) shampoo because I was worried about losing my hair. I guess it worked.

First, you wouldn’t want to start at 50mg/day of dbol without trying out the smaller doses on your body and seeing how you react.

Secondly, I thik tren/test/dbol is like bringing Michael Jordan to a little kids basketball game to play. Your first cycle should be Test Enanthate 500mg/week for 10 - 12 weeks. If you’re dead set on using the dbol you should run it at 20 - 25mgs/day for the first four weeks. I would stay away from the tren for a while. Tren is much more anabolic and more androgenic than test. If you haven’t even used test before it is definitely not time for tren. Leave the tren sidelined until you see how you gain, how you react, and how the side effects of test work for you.

Don’t even touch the M1T. Its terrible for you, the gains are not really permanent and the sides are worse than test will ever be.

Hope this helps.

[quote]big balls wrote:
So were looking at say 50mgs a day. I have thought about test and it seems quite simple. But i’d like to start slowly and build up to higher levels of steroids later in my training career. Also money might be an issue as i’m not loaded. Can even try m1t as its still legal over here but by all accounts the sides are too severe. But its powerful and cheap as shit.

I’d rather go with the tried and tested. Could anyone report gains (weight and strength) of of dianabol and even test?
My aims are to get really strong, with appreciable size to go with it. Also tren attracts me for strength gains.

How about a dianabol, test, tren stack? All opinions welcome. I’m just getting started so i’m pretty much a novice. Done research but mostly from bodybuiling.com - ha i’m sure you guys will love that. Now big boys what do you take/suggest?[/quote]

as has been mentioned, test/ tren/ d-bol is way over the top for a first. a seriously powerful and synergistic stack.

test only is still the best option.

but, if you do choose the d-bol only…15-20 mgs ED is so far from ideal…considering the amount of non-responders to a such a low dose will most likely be pretty high. don’t get me wrong, you can do well on that dosage, when stacked with other AAS, and taking advantage of synergy, cumulative effect etc…but as a STAND ALONE, you need to provide enough punch to make it worthwhile. 50 mg ED with low dose a-dex. relatively safe and effective.

All decent advice. My opinion would be a test only or test and dbol cycle for the first time, deca or eq optional but really not that necessary to stack 3 drugs in your first cycle (although I did and liked it).

BTW, I know that the guy who mentioned his buddy never using any ancillaries got along just fine. That shouldn’t go without saying that his lipid panels are likely to be fucked up and he’d shut down to a larger degree from not keeping his estrogen levels in check by using some sort of ai. BTW, I’ve never gotten a single sign of gyno and have used very minimal to no ai’s or serms while on fairly large doses of aas like test, d-bol, tren, ect.

It’s all individual in that aspect but I’m pretty damn sure that doesn’t mean that your estrogen levels arent’ sky high from the converstion going on due to the 500-1000mg of test you shot that week along with the dbol you’re eating every day.

How does weight figure into the dosing protocol? You say a min 50mg/day dose, but is that for a 220lb guy, or a guy who weighs 170?

What would be ideal doses for both those weights in a d-bol standalone?

Of course you can make good gains with a d-bol only cycle. That’s what 60’s bodybuilders did. They only used 10 mgs or so a day. That’s why they didn’t get gyno or other side effects. If it is your first time using steroids you can get good results on 10 to 20 mgs ed.

You don’t get water retention or other sides at that dose. You might not need any pct, no one in the 60’s ever used pct. But to be safe I would do a little clomid for a couple weeks. Despite what others say, you CAN keep your gains if you keep training hard and eating well after your cycle.

Let’s put it this way, 20 mgs of d-bol ED will do much much more for you than any legal supplement.

[quote]big balls wrote:
Didn’t the bodybuilders mainly use dianabol for years with success. I’m refering to those of the schwarzenegger era and they looked amazing[/quote]

yes they did, dianabol is great, I am taking it right now by itself at a low dose and it’s giving me good gains, and not fake water gains either.

So exactly why does one not want to win and win outstandingly?

First, what harm do you think a more substantive cycle would do compared to that, and second, if so concerned about being extremely safe – warning even against trying 50 mg of Dianabol per day without easing the foot into the water – why not be concerned about the fact that it is not unknown to have serious recovery problems after 12 week cycles, even with modest doses? And how about that it’s harder on the liver to go 12 weeks straight with any alkylated? This seems like contradictory advice. If wishing to be so cautious, it’s hard to see advocating more than 8 weeks straight, as likelihood of recovery problems increases with every week past that (and is not zero at 8 weeks, but pretty unlikely given Clomid for recovery, and moderately unlikely failing that.)

Why? What is the downside? (Something actually seen to be the case ever, not only worried about.)

what’s beeter for pct nolvadex or clomid

My very first cycle(which was seized, bad start) was 25 mg d-bol for 4 and a half weeks. I gained and maintained almost 9 lbs with minimal water retention. Absolutely zero shutdown post cycle. In my opinion dianabol makes a good first cycle by itself. I think 50 mg might be starting off a little strong though.

[quote]bmf123 wrote:
what’s beeter for pct nolvadex or clomid[/quote]

there are whole threads devoted to this topic.