T Nation

Cycle to Stimulate BONE Growth?


#1

Sorry I know there's a lot of these threads, I've read a lot them but i'm still trying to make sense of it all.

Unfortunately I have very narrow shoulders, and to make matters worse I also have very wide hips, which as you all know is not a good look.
I'm 23 years old (as of yesterday) and i've lifting since i was 16. I believe I do have quite sound knowledge of training and nutrition, although I don't think I have the best genetics to build muscle, I at least know that I can slowly over time with lots of hard work, consistency and attention to detail. However unfortunately due to my frame, even when I pack on muscle I still look terrible.

I believe the reason for my poor frame is due to me having anorexia from the age of 15 - 17 years old. I was quite late to hit puberty and didn't until around 14 or 15 which is when my anorexia began. As such obviously anorexia had a big effect on my hormones, most likely reducing my testosterone and perhaps GH, and thus stunting my growth.

I'm 5'10", i'm completely content with my height so i'm not worried about that. What really bothers me though is my shoulder to hip ratio. I'm desperate to broaden my shoulders and rib cage, relative to my hips, so that I can have a normal male physique.

I've looked a lot of studies and forums to try to find the right answer, but It seems like it's almost impossible to stimulate additional bone growth after puberty (except after years and years of HGH which still likely wont result in increased shoulder width). However, I have seen that the ossification of the clavicles might not occur until 25.

A lot of people say that high test may inhibit bone growth but other studies have reported that it is infact high estrogen that inhibits bone growth (so i'm a little confused).

If I was to cycle some form of test/ HGH would it be possible to broaden my BONE frame? (only looking for width I dont need height), and if so what would you recommend? purely some form of test? HGH? or both?

(really sorry for all the rambling, It might look like I havent done much research, I have I'm just not good at putting it into words)


#2

Closures of plates is expedited by estrogen, not testosterone. Dosing AI in early teens lowers estrogen and therefore prolongs this process, resulting in increased average height by 2.5 inches or so. Not sure how this would effects hip to waist ratio but for you, at your age, it is irrelevant. Too late.

Deal with the hand you’ve been given. Best you can do is lower your body fat to single digits to make your waist appear as small as possible while hammering your delts, lats and upper pecs to give illusion of size up top.


#3

[quote]Igs wrote:
Closures of plates is expedited by estrogen, not testosterone. Dosing AI in early teens lowers estrogen and therefore prolongs this process, resulting in increased average height by 2.5 inches or so. Not sure how this would effects hip to waist ratio but for you, at your age, it is irrelevant. Too late.

Deal with the hand you’ve been given. Best you can do is lower your body fat to single digits to make your waist appear as small as possible while hammering your delts, lats and upper pecs to give illusion of size up top.
[/quote]

Thanks for the reply. My thoughts were that as high test is more likely to result in growth in the shoulders due to all the androgen receptors, a lack of test would obviously stunt that shoulder growth leading to my shoulder to hip ratio never reaching it’s genetic potential.

I am already quite lean and those are all things i’ve tried, however it makes little difference when your bone frame is off. Some people report that the clavicles still grow up until 25 (i’m not sure of the credibility but it’s hope), in addition to this I was also quite late to hit puberty (around 15) so I thought perhaps they may be a tiny chance I could still achieve some growth in my shoulders if I was to use HGH or a non-aromatizing steroid.


#4

Your bones are done growing. Building your upper body is the way to go. You would be surprised how much big delts can change the look of someone.


#5

If you do get any growth it will be proportional across the body. I reached 5’11" at about 18, however from 18-24 I filled out a bit (bone and muscle) without even touching weights. But my pants size also went from 31 to 33, without any fat gain, meaning as my shoulders/chest got bigger, so did my hip girdle.


#6

Thanks for the reply guys, yeah I was afraid that was the case, I figured it would be but I just wanted to make sure if there was any chance. Guess i’m stuck like this forever :confused:


#7

[quote]worthashot wrote:
Thanks for the reply guys, yeah I was afraid that was the case, I figured it would be but I just wanted to make sure if there was any chance. Guess i’m stuck like this forever :/[/quote]

You could quit whining about your structure and build some muscle around it. A guy named Aaron Clark posted on here 6 or 7 years ago. He had already built an appreciable amount of muscle, but he was told by at least 1 higher level bodybuilder that his structure was inadequate for bodybuilding. More specifically, his shoulder structure was too narrow. Google Aaron Clark now. He’s an IFBB pro.

The bottom line is that you can lament your deficiencies, or you can overcome them. That choice is yours.


