It sounds like a humbling experience, which when leading by example, is (Imo) a good thing to demonstrate.
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I’m sure they do, within boundaries.
It’s those boundaries that get broken first though when people bring all of their adult sized expectations to bear on a young kid.
My kid doesn’t like loud noises like chainsaws. I’m not going to react to his aversion by forcing him to tolerate that type of stuff, as my one no longer friend would say “to toughen him up”. I’m going to give him earplugs and set him at a safe distance or give him something else to do that doesn’t terrify him. Then when he’s bigger, maybe has less of a visceral reaction to stuff like that-he’ll join me instead of remembering what a dick dad was and how much he hates those noisy machines.
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Agreed
I got this feeling from mum sometimes and it really bothered me
As long as my wee ones give it 100% effort then I can handle a meltdown or two.
I constantly stress that they have to embrace failure because the rungs on the ladder of success are built of failure to use a cheesy phrase
Btw there’s no answers to dadding. It’s like one continuous widowmaker set 
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For sure. I don’t think that you, @omats, or any parent here is pushing their kids to do activities in an unhealthy way. Just talking.
I don’t disagree with your understanding of grit. I also think grit is subjective and can depend on the person and the endeavor. It ebbs and flows. Some people could have greater capacities to spread grit across more hobbies or subjects.
I’m not suggesting that liking something is the ticket to not giving up. I can’t say I loved, hated, or liked dance and gymnastics; I gave them up because they didn’t “fit” me. Looking at my hobbies at that time, it may have seemed I lacked grit entirely. But I continued sampling different sports and found what clicked.
The sport I chose wasn’t all sunshine and rainbows. It also wasn’t something I picked because I was naturally good at it on my first or second try. There were a lot of failures and meltdowns in that decade – many times when I didn’t like it. But it was intrinsically motivating enough for me to not give up.
I’m not saying that @jdm135’s kids are experiencing what I’m describing. I’m just throwing out an alternative possibility. If his kids have difficulty coping with failure in everyday tasks, that’s different. But if this relates to free time activities, it can look like they lack grit altogether when they instead may benefit from sampling different options.
Again, I’d recommend picking up David Epstein’s recent book.
It sounds like you’d prefer Epstein’s book. I’m really derailing this thread now 
I appreciate your emphasis on a broader education for your children.
I actually think I benefited from my parents’ lack of education in this regard. I didn’t have any role model who suggested to me even subconsciously that I should be better at one discipline over another. My family didn’t know how to begin encouraging me to choose a path even if they wanted.
I suspect that your parents pushing you toward something may have played some role. I don’t think I’m more intelligent than the average person. I simply thrived with variety without pressure.
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I don’t have time to followup appropriately with all the helpful and insightful responses here yet, maybe tomorrow; but @Bagsy this caught my eye because its totally true of me as well. Mine didn’t even know where to begin, didn’t even suggest that college was important. I’m not calling that a good thing, just commiserating.
Here I am with a BS and MBA and my kids will have a totally different life than I did for sure!!
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That’s an excellent piece of advice. Another thing my dad practiced with me and my siblings is repairing stuff and I do same with my kids.
Kids get to see the entire lifecycle of an undertaking and the corresponding ups and downs. That it’s not a disaster to fail, not to know something and that’s is perfectly acceptable to ask for help and that dad is facing similar challenges they’re facing but in the grown up world.
In addition, if I’m upset (or cursing) I explain them in detail what happened and that Dad said those bad words because he expected the newly installed lights to turn on after he flipped the switch. So basically on a concrete example I break down the process to them - effort to failure to (optional) venting off steam to additional effort to (optional) success. And that even everything fails, it’s not the end of the world and that we have additional options.
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Yeah! I do things like that with him as my helper (not in quotes) . It really actually helps that he can read fractions on sockets and wrenches.
We did the lower control arm on our car. That definitely had its ups and downs, some YouTube vids, a couple of calls for help-and finally Victory! The car back on the road.
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The worst part is that going through a stage with one kid has almost no carryover to my ability to parent the next one because they’re all so different.
Well, it takes something, that’s for sure. We’ll find out if I had that thing in another 20-25 years or so LOL.
The main difference is me. I was 19 when my son was born. I didn’t even know how to be me yet, much less a father. I’ve never been so unprepared for anything in my life, and I was too arrogant to realize it.
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This is really important. My son is currently in first grade, so he still got a lot of maturing to do, and even with games, my wife was initially pretty big on letting him win. I refuses to do that, which led to quite a few cry fests, but even when he did win, I wouldn’t praise the fact that he won, or excelled, but that he tried really hard and we both had fun.
In school, he routinely does very well on tests. I make a point to not praise his intelligence, as that can be an innate trait that is something I wouldn’t reward because not everyone has it. I always praise how hard he studied, and how hard he worked, and if he does something wrong, I always emphasize that so long as he does his best, he should always be proud.
Even when I’m teaching any of my classes, when I make a mistake, I eat it. I think it’s very important for all students to view their parents, and teachers, as fallible, and that it doesn’t reflect poorly on other accomplishments, or who they are as a person.
S
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yea man … this is huge. Showing resilience is one of the best lessons and examples we can give our youth. The resolve to keep moving forward and to learn from mistakes is a great lesson to impart on the kids we might have influence over.
Much like @Bagsy I believe, I took up piano just before my son was born and am now currently trying to learn chess. If you want to teach resilience, tenacity and resolve (grit), play chess. fuck that’s a hard game
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I appreciate everyone’s comments. Unfortunately I haven’t had time to reply and ask all the followup questions I’d like to yet, but I just want to thank all of you. I learned a lot here!
Others have already touched on this but leading by example consistently over time is how it gets done, and you have to keep showing them in every stage of life through every type of problem.
I lost it last year in front of my 20 year-old son. A family member was in a coma, I was not processing things clearly and I had a grown man meltdown. I put myself in a time out and took a long walk by myself, then came back home to apologize and discuss the situation calmly. That’s the best I could do at that point.
More typical examples are just showing how to react to everyday disappointment by example and helping the child have a good perspective on what just went down. I’m naturally sarcastic and use that in a tempered way with my son and nieces. Asking sarcastic questions in a dead-serious, non-sarcastic tone has been a good tool to get kids thinking about perspective.
Child is upset that you didn’t buy xyz at the store? A simple “Are you going to be alright?” feigning deep concern was solid-gold during teenage years for all kinds of teenage meltdowns. By that age he knew right away that things would, in fact, be fine and usually gave me some kind of smirk once I asked it, realizing his own absurd actions.
His mother and I often clashed in earlier years when managing the situations you describe. I am of the opinion that being upset is a natural, expected outcome of childhood disappointment. It is up to you to channel those feelings into something productive. Nobody will know you, your kids and the dynamics you have well enough to spell out exactly how, but that’s probably easier than you might think. You know your kids, after all.
What you must avoid is letting an upset child guide your parenting in the moment. My kid’s mom hated it when her son was upset and would shy away from productive conflict in order to appease his feelings. She still does. I pick my battles and once I pick them, I’m not moving an inch. I absolutely refused to reward tantrums in any way whatsoever.
Kids are like dogs. Pack creatures with fairly easy-to-understand motivations who respond to similar types of training and incentive structures.
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The other part of this I’d like to expand on has also been touched on already. I’m a big believer in fueling whatever happens to be a child’s chosen pursuit, but only because that ALSO seemed like the most obviously prudent thing to do at the time. I can’t really take credit for cultivating the interest, it was just there. I also only had one kid to worry about.
My kid was obsessed with hockey from a very young age. He still is. It was not the sport I would have chosen, mostly because it is incredibly expensive and time-consuming for everyone involved, but it was what he was clearly ready to put real effort into. So hockey parents we became.
We managed to pull most of the important aspects of his life into the orbit of hockey. Grades, behavior at home, behavior in school, you-name-it. If he failed to meet expectations there were hockey consequences, namely sitting on the bench in your helmet and street clothes after explaining to the coach that you can’t play because of your D- on your progress report. That sucked so hard for him.
Back to the point of this thread, after over a decade of hockey parenting he now has an improved perspective on what it means to work hard, improve dramatically and achieve a high level of skill at something that is important to you. That is always a point of reference I can go back to no matter what sort of challenge he and I may be talking about as adults.
His next challenge is figuring out what is important to him as an adult, but I’m pleased that he’s holding down a really nice job and making increasingly good decisions at age 20.
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Maybe too obvious a measure to take but just be there with your kids, close to zero effort and the reward is huge.
If the kids are in your custody, you can’t be off doing your thing in the garage/mancave while your significant other has an eye on them while they entertain themselves. At least bring them along if you must.
Kids measure love through time and you can be the best role model in the world but if your kids don’t know you, it won’t matter much after 7.
That might mean some hard decisions like missing weekly afternoon drinks with your friends on Saturday. Suck it up the weekend is for your family, unless the sacrifice is putting food on the table, keeping a roof over your head, etc think about making it for more time.
If you can put your phone away as well, do that. Increases the quality of the time by a factor of 10.
You can be the best role model in the world but if you ain’t got time to expose your kid to it outside of 15 minutes before bed and while you take them to ball practice, it ain’t going to mean a thing. Feeling secure and loved will make them more resilient and that will help in overcoming adversity.
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I fully appreciate this. I try to include them as much as possible in my home projects for this reason.
You and I are similar. I have practically never done this (Saturday drinks w friends) because for me, it goes without saying. Time away from work is for family.
Damnit you got me. "Quality time " often occurs during working hours and I feel compelled to stay on top of texts and emails during the activity… but that is something I can work on.
Thanks man.