Cycle Log Coming

@getcutgetbutt thanks man. That’s INSANITY that an endo said that shit to you. My god man.

@unreal24278 I do man. I have a fairly large amount of competitors who see me :wink:

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Too bad you can’t ‘see’ patients from out of state (I live in TN). Wouldn’t even know how to find a doc like you in my area.

I’ve got you man. I’ll help you out

I did TRT unsupervised for about two years, then figured I should go ‘legit’. Talked to my primary care (mistake), and they ran my test levels. At approx. 150mg per week my total showed up as >1500, so they refused to even discuss it until I went off for three months straight and then retested. So, I shopped around and went to see a private TRT clinic. The reason I picked them was because they were the only ones who would send me home with pre-drawn injections rather than come in weekly for shots. I work overseas, so I needed a clinic that would work with me on that. They were the only ones, so at $200 month, I get 8 injections and whatever blood work - I can do it way cheaper using UGL stuff (like I did for two years). Not to mention I think they are straddling the line so to speak - they don’t deal with insurance (as in, won’t even attempt to bill), it’s all paid for out of pocket, and they won’t hand me a scrip to fill at the pharmacy or even give me a vial with test in it for me to draw myself. First time I flew with a supply of pre-filled syringes (drawn by them, not readijects) I got to my destination to find mostly empty syringes (guessing air pressure pushed it out or something). Luckily test is legal where I work, so I bought 10 amps for $20 (American prices are highway robbery).

I’m planning on leaving that clinic, it’s just not worth the money for me (besides I’m going to be home all fall to take science courses, so no income). Planning on doing it myself, since I really don’t want to crash my test levels again in order to get it prescribed somewhere else (wife was really not digging that time period - I was a total dick for a week or so).

Also really liked how I felt at that level (>1500) versus my levels bouncing up and down in the ‘normal’ range like they have for the last year or so. Already increased my injections to get back up where I was, going to order my own labs when I get home next week. Trying that uneven dosing thing you mentioned before - did .25 on Mon and .35 on Thurs.

As cheap as test is overseas, it’s too bad I can’t bring some back with me. But I’d rather not play chicken with US Customs. I like sleeping in my own bed and some pussy on the reg (when I’m home).

What you choose to eat & drink is one of the very most important things you do.

Old, whole food, none Western diet + traditional medicine is incredibly powerful.

Traditional medicine & diet is kind of like yoga. Yoga is still practiced after thousands of years because it works.

On the other hand, it’s unlikely the latest exercise fad will still be going strong in thousands of years - because the fads generally don’t work.

I wonder how many high Estradiol side effects could be solved by eating lots of organic raw vegetables - the traditional way of getting the DIM nutrients. And/or/the same as cleaning your liver up as PhysioL says.

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So, out of curiosity why did you wait so long before trying nandrolone? From what I believe it’s a very effective anabolic (although I may be wrong, I’m no expert).

@mrmeeseeks as to your nebido question, yea in theory that’d work, depending on how you respond to test. For instance the equivalent of 100mg of test undec/wk would probably only get me to 300-400ng/DL, however you may respond much more favorably to lower doses of test than I do, everyone is different, I wish you the best of luck.

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@mrmeeseeks absolutely. In my practice I won’t prescribe drugs until I see how someone eats and lives. These are factors that matter so much and get ignored constantly

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@unreal24278 honestly man I just always used test and eq and tren. Pre contest masteron. Didn’t mess with orals ever. So this time I figured I’d give it a go :slight_smile:

I’m actually looking to emigrate to the USA soon. Reading all this seems like a nightmare with docs. Since my TRT is self-prescribed, I can see this being quite an issue when I get there.

SB

There are a lot of good domestic sources and you can always order from overseas pharmacies but yes there is always a risk of law enforcement and/or loss of funds

@physioLojik Hey, so I have a question that’s been rattling around in my head for a while and I can’t figure it out. In rat studies, doses of androgens (specifically nandrolone and test) have been found to cause significant harmful effects to the heart and human equivalent doses that equate to relatively light amounts over short periods of time.

