T Nation

Defining Bodypart Too Big for BBing


#1

I'm well aware of the can of worms I'm opening, but I hope to keep it professional.

I read here all the time how bodybuilders do not want obliques and glutes too big. I know Vince gironda was huge on this.

For those that compete like Stu, what is generally "too big"? (photo examples of naturals if possible or general measurement I would be grateful for.)

I am not asking for homosexual reasons or anything of the sort, I am genuinely curious for educational reasons as I like reading about bodybuilding. Thank you in advanced.

Also for those that say 'Why should it matter, focus on your own work, ECT..)
I am doing greyskull and switched recently.


#2

Too big? Does not compute in my brain, sorry. Only thing i can think of is obliques. Yeah you want to be proportioned but making the smaller muscles bigger to match the already big will fix that.


#3

[quote]Darthzilla99 wrote:

I am not asking for homosexual reasons or anything of the sort,[/quote]

Who the fuck randomly throws this out there in their post?


#4

[quote]red04 wrote:

[quote]Darthzilla99 wrote:

I am not asking for homosexual reasons or anything of the sort,[/quote]

Who the fuck randomly throws this out there in their post?[/quote]

A closet homo


#5

[quote]red04 wrote:

[quote]Darthzilla99 wrote:

I am not asking for homosexual reasons or anything of the sort,[/quote]

Who the fuck randomly throws this out there in their post?[/quote]

Well, my post did ask about glutes so I did not want my topic to be misconstrued.

To give an example of what I am asking, lets take Eugene Sandow for example. Since he was a natural and known for his obliques, for those that compete, would he be an example of obliques too big for alot of judges?


#6

A smaller waist is more desirable than a bigger one, simple as that.


#7

In Gironda’s time, the winning physiques were based around having a significant V taper between the shoulders and the waist. He reckoned the easiest way to do that was to just keep the waist slim. If you look at pictures of Gironda, you’ll see that he was not a particularly big guy himself, but he was a master of creating certain lines in silhouette.

Also keep in mind that he spent a significant part of his career training actors to look in shape when on camera. He was heavily focused on creating the “illusion” of size, rather than actually creating size. You can’t really add much size to an actor in just a couple weeks, but you can make them appear bigger on camera. This was his specialty, and it’s important to understand what he says in that context.

Just a few decades after Gironda, bodybuilding put a lot more emphasis on actual size, not just shape. The person with the most muscle, and the best conditioning, wins. Shape still mattered, but a skinny guy with great lines (e.g., Gironda) would lose out to a larger more muscular guy (e.g., Ronnie Coleman), or without very good lines at all (e.g., Branch Warren).

In general, it’s a better approach to work on making your weak points larger, than to try and keep your strong points from getting “too big”.


#8

I don’t think that a bodypart can be “too big” when one of the goals of any serious trainer is to improve size, BUT, in relation to the other bodyparts, you will hear about throwing off one’s balance.

ie. Lets say you compete as a lightweight bodybuilder. The average scale weight will range from 150-160 lbs, and the height will usually be 5’4 - 5’7 (on average). Similarly, measurements such as shoulder width, waist size, even arm and calf size will fall within a certain range. If a competitor has all of their measurements at the top end of their class, BUT one are or bodypart is ridiculously even more developed, while it may not actually diminish their development over the other competitors, it most certainly will make their entire physique appear… awkward.

S


#9

Tom Platz never won a notable competition.
End of story.


#10

I think what you’re talking about may have been relevant to bodybuilding at one time, but is no longer relevant in today’s bodybuilding culture. Today, the freaks win, period. I remember reading about someone… maybe Steve Reeves (could be wrong) trying to minimize trap growth because he didn’t think large traps were aesthetically pleasing. That would never happen today.


#11

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
I think what you’re talking about may have been relevant to bodybuilding at one time, but is no longer relevant in today’s bodybuilding culture. Today, the freaks win, period. I remember reading about someone… maybe Steve Reeves (could be wrong) trying to minimize trap growth because he didn’t think large traps were aesthetically pleasing. That would never happen today.[/quote]

Right here at TNATION…


#12

Its more about muscular balance then having “too big” of certain body parts. If you have a body part that is lacking you just work more on it to match the rest.


#13

[quote]Darthzilla99 wrote:
I’m well aware of the can of worms I’m opening, but I hope to keep it professional.

I read here all the time how bodybuilders do not want obliques and glutes too big. I know Vince gironda was huge on this.

For those that compete like Stu, what is generally “too big”? (photo examples of naturals if possible or general measurement I would be grateful for.)

I am not asking for homosexual reasons or anything of the sort, I am genuinely curious for educational reasons as I like reading about bodybuilding. Thank you in advanced.

Also for those that say 'Why should it matter, focus on your own work, ECT…)
I am doing greyskull and switched recently.[/quote]

You can tailor Greyskull for weak or undersized bodyparts with “plugins”.

What Stu says here is how bodybuilding is judged, and if a man were to train his whole body seriously, but because of genetic inclinations, has some relatively under- or overdeveloped bodyparts, I don’t think it would be of much concern if one is not competing.

I am never going to have bulbous pecs, just never. However, I have a quad sweep and teardrop that even much bigger and stronger men have complimented. Despite this asymmetrical physique I don’t mind because when I do a physique show (god be willing I can finally pull this off late this year or early next year) I will do it knowing I will not be setting the physique world on fire and no one on the street or beach will even care.


#14

[quote]BrickHead wrote:
What Stu says here is how bodybuilding is judged, and if a man were to train his whole body seriously, but because of genetic inclinations, has some relatively under- or overdeveloped bodyparts, I don’t think it would be of much concern if one is not competing.

I am never going to have bulbous pecs, just never. However, I have a quad sweep and teardrop that even much bigger and stronger men have complimented. Despite this asymmetrical physique I don’t mind because when I do a physique show (god be willing I can finally pull this off late this year or early next year) I will do it knowing I will not be setting the physique world on fire and no one on the street or beach will even care. [/quote]

I always thought that was the real individual thing about this pursuit, that everyone has their own unique issues and obstacles to tackle and solve.

S


#15

Personally I like the older aesthetics over just pure freakishness, but if you’re going to compete you have to produce a body that’s going to match the judges expectations.


#16

Most people at the 81 Olympia thought Platz should have won.


#17

[quote]tuttle wrote:
Most people at the 81 Olympia thought Platz should have won.[/quote]

Not with a perfect Danny Padilla onstage.
Flawless.


#18

[quote]CLUNK wrote:

[quote]tuttle wrote:
Most people at the 81 Olympia thought Platz should have won.[/quote]

Not with a perfect Danny Padilla onstage.
Flawless.[/quote]

True dat. People forget what an amazing physique Padilla had:


#19

Every person I have heard comment who was there said Platz won. Padilla was very short and his conditioning was never right on the day of the competition.


#20

[quote]CLUNK wrote:

[quote]tuttle wrote:
Most people at the 81 Olympia thought Platz should have won.[/quote]
Not with a perfect Danny Padilla onstage.
Flawless.[/quote]
Not sure if he was flawless on that night, but I cannot see how Padilla ended up 5th and Platz 3rd. (Chris Dickerson 2nd and Roy Callender 4th, but not many pics of those guys from the show).

As far as “too big for bodybuilding”, I’ve always been of the unpopular opinion that Platz’s quads were “too big” for bodybuilding and Johnnie Jackson’s traps are “too big” for bodybuilding. They’re truly freakish bodyparts and awesome in their own right, but they do clearly distract from the overall look of the physique.