T Nation

Cycle Proposal


Upcoming cycle, just want to see what you guys think of this cycle
Some stats, 5'10, 210lbs, bf ~12%, 20 yrs old.
Yes age is young, been through the age topic before.

Wk 1-10 Test E: 1500mg/wk (EOD)
Wk 1-3 Dbol: 60mg/d
Wk 9-12 Winstrol: 50mg/d
Wk 9-12 Tbol: 50mg/d
Wk 1-12 Adex: 0.5mg/eod
Wk 1-16 hCG: 200iu/e3d

Wk 12-16 Nolva: 60/40/20/20

Diet: ~400g protein, 6-700g carbs, ?g fat, ~4500-5000kcals (junk meals 3 times a week, my metabolism allows it)

I know this is a fairly heavy cycle so I was wondering if it would be better to cut it down to 8 weeks instead of 10 and up the adex slightly? Also, hCG dose ok to keep testes in check?


I mean..besides your age..I can't see anything wrong with the cycle. I don't think running hcg into pct is a good idea though (and I believe it should begin in week 3), and adex should be tapered into pct.


I was under the impression hCG has to be used to maintain natural test production but by week 3 wont I be suppressed and shut down? This dose of hCG does not apparently work after being shut down. I will stop the hCG prior to PCT, in week 12.


I think your cycle is OTT m8 imo, 500mg are 750mg test e week plenty also i dont see any need to stack the t-bol and winnie at the end of cycle id use 1 are the other (id use winnie) and id run the d-bol for first 4weeks i think 40mg are 50mg/day would be enough test e usally kicks in week 5 are 6.


Whats your cycle history?

Predator may be right, you may not need that much. Then again, if you have ran a gram or so before, 1500 may not be bad to try.

If you do drop it down like predator suggests, then you should frontload it so you don't wait weeks for it to kick in

I would extend the d-bol a week. 60mg is a lot. Not crazy, but a heavy dose. 4 weeks at 40-50mg a day like he said should be enough, unless your experience with d-bol has told you otherwise...

You don't need nolva at 60mg for a whole week. 60mg the first day if you want to front load, then 40mg for the next 13 days, then 2 weeks at 20mg a day.

Hcg in itself is suppressive of natural LH secretion, but I am not sure how long before PCT you need to stop it. I don't come off, and cannot use hcg at this time, so I really have no experience with that.

Look that up, or maybe someone else can chime in, because I don't know when exactly to stop hcg


Thanks for the replies guys.
Im sorry I forgot to mention I will be frontloading anyway.

I have done around 4-5 cycles in the past, have been cycling for around two and a half years following the time on + pct = time off rule. My heaviest cycle was 1200mg of test400 a week. I have also had experience with tren, I loved the effect of tren but the prolactin sides were vicious. I wanted to use tren ace in this cycle at 750mg/wk with test prop at 350mg/wk but I cowered out. Im still thinking about it.
Bigskwatta I will do as you say regarding the nolvadex.

And yes can anyone else chime in regarding the hCG?


Yeah the 1500 won't be a bad choice then.

I would still extend the d-bol one week too.

Other than that and the changes you have made, looks okay to me, once you figure out the hcg part.


Yeah the 1500 won't be a bad choice then.

I would still extend the d-bol one week too.

Other than that and the changes you have made, looks okay to me, once you figure out the hcg part.


Warning-in no way am I trying to be an asshole

But on a serious note, Singh you said you've done 4-5 previous cycles but honestly your pics don't show that at all. Have you though about maybe just really focusing on a solid plan naturally before jumping on AAS?

Im definitely not a cycle expert but with your current body type i feel some of those doses are excessive and you cane bring them down, especially the Test-e.

Either way GL


I was hesitant to respond because I feel there are better ppl to give advice about hCG (having never used and being very rusty on the readings), but since this has gone unanswered I believe it would be best to cease hCG use 2 weeks before starting pct. hCG is basically used in place of LH in men that are hypogonadal. Because a good pct is aimed at restarting natural test production by--among other things--stimulating the body to start natural release of LH, there are 2 things you want to have happen:

1) you don't want to use anything that replaces your natural LH producing mechanisms, thereby keeping them from restarting and

2) you want the body to be sensitized to the effects of LH as much as possible.

1 is taken care of by stopping hCG use and using your serms to help restart natural production. #2 is done by having a two week "lag time" between stoppage and pct. Bill Roberts has written that the two week ON mark in a cycle is the body's most sensitive point for LH. At this point you are not making any natural LH but your body is very sensitive to the effects of it--therefore stopping use of AAS at this point leads to a very rapid, almost unnoticeably fast recovery if proper pct is done. That was the principle behind his 2 week repeating cycle idea.

So basically in layman's terms what you are attempting to do is mimic the sensitivity by using hCG to mimic LH while on a longer cycle, so your body "sees" normal levels of LH during cycle, even though it is artificially injected. Then allowing that two week period to drop the levels of artificial LH and make the body sensitize to a rebound in LH that will come from proper pct.

This is my understanding. If I am wrong I hope someone will bring me up to speed (though I don't think I am).