DHEA-S Serum as a Predictor for Adrenal Insufficiency

There are a ton online, the truth is though you need someone who really understands it to assess.

But if your DHEA-S is low, and have you the symptoms of adrenal insufficiency, you probably have it, especially if you are on TRT because testosterone induces adrenal insufficiency.

Also when rectifying this problem, you will probably feel worse before you feel better.

I would also consider getting a 4 point salivary cortisol and a DHEA-S if you haven’t gotten it. But like I said, if you have been on TRT for any substantial amount of time without the proper dosage of HCG, there is good chance you’re gonna be low.

I found one with Dr. Wilson and it did say I may have moderate adrenal fatigue according to the answers I gave.

So adding HCG may cause me to feel worse for a little bit, is that what you are saying?

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I’m working with Dr Calkins as well. I just did a full Thyroid panel and that should be back in the next couple of days. Maybe a 4 point cortisol test may be in order as well. But yes, I’m also reconsidering HCG now.

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Well I don’t want to blame it on HCG but anytime you rectify adrenal issues.

With your newly enhanced adrenal functions you may notice that initially you feel a little worse after beginning your dietary supplement program designed for adrenal support. Some patients refer to this as cold or flu like symptoms, achiness or not feeling well overall. During the period of adrenal fatigue some of the physiological processes modulated by the adrenal gland can slow down and affect proper immune function, detoxification and elimination of waste. When your program immediately supports adrenal gland function, all of these processes pick up their pace, so the new spurt in detoxification and immune activity produce feelings of illness. This is actually a good sign that your program is working and should stop shortly after commencing your program.

So you will want to some type of adrenal supplement too in order to make sure the adrenals have the raw materials they need to make the hormones when stimulated, most of it is just called “raw adrenal concentrate”

I appreciate all the information brotha! I will pick up an adrenal support supplement as well. I feel like an old lady haha. I take probably 10 different supplements ranging from DHEA, Vit D, Multi, Tumeric, Magnesium Complex, Probiotic, fish oil, essential aminos, l-tyrosine. Its ridiculous haha!

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It seems you are suggesting hCG for everyone on testosterone?

I’m in the hCG for fertility or testicular atrophy camp. I’ve used hCG in the past and can’t say I noticed anything other than testicle enlargement. Some guys feel better with it, some worse. Some report they get leaner, some the opposite.

Interesting discussion.

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Yes I certainly am. I understand people feel differently but most of that can be chalked up to either being new and overreacting, or not having things dialed in, or simply not taking enough HCG. Anything less than 500 iu in a single shot is a waste of time and money in our opinion, IF you are on testosterone.

Typically people who take HCG report a feeling of well being and we believe this is because of the adrenal stimulation or the effect the adrenals have on the thyroid, but that part is just a guess.

So here is another curve ball, does testosterone also suppress the thyroid through HPA suppression? And if so, does HCG also help keep the thyroid in line while on testosterone?

The one thing great about what I am suggesting is you can confirm whether it works for you by testing before and after. You would not want to supplement DHEA during this.

Here is a quote from one of our physicians:

Thyroid hormones are closely related to adrenal fatigue and it is extremely important to rule out fatigue before looking into thyroid treatment due to a deficiency. The adrenals may be burnt out from trying to make up for the lack of thyroid hormones, through stress hormone production. Starting a thyroid medication program before ruling out fatigue can have serious negative health consequences.

And the last curve ball, since GHRP6 and GHRP2 stimulate cortisol, does it also stimulate the HPA? Is this why we have such great success adding GH augmentation to our HPTA restarts?

Not sure but it sure seems that way. Hope this helps.

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So dropped HCG from my protocol about 8 weeks ago. Since starting TRT my blood pressure elevated to the 130-5/ 90-5 range and I couldn’t figure out why. Changed dosage split dosage everything. Was starting to have conversations with my Dr about meds. I decided to drop the HCG as I was done having kids and wanted to test to see if I felt any different. Well after about two weeks my blood pressure started dropping and since dropping the HCG the highest reading I have gotten is 122/75. Absolutely nothing else changed. Is there anything I can do to prevent adrenal shutdown without taking hcg?

I don’t know I have never seen HCG effect someones blood pressure that much, I wonder if now that your a little more settled into your program that you wouldn’t have that issue?

Placebo is so strong, you could have worried yourself to death. It could also be correlated to the fact that you have now probably reached steady state with your exogenous T.

Weird for sure. I was on it for three years. Dropped my AI in Feb and dropped the hcg just to see if I felt any different. Actually feel a little better don’t always feel as “on” if that makes sense. I was shocked by the bp thing but at the same time relieved.

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So you dropped the AI at the same time? That makes a lot more sense to attribute it to that, if your E2 was low you would be a lot more sensitive to salt.

I wonder if the blood pressure would still go up without the AI? Also how do you measure you BP?

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No dropped the ai a couple months earlier because I wanted to see if I truly needed it. Didn’t want to change two things at once. I measure with a monitor at home but also check it if I’m at the pharmacy and it’s been consistent.

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Hmm strange, I would think if HCG was prone to increasing blood pressure we would see it, our doctors have been prescribing it for over a decade now, so that is why it is perplexing to me. In dosages upwards of 2,000 IU.

Also you would think if it was the HCG blood pressure would have normalized after 72 hours instead of 2 weeks, but maybe not.

Yes I agree. I was surprised. I like the added benefits but not at the cost of bp. I have an appt with a new Dr next week so I’m going to address it with him. Probably hop back on for a few weeks and monitor it.

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Its worth a try, but at the end of the day, nothing is set in stone and everyone should do what works.

Another thing to remember is things change over time, we had a guy on another board who is a great informative and educated poster, for 2 years he stopped HCG and debated us on the advantages and disadvantages. He finally tried it again and now he is a big proponent.

But as you suggested, whatever works best for someone is what they should stick with long term. At least you now have a exact protocol that you know you like so that if you do experiment a little you have the tried and true method to fall back on.

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Pre trt I did Clomid and actually did well on it with no sides. Went to trt as I felt it was a more natural long term solution. Would a low dose of that work the same or could that mess with the axis even more?

I have seen people do it, but logically I cannot make it make sense but thats because I do not think clomid is strong enough to override the suppression of the HPTA from testosterone, but I could be wrong. The reason I don’t know is because we do not tend to recommend it because it does give guys sides.

But you could test it the same, take 4 point cortisol and DHEA S before, then add the clomid then test again down the road.

Personally I would go for GH peptides before clomid, they probably do the same thing and maybe they wouldn’t have the same negative effect.

One thing about the peptides is that they do stimulate glucose a little, so some guys get worried that they are elevating this when taking the peptides. But even though it stimulates glucose, the average throughout the day is lower people were just checking it really close to the shot. So you are augmenting the pattern and not actually increasing glucose, just altering when it rises and falls, controlling it.

Make sure when you are measuring BP this same thing isn’t happening.

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This thread contains alot of speculation. Are you telling me all the men that are on testosterone only are in adrenal mess?

I don’t think so.

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You mean the studies I posted proving that LH was correlated with HPA health is speculation?

I’m not taking a side here at all, because there is much more research on my part to be done before I can draw a conclusion, but…

To be fair, the study you posted was done on post menopausal women, and the conclusions drawn were in the speculative sense, and not as an out and out proven conclusion.

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