T Nation

Deca Durabolin and Finasteride


#1

Nandrolone Decanoate question: When absorbed by the body , it's broken to a weaker androgen called dihydronandrolone by the 5 alpha reductase type 1 or type 2 ? I'm actually using finasteride(5ar innibitor 1mg ED) and nizoral 2% for a period of 6 years for threatment of MPB and it works great but i want to try DECA with Test E but worried about what could happen if i still use finasteride along ?

I tough about using a topical finasteride with minoxidil or Avodart with Aloes on the scalp but wonder if it's still gonna get inside my blood stream and interfear with Deca ?

Did someone ever experience these products all together or
can anybody give some advice on this ?

Thanks for any help.


#2

you're fine using test/deca and finasteride...it blocks the conversion of both...DHN is actually a lot easier on the hairline than DHT (it binds but doesn't strongly activate the receptor) but either way your finasteride should stop the conversion to begin with.


#3

Yes it binds to the 5AR enzyme to convert into dihydronandrolone , so if i'm using a 5AR inhibitor it won't be able to bind and convert, at least some of it since 1mg doesn't eleminate all 5AR but maybe only half of it .Did you ever use all these products together furious george ?

Thanks for your answer:)


#4

I haven't used it, but i know that with Deca it is not recommended to use finasteride, as it can prevent the Nandrolone converting to its weaker androgen DHN, allowing stronger androgens to the area.. ie. DHT.

HOWEVER, how this plays out in a Deca/Test cycle i dont know for sure and i hope you get your answer, i would have thought that it could 1) be better to use it as it will stop the conversion of SOME DHN but also SOME DHT, or 2) It would be not prudent to use it as it will block the conversion of Deca to DHN, allowing more Test to the scalp.

However, on the second point, it would suggest there is some kind of priority it works by - and this is not the case.. it will treat both drugs equally, as it isnt the drug it affects, it is the enzyme 5-AR.

Surely SOME blocking would be better than none with the stack - it is when Deca is used alone, it should be avoided i would imagine.

This is just brainstorming on my part - dont take it as gospel.

Brook


#5

Thanks for your answer brook, i made research on the net and other forums + wiki and the way i see it is that i'm gonna have to replace Deca with EQ in order to continu my use of finasteride.

I also looked on hair loss forums and some poeple are brewing their own topical finasteride lotion with minoxidil and some other are using Avodart and aloes as a scal topical lotion, some say they've lost the bad side effects of oral finasteride using these solutions on their scalp.

The only problem is that none of them ever used Deca with these topical solutions also...I presume that Deca will run through my hole body including my scalp area so would probably do the same as orally but i'd have to get more info and studies on that...

This is gonna be my first cycle so maybe i should just keep it easy and go :dbol 30mg/day/4 weeks
:EQ 400mg/week/10 weeks
TestE 500mg/week/10 weeks
Then PCT 2 weeks after last injection
with Nolva for 4 weeks 40/40/20/20

What do you guys think?


#6

There is no problem with using Finasteride and Deca at the same time.

If you use test and deca without it you get the benifit that the DHN will bind to the receptors and give you some protection from the DHT conversion you get from the test but it isn't an issue if you block them both. You will still get a small amount of both but in that case the small amount of DHN will still help a bit to block the DHT.

I see no reason why switching from Deca to EQ would be any better.

If you are using EQ or Deca you should discontinue them a few weeks before discontinuing your teste because they have longer half lives and take longer to clear.


#7

That makes sense to me FG.

OP- You were going to swap the Deca for Eq (and based on my post i understand why you wanted to swap it out), but Eq will not have anything like the effects that Deca does on size, etc.

What FG said sounds right to me - unless DHN has a stronger affinity for the 5-AR enzyme (or vice-versa) but less activity at the AR than Testosterone/DHT.

FG - I have read on numerous occasions that finasteride should not be used to combat the androgenic effects of deca, as it is a weak androgen and its effects are not only minimal, but considerably less than the DHT that will be able to access the scalp if DHN is 'blocked'.
HOWEVER, when suppressed and using deca - where is this DHT supposed to come from if one was to block the activity of 5-AR? There is no exo test, nor any endo test...

THIS is the reason behind some of my thinking, it may be that when using deca and test with no finasteride.. they equally have activity at the AR - making it a less androgenic cycle than test alone.
And when they are stacked alongside finasteride - the Finasteride is 'used up' on preventing the conversion of the weaker androgen, allowing more of the stronger androgen to do its work..

What do you say? I have never used the (horrible) drug, and dont know it that well, but as with all the substances that 'we' use, it interests me. :slightly_smiling:

Brook


#8

Yes surely i will discontinu or lower the dose of EQ 2 weeks prior last injection of my test E but EQ is not suppressive like Deca or test so i don't think it will make a big difference since it's only a 12 week cycle,
HTPA functions should return to normal pretty easy with only Nolva.

FG: I understand what you mean but what will happen to the deca hormone % that won't be deactivated by the 5AR?
But i think everyone agrees that Deca always has to be used in conjunction with Test since it's very suppressive of natural Test , EQ on the other hand,has no interraction with the 5AR enzyme and is only suppressive if used in very larged dosage,so for now i'm gonna let all my Deca sit in the drawer,and get myself some EQ and see how this
cycle goes.Safest way for now until maybe i find more reseach on that.

Ric.


#9

Oh dear.

Eq IS suppressive lad. Sorry to break it to you... it is also a low androgen as is deca - but eq will have virtually zero effect in a dose below 300mg.. shit, it barely has an effect on anabolism at 600mg - with the effect being purely one of quality when shredded (<8%). The results, i'll repeat, between Deca and Equipoise are so far apart, they are simply not interchangable within a cycle if one expects the same results.

Eq is suppressive, and whether it is 300mg or 1000mg of eq ran alone (for arguments sake) you will have full suppression, requiring the use of a DHT based androgen such as Proviron, Masteron (for a lovely cutting cycle) or as is often recommended as the natural hormone - Testosterone.
The same reasons Test is recommended with Nandrolone. Which can also be ran comfortably with Proviron or Masteron... An argument i tire of repeating.

Your statement 'It's only a 12 week cycle' - what is that in comparison to? A 16 week cycle? Staying on?
12 weeks is a long arse cycle, and you are losing support in carrying it out with every post you make i fear..! lmao!

And lastly, i have read this:

5 times and each time it becomes less apparent what you mean.

Sincerely,

JJ


#10

Your right , Eq is suppressive but what i meant is that it's not as much suppresive as Deca , and no i don't expect the same results for sure!What i meant is that i'd rather have less results than losing all the hairs that still remain on my head if using Deca along Finasteride.

Also i mentionned 12 week cycle but it's actually gonna be
only 10 weeks , my mystake on this...


#11

Hi guys , i found these two links that provide a lot of informations on hair loss and steroids !!

1) http://www.hairloss-research.org/steroids.html

2) http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/style-fashion-grooming/hair-loss-24651.html

The second link is old but very very instructive for anyone with a hair loss concern.

Hope it can help someone !!

Cheers :slight_smile: