T Nation

Cycling and Insomina

Ever do a google search for Cycling and Insomnia? Page after page of bike riding. Oh well, thanks to T Nation you guys know what I mean.
Rewind back 6 months and I was on my last 12 week blast of 500TE with the first 4 weeks of 20/30/40/50 Anavar and the last 4 weeks of winny 20/40. Got my post cycle bloods and freaked out. Lipids thru the roof, SHGB in single digits, AST/ALT double my normal values. E2 sen over 200. Stopped everything and cut to 80mg Tcyp/w with 0.25 anastrozole/w for the last 6 months. Just got my bloods for my 6 month TRT checkup and they suck. My doc will like them because they are better than 6 months ago. However as soon I got my blood test back I upped my TRT dose to 150 my script value and doubled my Ai to .50/w. All that said I have been experiencing extreme insomnia for the last 6 months but I don’t think it is tied to my HRT or the AAS experiments. I think it is cortisol and my pump is stuck on. Does anyone out there have cortisol issues with your TRT or cycling? Sorry for the wall of text. If you made it this far thanks.

When’s the last time you took a week or two completely off from the gym? I just did (basically against my will) and it was the best I’ve ever felt. I’m only like 5 days back in the gym and can already tell I’ve lost some of that goodness lol apparently it’s a balancing act burning the candle from both ends.

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I can relate to this very much… I used to go to the gym every day, sometimes twice for extra cardio… It was very hard for me to start EOD training, but yeah - sometimes taking time off gives you better training results than steroids do. I have noticed this on some of my clients - that if they for some reason skip a week, they actually break their PRs after that.

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About 6 years a go. Yes no breaks for me. I have anxiety issues if I don’t spend some time burning energy at the gym my issues get worse. @wanna_be do you have any experience with cortisol issues? I feel my cortisol pump is stuck on. And I don’t know why or how to shut it down. I believe it is the source of my insomnia. Anyone in the Pharma forum connecting with this issue/problem? I could sure use some advice.

Then @wanna_be was on the right track.

Cortisol gets produced because of perceived emotional stress, physical stress or immune system stress.

With us Gym rats, most of the time the problem is excessive physical stress. We have our daily life stressors and on top we put exhausting training. Especially heavy weights and weights that put the fear of god in you are jacking up cortisol production.

Not enough activity also leads to anxiety and sleep issues.

It’s a balance. Chances are, you are overtaxing your body. AAS especially in supraphysiological doses are stressors themselves on most of the bodies systems.

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I know you like to MTB ride, maybe devote a week or So to exploring some new places in place of the gym

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Cortisol is produced when training and produced alot when all types of stress meet together in one humans body.
I would suggest 2 weeks of sitting on ass. No gym, no running, no bikes. Only walks, stretch, and boring life. You will feel mega-amped up when you return.

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Story checks out

Was a hard thing for me to learn, that doing a bit less can result in better results. If I lift too heavy, I usually don’t sleep. If I do too much total work same thing. A bit less, and I sleep. It’s a fine line for me.

If I get a “runner’s high” it is too much. Unfortunate, because I really like that feeling.

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Yes and OP is also not 20yr old. I had a huge dip in my recovery when i hit 30. OP is like what? Two times 30? Twice as awesome for sure but that recovery still may be not enough for that amount of awesomeness

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I agree with what everyone is saying. There’s also a strong correlation between AI and insomnia. I didn’t look deep into dose comparison in the study vs what you are taking. I get insomnia on blast, after some trial and error and research I think part of my problem is needing AI on blast, I don’t take it on cruise.

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Absolutely. I get insomnia on anything over 200mg Test/ week. The higher I go, the less I sleep. I’m on 350TEst/350NPP a week right now and I sleep a broken 5 hours a night if I’m lucky. Is it cortisol, I think so. Cortisol is the hormone that tells you to wake up. Do I have labs to back up my broscience theory? Nope, sorry.

All I have is that my CO2 levels were high on last labs and I asked the doc why and he said high cortisol is usually the cause. If it gets too bad, it could turn into Cushing’s syndrome he said.

Serotonin is needed for sleep cycle. DA also plays a role in sleep as well. Both are hurt by low e2 levels, so that checks out.

Oddly I can’t sleep when my e2 gets too high, but that’s more like an amped up feeling, energized, anxious, not just general insomnia. And I assume it’s e2 related cos when I take .25mg Anastrozole is goes away and I can sleep that night.

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Thanks, everyone for your posts and advice.
Here are my recent bloods for your pursuing and entertainment. Everybody loves numbers, well I do anyway.
The TT/FT is not a typo. My E2 lipids and liver enzymes had gone thru the roof(from blasting with AAS’s doc does not know about this. It was easy to get TT/FT down to normal levels but not lipids or liver, live and learn) so my doc ask me to drop my T cyp injection to 80mg/week and take 0.125mg twice a week. I did that for the last 5 months my TT is in the tank and my E2 is still thru the roof.

I also included my lipids and liver numbers since I had trashed them so bad on my last blast using anavar and winny. Looks like I am on the mend but what a cost. 1/2 a year, dam.



Since this blood test 08/29/2021 I have upped my T injections to my scrip of 150mg/week and I am taking .50mg/week anastrozole. 6 month consult due in 2 weeks.

Thanks again everyone.

In December of 2020 I had my cortisol tested. The blood draw was 10am.
I plan to ask for the saliva every 4 hours test to get a more accurate range.
Oh the crashed ferritin is from too many blood donations do to HCT issues from blasting.

Just a heads up that’s total estrogens, not e2, in the first labwork. It’s actually not too bad

Edit: I didn’t mean e2 isn’t that bad, just the total wasn’t. This doesn’t tell you where estradiol is at all

@swoops39 Thanks swoops I did notice my PCP ordered the wrong E2 test and I have ordered a sensitive test. Drew blood last Tuesday nothing from LabCorp yet I have heard the sensitive test can take up to ten days. As soon as I get it I will post. I have my annual physical with my PCP in two weeks and TRT 6 month consult as soon as my E2 sensitive test comes back. Looking for help on my cortisol and insomnia from both.

Do you know does anastrozole only reduce E2? Does it not effect E1 or 3?

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Great Q. I actually have no idea, but I’m going to find out lol

Hi Hank thanks for posting and offering advice.
In November I will be 68. I did not find bodybuilding until I turned 54 and my doctor told me I was going to have a very short retirement if I did not change my ways. Unlike most of you on this forum you found bodybuilding early in life. Me not so much that is probably why I don’t always fit in.
I was an Aerospace Engineer/geek/deskjocky/nerd to the nth degree.

Ever seen those pictures on the news about a rover running around Mars? Well, I was a lead engineer on testing that equipment so it could survive the Mars atmosphere.

When my PCP said I was going to die in a matter of years I did a ton of research and found an anti-aging clinic and they turned my life around. It wasn’t overnight. vitamin injections like lipo-C, peptides like sermorelin to boost IGF-1, and natural GH. TRT of course. I have been on TRT for ~8 years now and the last 4 I have been blasting twice a year. Unlike you I don’t care about strength I have nothing to prove at my age my wife of 38 years wants arm candy with handholds in bed. Yes she is on HRT as well. It is only fare.
Sorry I never learned how to pose and I know nothing about selfies in fact I don’t even own a smartphone. My flip phone cost me 27buck US a month unlimited text and talk. I have a gaming PC for everything else. I know you like pictures and I do to but this is the best I can do for now.

Bob52 65 in BandW

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@swoops39 @lordgains I’ll bet lordgains knows. Hailing lordgain. What do you think brother? Does anastrozole only reduce E2 ( estradiol)