T Nation

DC Training Thread (Part 2)

[quote]RobbyRob wrote:
Whats doing all…Im new to the site andI need some help bad… I’ve been lifting for quite some time now and this is the first time I’ve read about DC training… And its blowing my mind. I am going to be starting Monday using the exact workout provided in the thread i read about DC here on the site…

My question is that i need help fully understading what RP, SS, and Widowmakers are… Now again Im not a newbie to the iron house but ive just never been introduced to these types…so i humble myself to my gym rat brothers and hope someone can help me out real quick… I appreciate it…[/quote]

the article that was put up here a while back that you mentioned covers all that???

sorry, not a DC er, so not really qualified to post here, but i just needed to say something.

rp - rest pause
ss - straight set
widowmaker - 20 rep quad set

by the way, i know im no where near ready for DC yet, (not to mention would like to start a blast with access to more hammer strength machines) but i just incorporated the widowmakers, and the stretches and in 2 weeks have blasted through a plateau. new stretchmarks on my arms and shoulders and a noticeable difference in my quads from the 20 rep squats.

triceps are happy with smith cg presses too.

i feel as though CC contributes more to this website than anyone at the moment.
so this is an official thank you


i guess i should have clarified myself a little more
i meant what EXACTLY is rest pause–and im guessin a Straight set is just doing the set as is,

whatever…

I just have to say I’m pretty impressed with DC training so far. I’m on the 4th week of my 1st blast and quite surprised at the jumps in weight and reps I’ve been able to make. I was progressing much slower with my old 4-day split with 4-5 ramping sets per exercise (~25 reps total) and about 3 exercises per muscle group. Here’s what my 1st DC blast looks like:

A1
Incline DB Bench, 20-30 RP
Military Press, 11-15 RP
Decline Skullcrusher, 17-21 RP
Pullup, 15-20 RP
Deadlift, 9-12 SS & 5-8 SS

B1
DB Alt. Curl, 16-20 RP
BB Rev. Curl, 11-20 SS
Horizontal Calf Push (or whatever that thing is called), 10-12 SS
Lying Leg Curl, 15-20 RP
BB Squat, 4-6 SS & 16-20 WM

A2
HS Inc. Bench, 11-15 RP
DB Press, 15-30 RP
HS Dip, 15-20 RP (I was doing weighted dips but I’m liking the HS dip machine more now)
Wide Grip Pullup, 11-15 RP
HS Low Row, 11-15 RP

B2
EZ BB Curl, 20-30 RP
Hammer Curl, 11-20 SS
Seated Calf Raise, 10-12 RP
Front Squat, 4-6 SS & Hack Squat, 16-20 WM
RDL, 10-12 SS & 6-8 SS

A3
DB Bench, 20-30 RP
HS Shoulder Press, 11-15 RP
Reverse Wide Grip Smith, 11-15 RP
HS Pulldown, 15-20 RP
BB Row, 10-12 SS & 6-8 SS

B3
HS Curl, 20-30 RP
Pinwheel Curl, 11-20 SS
Seated Calf Raise, 10-12 SS (ok, I don’t really have 3 different calf excercises… Standing calf raise machine sucks and my gym doesn’t have the donkey. Maybe I should try with a dipping belt)
HS Leg Press, 5-8 SS & 16-20 WM
G’mornin’, 10-12 SS, 6-8 SS

[quote]zenomaly wrote:
I just have to say I’m pretty impressed with DC training so far. I’m on the 4th week of my 1st blast and quite surprised at the jumps in weight and reps I’ve been able to make. I was progressing much slower with my old 4-day split with 4-5 ramping sets per exercise (~25 reps total) and about 3 exercises per muscle group. Here’s what my 1st DC blast looks like:

A1
Incline DB Bench, 20-30 RP
Military Press, 11-15 RP
Decline Skullcrusher, 17-21 RP
Pullup, 15-20 RP
Deadlift, 9-12 SS & 5-8 SS

B1
DB Alt. Curl, 16-20 RP
BB Rev. Curl, 11-20 SS
Horizontal Calf Push (or whatever that thing is called), 10-12 SS
Lying Leg Curl, 15-20 RP
BB Squat, 4-6 SS & 16-20 WM

A2
HS Inc. Bench, 11-15 RP
DB Press, 15-30 RP
HS Dip, 15-20 RP (I was doing weighted dips but I’m liking the HS dip machine more now)
Wide Grip Pullup, 11-15 RP
HS Low Row, 11-15 RP

B2
EZ BB Curl, 20-30 RP
Hammer Curl, 11-20 SS
Seated Calf Raise, 10-12 RP
Front Squat, 4-6 SS & Hack Squat, 16-20 WM
RDL, 10-12 SS & 6-8 SS

A3
DB Bench, 20-30 RP
HS Shoulder Press, 11-15 RP
Reverse Wide Grip Smith, 11-15 RP
HS Pulldown, 15-20 RP
BB Row, 10-12 SS & 6-8 SS

B3
HS Curl, 20-30 RP
Pinwheel Curl, 11-20 SS
Seated Calf Raise, 10-12 SS (ok, I don’t really have 3 different calf excercises… Standing calf raise machine sucks and my gym doesn’t have the donkey. Maybe I should try with a dipping belt)
HS Leg Press, 5-8 SS & 16-20 WM
G’mornin’, 10-12 SS, 6-8 SS

[/quote]

Do you have access to a leg press or hack squat machine? Because you can do calf raises on either of those to add some variety. There are also some more “inventive” ways that you can replicate a donkey calf raise that I suggested earlier in the thread.

[quote]MeinHerzBrennt wrote:
Went in for a B day and had to leave before finishing hams.

Quick update: did a short one week cruise about 4 weeks ago where I didn’t lift at all. 4 weeks later and I had a somewhat crappy A workout on monday and couldn’t finish my workout today. I had nothing. Didn’t really feel tired (laid down for an hour and popped caffeine pre WO as usual) but just didn’t have anything “extra” and didn’t feel strong, same as Monday.

I’m under a shit ton of stress lately (bar review being a primary factor) and i’m not sleeping all that well. Ordered a bottle of True Protein sleeping pills last week; should get them any day now. Hoping they can ease my mind at night and let me fall asleep faster (already been taking ZMA for 1.5 years).
[/quote]

Well, stress is ultimately what causes you to need to cruise anyway. Though we often think of it in terms of physical stress due to lifting progressively heavier, mental/emotional stress can also have the same effect. Couple that with a lack of sleep and it’s not surprising you’re feeling a little run down.

I also understand the caffeine usage prior to working out, but remember that stimulants cause your body to release epinephrine/norepinephrine (adrenaline) and thus can potentially put you into adrenal fatigue. Since you’re already in a very stressed state, I suspect that the caffeine might not be helping.

Was your last 1 week cruise a scheduled cruise? Was it due to a need, or just convenience (like maybe you went on vacation)? You might have needed more time, and thus, coupled with the stress from work, might wind up cutting this blast short. I really doubt that you’ll need to stop altogether though, you probably just need a longer cruise and maybe some ways to decrease your stress (like “power naps”, massage, meditation if you’re into that type of thing, etc…).

How much longer until you take the bar review?

I’d suggest taking a mini-cruise (don’t workout friday or over the weekend) and see how you feel on Monday. If you’re still feeling run down, take a full cruise (10-14 days) and then come back and hit the weights again.

[quote]
I also think I have to switch some exercises. I haven’t been progressing on EZ bar curls, and the back of my right knee hurts anytime I do a type of leg curl (really lame). I have access to a GHR, would just need to figure out a way to carefully monitor weight progression (they have chains and shit at my gym that I could hang on my neck but not sure of their weight). They also have a reverse hyper which i’ve never used; may have to hit that up.

Summer of lame!!!
/rant.[/quote]

Definitely hit up the reverse hyper, great machine, wish my gym had one.

What is your rep range on leg curls? Might want to up it if you’re experiencing joint pain (though that could also be a sign that you need a more extensive cruise). Definitely switch out ez bar curls if you haven’t been progressing on them.

Monday (1A)
Incline Smith press 11-15rps
Front Smith Press 11-20rps
Reverse grip smith bench 11-20rps
Pull Downs to Front 15-30RP
Rack Deadlift 10-12 (straight set) then 6-8 (straight set)

Wednesday (1B)
BB Curls 11-20 rps
Reverse curls 11-20 (straight set)
HS Seated Calf Raise 10-12 (straight set)
Seated Leg Curls 15-30rps
HS leg press 4-8 (straight set)+ widowmaker

Friday (2A)
Flat Dumbell Press 15-30RP
Machine Military Press 11-20rps
Close grip smith bench 11-20rps
Rack Chins to Front 15-30RP
T-bar rows straight set 10-12 (straight set)

Monday (2B)
BB Preacher Curls 11-20rps
Wrist Curls 11-20 (straight set)
Standing Calf Raise 10-12 (straight set)
Back Squats 6-10 straight set + 20reps widowmaker
Lying Leg Curls (15-30rp)

Wednesday (3A)
Floor Press 11-20 rps
Dumbell Press 15-30RP
Skull crushers 15-30RP
HS Pulldown 12-20RP
Seated T-Bar Row 10-12 (straight set) then 6-8 (straight set)

Friday (3B)
HS Machine Curls 11-20 rps
Pinwheel Curls 10-20 (straight set)
Leg Press Calf Raises 10-12 (straight set)
Sumo Press 15-25
Front Squats 6-10 + 20 rep widowmaker Smith Machine

Finally, again much appreciated Ceph as always.

Thank you !

[quote]ayork90 wrote:
i feel as though CC contributes more to this website than anyone at the moment.
so this is an official thank you[/quote]

Thanks

Now, if only I were getting paid for this… :slight_smile:

[quote]RobbyRob wrote:

i guess i should have clarified myself a little more
i meant what EXACTLY is rest pause–and im guessin a Straight set is just doing the set as is,

whatever…[/quote]

Go back and read the DC article again, it describes what is involved in a “DC RP” set. If you don’t get it from that description, then maybe you need some more time under the bar before starting DC.

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

Definitely hit up the reverse hyper, great machine, wish my gym had one. [/quote] <- Seconded. Rev-Hyper is great for DC blasts… Helps with low-back health/compression from all the heavy squatting and deadlifting and such while getting your hams big. [quote]

What is your rep range on leg curls? Might want to up it if you’re experiencing joint pain (though that could also be a sign that you need a more extensive cruise). Definitely switch out ez bar curls if you haven’t been progressing on them.[/quote]
Seated Leg Curls give me the same problem.
Lying ones don’t, or at least not often. Kind of depends on how my legs are held while curling (feet closer together than knees or the other way around, or relatively straight)

sento i appreciate it… i re read it and clicked the links… i guess they werent enabled on my comp my first run thru so it left some wholes for questions… but after re reading and breaking it down it all came together… thanks… im starting monday so im prepared for the worst

Thanks for the response Sento.
My last ‘cruise’ was because of finals and a slightly hectic schedule. I cut that blast a tad short by cruising at that time, so I figured i’d only take a week off.

I might go back to the gym on Monday and see how I feel like you suggested. And as for the caffeine, i’ve noticed that it’s not giving me the same ‘kick’ as it used to. I take 400mg (2 pills) pre cardio which is 4x a week (off days) and also 400mg on workout days 3x a week. I don’t drink coffe really. So, 400mg every day could very well be catching up on me and not helping with the fatigue. May have to decrease that and just rely on green tea and extract before morning cardio.

Leg curl range has always been 15-30. My previous RP total was 25. My right knee acted up even on the first set but it was doable. Not so much on the second. I didn’t bother with the third set. It’s really lame; never had knee pain before.

I’ll hit up the hyper machine since you guys both recommend it.

C_C also thanks to you… i hit that site up and it answered a lot of no brainers i had…i only ask questions so i dont half ass shit…but again thanks for the help…im going with the drawn out workout that was included in the article… ill post up how it holds for me at the end of next week and again the week after that…thanks again

Earlier I mentioned biceps should be in the 15-30 RP (meant to write 15-20), and here is what DC says in response to a user asking about biceps - “raise the rep ranges to 15-20rp on bicep movements” and …

SuperD - “Was just discussing the other day how biceps are a unique bodypart and really do tend to respond better to that slightly higher rep range. This is key to keeping those particular exercises in your blast and not losing an exercise every few weeks due to simply going too heavy each and every time and not being able to hit your target rep range.”