#8

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]worthashot wrote:
Thanks for the reply guys, yeah I was afraid that was the case, I figured it would be but I just wanted to make sure if there was any chance. Guess i’m stuck like this forever :/[/quote]

You could quit whining about your structure and build some muscle around it. A guy named Aaron Clark posted on here 6 or 7 years ago. He had already built an appreciable amount of muscle, but he was told by at least 1 higher level bodybuilder that his structure was inadequate for bodybuilding. More specifically, his shoulder structure was too narrow. Google Aaron Clark now. He’s an IFBB pro.

The bottom line is that you can lament your deficiencies, or you can overcome them. That choice is yours.[/quote]

Yeah, self-pity doesn’t buy jack-shit. With years, you learn this more and more and you actually make adjustments instead of whining. Because believe me, no one gives a shit. You’re young however, so I understand your last post. Good luck with your physique pursuits.


#9

this is the structure I began my journey with me. I’m a full grown adult in this picture, lol. I was 18.


#10

^Teeheehee


#11

[quote]dt79 wrote:
^Teeheehee[/quote]

U Jelly?


#12

Seriously OP, you said you suffered from anorexia in the past, so there’s a possibility that your current perception of your proportions might be a little flawed.


#13

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]dt79 wrote:
^Teeheehee[/quote]

U Jelly?[/quote]
I’m overwhelmed by cuteness lol!


#14

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
this is the structure I began my journey with me. I’m a full grown adult in this picture, lol. I was 18.[/quote]

That bone structure would be amazing to start with, what I wouldn’t give…


#15

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]worthashot wrote:
Thanks for the reply guys, yeah I was afraid that was the case, I figured it would be but I just wanted to make sure if there was any chance. Guess i’m stuck like this forever :/[/quote]

You could quit whining about your structure and build some muscle around it. A guy named Aaron Clark posted on here 6 or 7 years ago. He had already built an appreciable amount of muscle, but he was told by at least 1 higher level bodybuilder that his structure was inadequate for bodybuilding. More specifically, his shoulder structure was too narrow. Google Aaron Clark now. He’s an IFBB pro.

The bottom line is that you can lament your deficiencies, or you can overcome them. That choice is yours.[/quote]

Ignorance is bliss.


#16

I’m not whining, i’m here trying to find a solution. I’ve been working my ass off for the last 6 years, what I was trying to get across is that there is only so much that muscle can do when you have a frame like mine. The pic I attached isn’t me but I have a similar frame, mine might be worse though, unless you have a similar frame it’s going to be hard for you to understand what it’s like, you can’t even hide it in clothes, i’m not trying to build some perfect physique, i just want to look normal, i just don’t want to be laughed at.


#17

So you look pretty much like that and you have been lifting for 6 years? If that is the case you are lifting very wrong. Very, very wrong.

Drugs won’t change your bone structure. Learn how to lift and eat properly. Pick a program from this site and eat real food.


#18

[quote]KountKoma wrote:
So you look pretty much like that and you have been lifting for 6 years? If that is the case you are lifting very wrong. Very, very wrong.

Drugs won’t change your bone structure. Learn how to lift and eat properly. Pick a program from this site and eat real food.[/quote]

Oh dear… how can I explain this simpler. No I don’t look like that, I know how to lift and i know how to diet. I’m saying that’s what my bone frame is like. Regardless of how much muscle I put on it doesn’t hide that bone frame.


#19

[quote]dt79 wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]dt79 wrote:
^Teeheehee[/quote]

U Jelly?[/quote]
I’m overwhelmed by cuteness lol![/quote]

you did have a very smooshable face, Flip.


#20

[quote]worthashot wrote:

[quote]KountKoma wrote:
So you look pretty much like that and you have been lifting for 6 years? If that is the case you are lifting very wrong. Very, very wrong.

Drugs won’t change your bone structure. Learn how to lift and eat properly. Pick a program from this site and eat real food.[/quote]

Oh dear… how can I explain this simpler. No I don’t look like that, I know how to lift and i know how to diet. I’m saying that’s what my bone frame is like. Regardless of how much muscle I put on it doesn’t hide that bone frame.[/quote]

maybe this is a stupid question, but… why did you post a picture of someone else? That’s utterly useless, especially since you just said ‘no I don’t look like that.’

And I disagree with the 'regardless of how much muscle I put on ’ comment as well. If the guy in the picture you posted added 40 lbs of muscle, I can guarantee the bone structure issues would mostly disappear.