“THE EFFECTS OF HIGH DOSES OF NANDROLONE DECANOATE ON CARDIAC MUSCLE TISSUE” took rats and gave them nandrolone at a dose of 20mg/kg 1x/wk. For a male weighing 100kg this should equate to roughly (20*100/6.2)=322mg/week and it caused significant alterations in heart structure in a short period of time (4 weeks). However, the study “Nandrolone and resistance training induce heart remodelling” states that 8mg/kg/day is equivalent to humans using 600mg/wk., this doesn’t add up if I do the math unless the athlete was to weigh. If that was the case then the HED would be around 1500mg/week, I have trouble believing 322mg/week causes significant heart alterations, especially over such short periods of time however I could be very wrong.

“Supra-physiological dose of testosterone induces pathological cardiac hypertrophy.” Doses of test as low as 5mg/kg produced cardiac hypertrophy in as little as 4 weeks… HED would be like 80mg for a 100kg male, so if this equates to humans then florp…

I’m aware rats have similar heart structure and function to humans, hence why they are used in these studies, however I somehow have trouble believing these results could possibly relate to humans, especially given the duration in which the damage happens in, androgens in excessive doses probably do damage the heart and possibly other organs (1500mg of deca for instance), however if these results related to humans then practically every bodybuilder would be dropping dead after 1-2 cycles… Yet we aren’t seeing recreational steroid users dropping dead like flies as these studies would suggest. Data in humans is also conflicting as to whether AAS cause clinically significant heart impairment.

Another thing that made me think something was off was the fact that tren was found to be less harmful on cardiac function than test in one study… there’s no waaaaaaaaaaay that’s true. Also if you don’t feel comfortable answering this question due to possibly conflicting opinions to the answer that’s fine. there’s probably no exact answer to this question as there are so many variables. Sorry for the long question, just been thinking about it for a while.

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@unreal24278 yes I’ve seen these studies. The rat model studies are flawed when related to humans for so many reasons. We have differing metabolic pathways and elimination pathways then our rodent friends. Also, our diets are varied and allow the introduction of antioxidants in our bodies which actually take care of a great many negative effects discussed in this study. It sucks when drugs are illegal/restricted so they aren’t studied well. I have seen bodybuilders as patients for years and I can tell you that there is no more cardiac risk as long as you maintain good health practices and cycle intelligently. Oh and tren being less harmful then test. Jeez haha.

I’m so glad you returned to posting. @unreal24278

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Thanks for the response, I appreciate it.

In Queensland and the Northern Territory anabolic steroids have been reclassified as the American equivalent of a Schedule I drug, therefore anabolic steroids in those two states are lumped in with Heroin, Crack, Methamphetamine (desoxyn isn’t available as a prescription drug here) and others. Mere possession of AAS in those two states can land an individual in jail for up to 25 years… This has not helped the public’s skewed opinion on these agents at all.

Suprisingly, nandrolone decanoate is still manufactured here in it’s branded (non generic form), however the said product manufactured comes in a very low concentration of 50mg/ml, that’s because the prescribing guidelines here state for 25-100mg given every 3-4 weeks. I find these guidelines strange as I don’t think it’d be very effective in combating wasting in men but I could be wrong (not bashing medicine just giving my opinion). I believe nandrolone can still be manufactured via compounding pharmacies in generic form with concentrations of up to 200mg/ml in the US but is not available in branded forum however I could be wrong.

(Ahh derp I made a mistake. All steroids except methylepitiostanol, methylstenbolone and 7a-methyl 19 nor androstenediol) the last one is a PH to trestolone, but they aren’t registered as controlled substances here yet and are therefore still sold on eBay and whatnot)

Definitely. I learned the hard way that I need to be WAY more cautious of what supplements I am taking.

I generally try and keep my broccoli intake high, but backed off when I realized I had crashed my e2.

E2 is perfect again, so ill slowly introduce some broccoli back into the diet, to keep it in a healthy range.

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So today was interesting…we have a pretty epic amusement park in Ohio - cedar point - apparently the best roller coasters in the world. We went up with our kiddos for my daughters bday and long story short I was unable to ride rides due to my inability to be latched in safely due to my size haha. Perhaps it’s time to chill out on this cycle haha. :slight_smile:

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What? No 300 lbs Seats? :joy:

What about all the morbidly obese people running around? No accommodations for them?

Yes they’re is an aisle on every coaster for bigger people but mine ws chest and back size in addition to glutes edit

That friggin’ gluten…it’ll get ya! haha

Edit: Realized you may have meant glutton and erased it because I didn’t want to come off as an ass, my bad!