Just throwing that out there for everyone, so in case you stall easily on bicep exercises you know the recommended protocol.

300, you prob want to flip-flop back squats and leg curls on Monday 2B.

[quote]300andabove wrote:
Monday (1A)
Incline Smith press 11-15rps
Front Smith Press 11-20rps
Reverse grip smith bench 11-20rps
Pull Downs to Front 11-15 rps
Rack Deadlift 10-12 (straight set) then 6-8 (straight set)

Wednesday (1B)
BB Curls 11-20 rps
Reverse curls 11-20 (straight set)
HS Seated Calf Raise 10-12 (straight set)
Seated Leg Curls 15-30rps
Back Squat 6-10 (straight set)+widowmaker

Friday (2A)
Flat Dumbell Press 11-15rps
Machine Military Press 11-20rps
Close grip smith bench 11-20rps
Rack Chins to Front 11-15rps
Deadlifts 10-12 (straight set) then 6-8 (straight set)

Monday (2B)
BB Preacher Curls 11-20rps
Wrist Curls 11-20 (straight set)
Standing Calf Raise 10-12 (straight set)
SLDL 10-20 (straight set)
HS Leg Press 6-10 straight set + 20reps widowmaker

Wednesday (3A)
Floor Press 11-20 rps
Dumbell Press 11-20 rps
Skull crushers 11-20 rps
HS Pulldown 11-15 rps
T-Bar Row 10-12 (straight set) then 6-8 (straight set)

Friday (3B)
HS Machine Curls 11-20 rps
Pinwheel Curls 10-20 (straight set)
Leg Press Calf Raises 10-12 (straight set)
Sumo Press 15-30 rps
Front Squats 6-10+ 20 rep widowmaker
[/quote]

300, what weight are you using for your Smith Incline Press?

[quote]RobbyRob wrote:
sento i appreciate it… i re read it and clicked the links… i guess they werent enabled on my comp my first run thru so it left some wholes for questions… but after re reading and breaking it down it all came together… thanks… im starting monday so im prepared for the worst [/quote]

No problem, and I hope I didn’t come across as sounding like a dick. :slight_smile:

Just want to say all you long time dc’s are nucking futs… seriously… and i do mean that in the nicest possible way.

I’ve been doing this for only 3 weeks now (5 weeks total including 2 weeks setting up) and have never been so tired in all my life, i struggle to stay awake 2 to 3 hours after a workout and wake up tired & (consistently) sore the next day. Sorry for the rant, call me a pussy.

They say the difference between insanity & genius is a very fine line and i’m questioning where DC falls at the moment… so far i’m up about 3 to 4 kgs from my starting weight 5 weeks ago (this is after dropping 2kgs in the first 2 week set up period so i’m actually up about 5 to 6 kgs, in 3 weeks!! from my most recent, lowest weight)… So i’m leaning towards genius.

Oh and i got asked tonight “what i was on?” by a couple of mates, one of the guys asking was actually an older (40’s i think) former Mr Aust. winner, so the comment was a real compliment, after trying to explain it, “no, seriously what are you on?” I just laughed and said i’d come over sometime over the weekend and explain/ show them what dc is. I knew i’m bigger, but didn’t think it was to that extent.

If i keep gaining at half this rate i’ll be very impressed. The only body part that hasn’t really responded to dc yet are my calves, but we’ll see how they’re going in 4 to 6 weeks or so.

I’ve been questioning if i should drop the third leg of the rp sets or even just do straight sets at the moment, but it’s working as is, so i’ll be true to the concept until i start stalling and re-evaluate everything during my first cruise… if i’m still alive then, lol.

UPDate

I am coming to the middle of my blasting phase, and so far I’ve seen a huge improvement in my hamstrings. The sumo leg press works amazingly well. (SLP 20-25 RP) <<<<Definitely reccomended.

sento you were cool man…i couldnt imagine how many guys come on the site asking for handouts so i could understand any frusration…but im totally motivated to start monday… ill probably still have a few questions here and there… so bare with me at times lol…